First Track Day/ HPDE FAQ
08-01-2009, 05:46 PM
#21
350Z-holic
Thread Starter
common courtesy and proper track etiquette
Dave's Top 10 !!!
Things to ALWAYS do at a driver's school
(a.k.a. common courtesy and proper track etiquette)
contributed by Schwer Hund
Things to ALWAYS do at a driver's school
(a.k.a. common courtesy and proper track etiquette)
contributed by Schwer Hund
- Say thank you when you borrow tools. Don't make the owner come searching for them. If you need a tool and someone is gracious enough to loan it, TAKE IT BACK! Don't leave it out in the weather, put it in your toolbox or let someone else borrow it without the owner's approval. It should go without saying but here's a reminder anyway, be sure to say "thank you" (and please wouldn't hurt either).
- Refrain from playing loud music. (Or any music for that matter)The track is a loud enough environment and we don't come there to hear music from any other source than the singing tires and pounding pistons. The variety of folks there means that someone is not going to like the music, regardless of style.
- Restrain your pets. Probably not a big issue since most tracks have banned them, but it's worth a reminder. Also don't let your small children play out of your sight, particularly on bikes, skateboards and scooters. Kids will be kids so watch them carefully.
- Think before you take a pit space. It may be saved for someone else. It's pretty obvious when folks are saving space for others. There is plenty to go around, why not let them park together?
- Watch your speed though the paddock, especially if you're bedding in new brakes. If you want to drive around slowly and cool off the car fine, but 40 mph followed by hard stops is best done on one of the service roads, not the paddock.
- Let your instructor or student know what to expect. If you're a student and you want to leave early (or vice versa, an instructor) let the other know so they can not waste time looking for you and either get another student (or instructor). Also, it's probably a good idea to meet at the same location all weekend long so people aren't kept waiting.
- Watch your language and volume. You never know who might be listening.
- Give slower drivers some room. If you're faster it will become apparent and you'll find a passing zone pretty soon. If you don't know the other driver and their habits you could "spook" them into driving their mirrors, a sure way to throw them off line and maybe have them spin right in front of you. If they give you a little wave, they know you're there and will let you around at the first opportunity, so give them some breathing room
- Remember you are a guest. If you BMW (*****, moan and whine) about the track or local chapter's rules, you ruin it for everyone. It's their event, they've put out the effort to organize it and are liable if anything goes wrong. Sure some of the rules may be a little arbitrary, but as long as they are enforced equally and everyone plays by them, just go along with the program and have a good time.
- And the number one thing to remember at the track:
When you give a passing signal, don't drag race the other car into the braking zone. Once they have proven they are faster than you in the turns (they caught you didn't they?) wait until you're in the passing zone, look in your mirror, give the signal, wait until they pull out, then "breathe" off the throttle. You probably don't have to lift dramatically, unless they have a low horsepower car with superior handling. In the faster groups, it's obvious when someone gives you some help.
08-01-2009, 05:50 PM
#22
350Z-holic
Thread Starter
What brakes should I run?
This is a great resource about the various pds and such for 350Z's
https://my350z.com/forum/autocross-r...-database.html
https://my350z.com/forum/autocross-r...-database.html
08-01-2009, 07:36 PM
#23
350Z-holic
Thread Starter
What is Heel and Toe and how is it done?
What is a "heel-toe" downshift?
"Heel-toeing" is the commonly-used term for matching the speed of the engine to that of the transmission when downshifting.
For example, let's assume that you're in 4th gear at 3,500 RPM and going 60 MPH. Now you want to downshift to 3rd gear. 3rd gear at 60 MPH is probably about 4,500 or 5,000 RPM (these numbers are theoretical). Therefore, in order to make the shift as smooth as possible, you need to "blip" the throttle to 5,000+ RPM right before you engage the clutch in 3rd.
Done properly, this minimizes the weight transfer from the rear to the front of the vehicle since the shift is less abrupt, minimizes driveline strain, maximizes rear wheel grip since the tires don't get a sudden speed change, and minimizes wear on the clutch since the clutch and flywheel are spinning at closer to the same speed. Of course, the laws of physics still apply - don't try popping the clutch into 2nd at 90 MPH, even if the engine "will" rev to 15,000.
Heel-toe downshifting is a bit tricky to master, but once you've practiced for a while and got the hang of it, you'll never go back to "ordinary" downshifts. The difficulty of a heel-toe downshift stems from the fact that your right foot is probably busy with the brake pedal at the time of the downshift (you were probably doing 80 MPH in 4th when you started braking and it wasn't until you got down to 60 MPH that you were ready to downshift). Since your left foot is operating the clutch and your right foot is operating the brake - you're out of feet! Therefore, your right foot must do double duty, with part of it used on the brake and part available to "blip" the throttle. This can be envisioned as having the ball of your foot on the brake pedal and your heel on the gas, thus the term "heel-toe." However, unless you're inordinately flexible or double-jointed in the ankle, it is more likely that you would use the ball of your foot on the right side of the brake pedal and then use the right arch of your foot on the gas, as you roll your foot downwards and to the right.
The sequence for a proper heel-toe downshift is as follows:
A few tips to keep in mind as you practice the above procedure:
Practice the "blip" portion of the procedure without the braking at first. Simply come off the gas to slow the car down a bit, then put in the clutch pedal, blip the throttle as you downshift, then quickly re-engage the clutch. This will help you learn the right amount of "blip" and help you with the timing. This is also a good procedure to use when you're cruising at low RPMs at want to downshift before accelerating.
•Initially, you will probably have trouble keeping even pressure on the brake pedal. Many drivers end up applying too much pressure to the brake pedal as they "blip." Make sure you practice this when you're not being closely followed.
•Make sure you let out the clutch pedal quickly and completely at the end of the sequence. You can "cheat" by letting it out slowly, but this causes more wear on the clutch and can somewhat cover up the fact that you didn't time the RPMs just right on the downshift.
•Don't feel bad if it takes you a while to get the hang of it. After repeated practice, you'll be downshifting like a pro!
Some bits of wisdom posted by others:
[quote]
Good videos:
Mark Skaife (Aussie V8's)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUXLTjDVgWc
Mark Skaife #2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Dv3whihq8I
Mark Skaife #3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdWSy...eature=related
Unknown Guy with old skool Pumas
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR3LOl19G70
Ayrton Senna in loafers!! FTW!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8-zbfdPfRg
"Heel-toeing" is the commonly-used term for matching the speed of the engine to that of the transmission when downshifting.
For example, let's assume that you're in 4th gear at 3,500 RPM and going 60 MPH. Now you want to downshift to 3rd gear. 3rd gear at 60 MPH is probably about 4,500 or 5,000 RPM (these numbers are theoretical). Therefore, in order to make the shift as smooth as possible, you need to "blip" the throttle to 5,000+ RPM right before you engage the clutch in 3rd.
Done properly, this minimizes the weight transfer from the rear to the front of the vehicle since the shift is less abrupt, minimizes driveline strain, maximizes rear wheel grip since the tires don't get a sudden speed change, and minimizes wear on the clutch since the clutch and flywheel are spinning at closer to the same speed. Of course, the laws of physics still apply - don't try popping the clutch into 2nd at 90 MPH, even if the engine "will" rev to 15,000.
Heel-toe downshifting is a bit tricky to master, but once you've practiced for a while and got the hang of it, you'll never go back to "ordinary" downshifts. The difficulty of a heel-toe downshift stems from the fact that your right foot is probably busy with the brake pedal at the time of the downshift (you were probably doing 80 MPH in 4th when you started braking and it wasn't until you got down to 60 MPH that you were ready to downshift). Since your left foot is operating the clutch and your right foot is operating the brake - you're out of feet! Therefore, your right foot must do double duty, with part of it used on the brake and part available to "blip" the throttle. This can be envisioned as having the ball of your foot on the brake pedal and your heel on the gas, thus the term "heel-toe." However, unless you're inordinately flexible or double-jointed in the ankle, it is more likely that you would use the ball of your foot on the right side of the brake pedal and then use the right arch of your foot on the gas, as you roll your foot downwards and to the right.
The sequence for a proper heel-toe downshift is as follows:
- Apply the brake with the ball of your right foot.
- Depress the clutch pedal with your left foot.
- Place your hand on the gear lever.
- Rotate your right heel counter-clockwise by pushing your heel away from the brake pedal.
- Move the gear selector into the lower gear.
- "blip" the throttle with the right edge of your right foot by rolling your foot down and to the right, while still applying even pressure to the brake pedal.
- At the same as the throttle blip, Release the clutch pedal.
A few tips to keep in mind as you practice the above procedure:
Practice the "blip" portion of the procedure without the braking at first. Simply come off the gas to slow the car down a bit, then put in the clutch pedal, blip the throttle as you downshift, then quickly re-engage the clutch. This will help you learn the right amount of "blip" and help you with the timing. This is also a good procedure to use when you're cruising at low RPMs at want to downshift before accelerating.
•Initially, you will probably have trouble keeping even pressure on the brake pedal. Many drivers end up applying too much pressure to the brake pedal as they "blip." Make sure you practice this when you're not being closely followed.
•Make sure you let out the clutch pedal quickly and completely at the end of the sequence. You can "cheat" by letting it out slowly, but this causes more wear on the clutch and can somewhat cover up the fact that you didn't time the RPMs just right on the downshift.
•Don't feel bad if it takes you a while to get the hang of it. After repeated practice, you'll be downshifting like a pro!
Some bits of wisdom posted by others:
Practice with the car off in the drive way or garage. This will help find the pivot point for your foot for your particular car. If you can identify that and know the place where your heel can stay stationary (if possible) and just move the ball of your foot over then things will be easier and smoother.
Absolutely practice on the street for a long time. Sitting at a stoplight? Let the right side of your foot wander onto the gas and explore the gas pedal. Try to sustain 2k RPM. Try a blip to 3k. Push hard on the brake (track force) and try to get the sensitivity developed in your foot and ankle.
Coming to a stop from 60 MPH? Downshift into every gear including first. Making a slow stop? Just practice rev match only, no brake. The goal is to never ever let the car determine the engine's speed when decelerating.
Coming to a stop from 60 MPH? Downshift into every gear including first. Making a slow stop? Just practice rev match only, no brake. The goal is to never ever let the car determine the engine's speed when decelerating.
1. Get an idea of the basic mechanics of the technique in your garage. The car doesn't even need to be running to get a feel for how your foot likes to be arranged to start doing this.
2. Practice it with a running, parked car. This way you can hear the amount of RPMs you're adding. It might even be helpful to have someone look at your feet, to see if you're changing the amount of braking you're doing while giving the throttle a blip. This is a very common problem, and one of the most difficult parts of the technique to master.
3. Now, practice it on the street. I've held for years that heel-toe needs to be a HABIT before it becomes an effective tool for going faster. Also, I maintain that if you can do it successfully driving around town, doing it in a competition setting is a whole lot easier. On a track, since you're (presumably) braking very hard, a slight over- or under-rev blip will hardly be noticable. However, since you've been practicing it on the street, it's also very unlikely to happen. Because you're actually good at it.
2. Practice it with a running, parked car. This way you can hear the amount of RPMs you're adding. It might even be helpful to have someone look at your feet, to see if you're changing the amount of braking you're doing while giving the throttle a blip. This is a very common problem, and one of the most difficult parts of the technique to master.
3. Now, practice it on the street. I've held for years that heel-toe needs to be a HABIT before it becomes an effective tool for going faster. Also, I maintain that if you can do it successfully driving around town, doing it in a competition setting is a whole lot easier. On a track, since you're (presumably) braking very hard, a slight over- or under-rev blip will hardly be noticable. However, since you've been practicing it on the street, it's also very unlikely to happen. Because you're actually good at it.
[quote]
Good videos:
Mark Skaife (Aussie V8's)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUXLTjDVgWc
Mark Skaife #2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Dv3whihq8I
Mark Skaife #3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdWSy...eature=related
Unknown Guy with old skool Pumas
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR3LOl19G70
Ayrton Senna in loafers!! FTW!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8-zbfdPfRg
08-19-2009, 05:13 AM
#24
350Z-holic
Thread Starter
What things can I practice every day?
Upshifting
Upshifting should be done smoothly. Speedshifting will shorten the gearbox life. The only time to force an upshift is in a side by side race to the next corner, for position, which doesn't happen in a HPDE. Listen to the in-car shifts of professional racers on TV, and they rarely bang shifts. Upshifts are done quickly and smoothly, but are not forced. If you want your gearbox to have a long, happy life, feel the gears, the changes should fall in, without being forced.
Downshifting
The first thing to understand is the purpose of the downshift. It is not to slow the car, that is the job of the brakes. The purpose of downshifting is to have the car in the correct gear to accelerate through and out of the corner.
The downshift should be done after the RPM’s have dropped, but must be complete before you begin the turn-in. Downshifting too early can over-rev the motor, waiting too long means you will be rolling the car through the corner entry, giving up the ability to use the throttle to balance the car. A good practice ti to learn the downshift points of the car, do it smoothly, and feel how the chassis reacts at different shift points.
Heel toe:
here's a whole section on that
Steering:
Work on smooth constant inputs. Place your hands at 10 & 2 o’clock positions with your elbows slightly bent. steer by pulling DOWN, not pushing UP on the steering wheel. NO one-handed driving – only time with one hand on wheel is during shifting. Learn about Shuffle steering when it is appropriate yo use it. work on one, smooth continuous movement. Don’t yank or jerk the wheel. Ramp up your steering input speeds for tight corners vs sudden jerk.
Braking:
work on SQUEEZING the brake pedal, don’t “pound” it. Apply brakes SMOOTHLY and progressively, as if there was an egg on the pedal.
Left foot braking:
Your left foot is used to fairly robust uncontrolled stabs up and down on the clutch. Braking needs a little more delicacy.
Learning process
At first try to use the left foot on the brake on medium-fast straight roads (with no traffic). You find you’ll brake a bit harshly (which is fine). But you’ll find you forget to release your foot off the brake, so the brake pressure continues and the car decelerates even more. The first trick is to train your foot to lift off gently to release the braking pressure. From there build up the initial pressure to train your foot to press down in a controlled manner, while still also controlling the lift off. Now try this into faster corners where no gear change is needed. Try bringing the car to a total halt from low speed, you’ll now find this Keep on pressing reflex is more noticeable. When you normally (Right foot) brake a car to halt, unconsciously you release braking pressure as the car comes to a halt, to the point where just as the car stops you’ve release almost al the pressure. With this lack of subconscious control in your left foot the car stops abruptly usually by nose diving and smashing your face into the steering wheel… again repeated practice releasing the pressure with the left foot before stopping give the foot the control it needs for more complex manoeuvres. To make use of the left foot braking you need also to control the throttle at the same time. Slip the car into neutral left foot brake and blip the throttle repeatedly to get the feel. Once comfortable, try applying pressure to the throttle while left foot braking, to feel the effect.
NOTE: Always try this away from other traffic or in your driveway, as sometimes you forget which pedal to push, with rear ending consequences.
Upshifting should be done smoothly. Speedshifting will shorten the gearbox life. The only time to force an upshift is in a side by side race to the next corner, for position, which doesn't happen in a HPDE. Listen to the in-car shifts of professional racers on TV, and they rarely bang shifts. Upshifts are done quickly and smoothly, but are not forced. If you want your gearbox to have a long, happy life, feel the gears, the changes should fall in, without being forced.
Downshifting
The first thing to understand is the purpose of the downshift. It is not to slow the car, that is the job of the brakes. The purpose of downshifting is to have the car in the correct gear to accelerate through and out of the corner.
The downshift should be done after the RPM’s have dropped, but must be complete before you begin the turn-in. Downshifting too early can over-rev the motor, waiting too long means you will be rolling the car through the corner entry, giving up the ability to use the throttle to balance the car. A good practice ti to learn the downshift points of the car, do it smoothly, and feel how the chassis reacts at different shift points.
Heel toe:
here's a whole section on that
Steering:
Work on smooth constant inputs. Place your hands at 10 & 2 o’clock positions with your elbows slightly bent. steer by pulling DOWN, not pushing UP on the steering wheel. NO one-handed driving – only time with one hand on wheel is during shifting. Learn about Shuffle steering when it is appropriate yo use it. work on one, smooth continuous movement. Don’t yank or jerk the wheel. Ramp up your steering input speeds for tight corners vs sudden jerk.
Braking:
work on SQUEEZING the brake pedal, don’t “pound” it. Apply brakes SMOOTHLY and progressively, as if there was an egg on the pedal.
Left foot braking:
Your left foot is used to fairly robust uncontrolled stabs up and down on the clutch. Braking needs a little more delicacy.
Learning process
At first try to use the left foot on the brake on medium-fast straight roads (with no traffic). You find you’ll brake a bit harshly (which is fine). But you’ll find you forget to release your foot off the brake, so the brake pressure continues and the car decelerates even more. The first trick is to train your foot to lift off gently to release the braking pressure. From there build up the initial pressure to train your foot to press down in a controlled manner, while still also controlling the lift off. Now try this into faster corners where no gear change is needed. Try bringing the car to a total halt from low speed, you’ll now find this Keep on pressing reflex is more noticeable. When you normally (Right foot) brake a car to halt, unconsciously you release braking pressure as the car comes to a halt, to the point where just as the car stops you’ve release almost al the pressure. With this lack of subconscious control in your left foot the car stops abruptly usually by nose diving and smashing your face into the steering wheel… again repeated practice releasing the pressure with the left foot before stopping give the foot the control it needs for more complex manoeuvres. To make use of the left foot braking you need also to control the throttle at the same time. Slip the car into neutral left foot brake and blip the throttle repeatedly to get the feel. Once comfortable, try applying pressure to the throttle while left foot braking, to feel the effect.
NOTE: Always try this away from other traffic or in your driveway, as sometimes you forget which pedal to push, with rear ending consequences.
08-19-2009, 05:25 AM
#25
350Z-holic
Thread Starter
What Modifications do I need to do to do a school?
Many times I have heard "I would love to do a school, but I’m waiting to get a blower, springs, shocks, and ad infiintem, first?"
Remember, as stated above, High Performance Driving schools are not hardware dependent. You generally want to start out with a stock type car on street tires and learn to drive the thing first. Them make objective decisions about where any weaknesses my lie. Most cars need money spent on brakes and cooling systems before adding horsepower. First usually come tire and shock upgrades. Dollars spend on driving school will pay divedends long into the future and allow you to enjoy the capabilities of what you have now. If there are safety issues, by all means, be sure they are corrected before you drive on track.
I have also heard many people say they don't have the funds to do a HPDE ($300), but then spend $2K on performance mods. The best time and money spend is seat time. Is it worth spending money on performance parts when you haven't learned what the car can do on it's own first? Or better yet, what you know?
Remember, as stated above, High Performance Driving schools are not hardware dependent. You generally want to start out with a stock type car on street tires and learn to drive the thing first. Them make objective decisions about where any weaknesses my lie. Most cars need money spent on brakes and cooling systems before adding horsepower. First usually come tire and shock upgrades. Dollars spend on driving school will pay divedends long into the future and allow you to enjoy the capabilities of what you have now. If there are safety issues, by all means, be sure they are corrected before you drive on track.
I have also heard many people say they don't have the funds to do a HPDE ($300), but then spend $2K on performance mods. The best time and money spend is seat time. Is it worth spending money on performance parts when you haven't learned what the car can do on it's own first? Or better yet, what you know?
09-24-2009, 06:39 AM
#26
350Z-holic
Thread Starter
Seats and Harness Bar rules and specs.
Great thread on Harness Bar and seat rules for various organizations:
https://my350z.com/forum/autocross-r...ness-rule.html
https://my350z.com/forum/autocross-r...ness-rule.html
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