provo

I suppose DavidM, or Peter from APS may be best able to answer this one.

I took a 1999 model R34 GTR V-spec which had about 15,500km on the clock for a drive yesterday. This was my first go behind the wheel of a GTR. All I can say is AWESOME CAR! It was a beast. The acceleration from a standing start was in-line with the Zed up to about 3500RPM (I didn't do the 6,000RPM and side-step the clutch - more like about 2,000-2,500). After 3,500 the thing just took off. A Best Motoring DVD I have, said that the driving position in the Zed was modelled on that of the GTR - this was certainly true - your view of the road was almost identical (eye height, aspect of bonnet etc). The GTR had noticeably harder suspension than the Zed though.

Anyway, enough prattling on. I was wondering if the APS 350Z TT has a similar push in the back feeling (??oomph factor) when compared with the R34 GTR. The Zed's looks and the GTR's monster power would be the perfect combination. I don't know if DavidM or Peter have driven the R34 but your thoughts (or anyone else's) would be welcome.

DavidM

If we're talking about a stock R34 GTR, then the APS 350Z-TT will be a lot quicker. The APS 350Z-TT has straightline performance of something like a 996 TT (or very close to it).

GTR is more in-line with a 911 .... though there are some models (spec N?) that are even quicker, but still no 911 TT. I can dig up some 'independently lcokced' numbers if you like ... let me know.

ps. If the R34 GTR is modified that I can't comment on it as it depends on the mods. And mods on an R34 GTR can turn int into a quickest accelerating car in the world ... afetrall, I think that the 0-300kph record is held by a (highly) tunned R34 GTR.

provo

Cheers David,

Thanks for the prompt reply.

I think the car may have had a modified exhaust and possibly a chip/software mod - the guy who owns it said the speed limiter had been removed.

Your answer was what I'd hoped - APS TT is the way to go

ypwpat

Hello neil.
Are you going to get APS TT soon? or will you wait till the Factory Warranty finishes?

Cheers

Z350Lover

iTrader: (2)

R34 GTR is still the king of the road in my mind, especially when it can be tuned up to 400HP+ easily... and Provo, I think a GTR with an exhaust and the computer mods (already boosted up most likely because GTR standard motor can take 1.2 bar without any long term reliability problem) will easily achieve 400HP (since the standard motor has more than 320HP)....

We need more power on the zed for sure to match even the standard GTR performance and I think most probably all the board members here in australia will eventually get a TT setup from APS.... it is just too irresistable!!!

cheers,

richie

ZEXC-33

from what i can c the APS kit in retail form is running low boost, around 6-7psi, so i doubt u will get that same on/off turbo characteristic as the GTR. Itd b a more constant pull across the entire rev range, rather than a small rpm range with considerable peak, u can tell this by the dyno power readout. In most cases of euro turbo applications, its the better engineered way to go, on/off turbos r 80s tech. Get behind the wheel of something like an S4 to really appreciate what its like to have two small turbos running low psi and peak torque at only 1900rpm, in gear acceleration belies the on paper specs

Rich is right tho, u couldnt run the same amount of boost as a GTR can with the stock internals. Nething more than 10psi and a heavy foot and ud blow a rod in no time

provo

G'Day Yun and Richie,

Good to hear from you.

I'm not too fussed about the warranty side of things. Nissan doesn't seem to be very helpful in dealing with our complaints in any case (I'm sure Monsieur Frosty would agree with me ) even when they are not associated with mod's - so it's not a great warranty in the first place.

The APS kit is still not finalised for release in Oz yet AFAIK - they have to make sure it is ADR compliant - DavidC will be the first Oz install I think, and if Peter/APS gives the go ahead for others I'll put my hand up.

The GTR was really impressive, but looking back at my Zed parked on the driveway, its looks alone made me want to keep it. Just keep the fingers crossed that APS releases their kit soon

Cheers,

Neil

zuff

I'm still tossing up whether to go APS... in part it's because I'd have to go to Melb to get the install done. In part would be the lack of support up here in Sydney (sorry but assembly line tuners aren't my cup of tea).

If Peter at APS showed a will to really support us nationaly i'll most probably go for it and replace the internals to run 12-16psi.

I'm yet to find a car that looks this good with the kind of potential this v6 has. In short appart from the GTR nspec I think the std gtr is over-rated. It's become urban legend status!

KY350

The standard GTR is very quick, but no rocket. Just an exhaust and chip (ie about $4K tuned) make the GTR a road monster with approx 270 - 280kW to the wheels. Most GTR owners perform these cheap and simple mods and the general public try to race these beast, only to be blown away. Of course, the general public don't know a modded GTR from a standard one and that's how the "urban legend" of a standard GTR developed.

From what I understand the APS TT will be also be about 270 - 280kW at the wheels. This alone won't allow it to keep up with a modded GTR as the mods for the GTR give it a little more power down low and heaps of power up top. Anyway, from a standstill start the GTR will rape a TT Z and its game over. The only chance a TT Z will have against a modded GTR will be from a rolling start and I suspect that the Z broader torque will be quickly overcome once the GTR revs past the Z's redline and on to 8500 rpm.

That said, the APS Z should be bloody quick though and will take a lot of other drivers by surprise - DavidC just be sure to look in the rearview mirror at the looks on the faces of EVO / STi / 911 etc drivers as you spray them with road grime!

zuff

I don't agree!

If both cars had 280rwkw the 350z would be in the power band quicker and longer than the GTR... the only problem will be the lack of 4WD and electronic torque management that makes the GTR use full power at all times.

The 350z will act much like a 911TT so if the launch was handled correctly could probably equal a GTR under the right circumstances.

Again this is about 1/4mile and not a comparative track time. Two very different tests...the later being the more relevant imho.

DavidM

Wheels mag tested a 'mildly tuned' R34 GTR V-spec II N1 about a year and a half ago. It had exhaust and breathing mods, and was running 15.5psi (1.07bar) of boost. Not sure how much power it really had, but the mag said that it "easly trumps the 206kW factory flywheel figures at the wheels...". In the same test they had a 966 TT, SL55 AMG and a Viper (among other cars). Here are the numbers they clocked:

R34 GTR (with mild mods):
- 0-60kph = 2.1sec
- 0-100kph = 4.5sec
- 0-160kph = 10.2sec
- 0-200kph = 15.9sec
- 400m = 12.7 @ 180kph
- 1000m = 23.1 @ 229kph

SL55 AMG :
- 0-60kph = 2.4sec
- 0-100kph = 4.8sec
- 0-160kph = 10.2sec
- 0-200kph = 16.0sec
- 400m = 12.9 @ 181kph
- 1000m = 23.2 @ 234kph

996 TT:
- 0-60kph = 2.0sec
- 0-100kph = 4.1sec
- 0-160kph = 9.0sec
- 0-200kph = 14.1sec
- 400m = 12.3 @ 186kph
- 1000m = 22.3 @ 240kph

Viper RT/10:
- 0-60kph = 2.3sec
- 0-100kph = 4.3sec
- 0-160kph = 9.1sec
- 0-200kph = 13.8sec
- 400m = 12.4 @ 188kph
- 1000m = 22.3 @ 240kph

ZEXC-33

wow a 2 tonne auto Merc runs down a race spec, stripped out and modded skyline

By 1000m the SL55 is pulling a higher trap speed, indicating the GTRs comparable times r a result of the lighter weight and 4wd launch off the line. Past 200 and the SL55 would start pulling away quite quickly

In an old Wheels test with a GTS Coupe, a stock NI GTR was putting out 240kw at the wheels, so with 4wd drivetrain losses, theyre putting out more than 300kw at the engine

Good job for a stock 911 turbo running only 11.7 psi to smoke it too

APS' site mentions theyre development car has recored an 11.97 with a higher trap speed of 186km/h. So thereotically the GTR will launch harder off the line than the rwd Z, but the Z has sooo much more power that it overcomes this time lost and runs it down by 400m. The gap will just widen the further distance they run.

I guess its up to the owner whether they prefer that impressive 4wd launch or a torquer quicker rwd. Personally i think this talk is all academic, ud never do this on the road, so id prob go with the Z. Its still a unique car, unlike a skyline thats been done by every p-plater from Coburg

DavidM

By 1000m the SL55 is pulling a higher trap speed, indicating the GTRs comparable times r a result of the lighter weight and 4wd launch off the line. Past 200 and the SL55 would start pulling away quite quickly

Yep, that's a fair asssesment. The GTR beat the SL55 to 400m by ~10m, but by 1000m mark the SL55 has cut it down to 6.5m. May not sound like much, but if the two 'gap' stayed 'constant', then the it distance between the twocars would have grown to 13m. So in a way, the SL55 has halfed the defit it carried over 400m line.

In an old Wheels test with a GTS Coupe, a stock NI GTR was putting out 240kw at the wheels, so with 4wd drivetrain losses, theyre putting out more than 300kw at the engine

That's right. They put the two cars on the dyno and there was only about 10 - 20kW between the 2 cars.

APS

Provo an interesting question and I don't claim to know the answer as I have only ever driven one R34 GTR and is was fairly stock so the performance was what you would expect from a stockish GTR.............good without being stunning though a really great car.

Jusy a liitle info I have run my own TT Z at 10 psi for a while (on 98 octane fuel) and the engine is reliable so far and it does look promising.......though a good set of billet con rods would be a worth while investment if the long term plan was to utilise a high boost strategy.

The APS TT system at 10 psi turbo pressure is really awesome (over 300 RWkW's) though the clutch is starting to feel the strain so I would consider a clutch upgrade mandatory if you really wanted this level of power.

I believe that at 10 psi turbo pressure it would take an awesome super car (maybe a 996 TT Porsche) to give the APS TT 350 Z a good run for the money.

Peter

APS

ZEXC-33

APS as some1 tossing up bw an APS TT Z or a used S4, whats the max boost u can run w/out having to touch internals or the 'box?

Also, ne plans on taking the car to Calder one Fri nite?

APS

Gee totally different cars you're looking to purchase..............I really like the S4.............owned one for 12 months a really good every car with lots of potential.

I believe that 9 to 10 psi is possible without having to upgrade the engine in any way (running on 98 octane) though we intend keeping the pressure to around 7 to 8 psi for OZ spec cars to leave a good safety margin as production engine parts can vary in strength to some degree.

I believe that the clutch will be the first drive train component to feel the strain so this in itself will help to protect the trans...............I don't know of any gear box problems in terms of strength though this will also depend on the application and how the box is treated............you can damage any box if you try hard enough.

No plans for calder at the moment as we are still busy testing the TT system and developing other performance parts and I'm also waiting on a new twin plate upgraded cluth package before giving the car a good run.

I have run the car previously over the 1/4 mile and ran an 11.97 pass though to be frank the clutch was not happy with the big launches.

Peter

APS

ZEXC-33

ive heard the S4's r easy to mod, and im considering it bcoz of that, basically i want a turbo car that is a cut above the wallpaper classless wrxs and skylines.

apparently the easiest mod is an ECU with huge gains. But id like to fit a front mount cooler, exhaust and BMC CDA then do the remapping.

By the time the turbo kit is fitted to the Z, itd b pushing more than 75K, which is bang on what a good low kay S4 is worth after mods, hence the cross shopping

APS

Yeah I see what you mean in regards to the cost factor though I believe that the TT Z is a much quicker and a more exciting car to drive (the S4 is a little dull and better suited to the pensioner age group ) than a modded S4 due to the increased weight of the S4..............I guess it really comes down to how many doors you need.

Peter

ZEXC-33

well im only 22 so i dont really need 4 doors, just the S4 is tempting bcoz its a european car. Ive just sold my Z4 3.0L and have my 156 for sale now too as i want to buy just the one car. No1 in my family has ever owned a Japanese car, so its going to take a bit of convincing to buy a Z.

I was originally planning on buying a used 156GTA, seemed like the default upgrade, but having driven other cars (R32, S4, Sti, Liberty GT) i now dont want to spend 70odd K on another front wheeler. Id rather buy something rwd or 4wd to have fun with and then get back into an Alfa when the new twin turbo 4WD GTA's r released.

I dont want to get stuck with two insurances and regos again (plus theres no room here with dads cars and bikes), so im waiting till i sell my 156, then ill decide what to buy. Atm just doing my research

APS

Well if your only 22 don't even consider the S4............you need to be at least 45 years old to drive a car which is that conservative ...........a TT 350 Z is a real drivers car and will put a smile on your face every drive, I promise.

Peter