DRAG RACE FORUM: Listen up..
11-07-2007, 12:25 PM
#81
You guys forgot about Tywinter.. He ran a 13.7 on street tires that evening aswell. Yes, the ones on slicks will and SHOULD run better. But i think it comes down to me and TY being use to running on a track that is not prepped all that well. Most of you guys that were at Mason Dixon are used to a better prepped track.
Todd
Todd
11-07-2007, 12:26 PM
#82
Originally Posted by dutchboy350Z
Alberto I do think you're forgetting one thing. You were running on ET Streets, Todd was on slicks and Dan was on some form of a drag radial.
The rest of us where running on street tires. I remember talking to Louie at the track that day and he was commenting on the track not being very well prepped at all. I think there were some cars running that were losing traction in third (The black vortech G comes to mind, trapping 113).
My first time at a Drag strip (Capital, which appears to be much stickier) I cut a 2.15 60' not having a clue what I was doing, bone stock, and full weight.
At Mason Dixon that day my best 60' was 2.211 and that was with 20+ tries. Same street tires/wheels when I was at Capital. This time around I About 100 lbs lighter (no cats, no spare, less 1/8 gas tank) and had about 10 whp (Plenun Spacer, TPs, Y-pipe).
So I think that came into play as to why the rest of the Z guys on street tires weren't getting stellar ETs.
I know davidv wouldn't want this known, but he didn't even break into the 13s on his street setup (He just recently got a PB of 13.3). Which in turn made me feel a lot better about my times.
The rest of us where running on street tires. I remember talking to Louie at the track that day and he was commenting on the track not being very well prepped at all. I think there were some cars running that were losing traction in third (The black vortech G comes to mind, trapping 113).
My first time at a Drag strip (Capital, which appears to be much stickier) I cut a 2.15 60' not having a clue what I was doing, bone stock, and full weight.
At Mason Dixon that day my best 60' was 2.211 and that was with 20+ tries. Same street tires/wheels when I was at Capital. This time around I About 100 lbs lighter (no cats, no spare, less 1/8 gas tank) and had about 10 whp (Plenun Spacer, TPs, Y-pipe).
So I think that came into play as to why the rest of the Z guys on street tires weren't getting stellar ETs.
I know davidv wouldn't want this known, but he didn't even break into the 13s on his street setup (He just recently got a PB of 13.3). Which in turn made me feel a lot better about my times.
Mason Dixon wasnt prepped as well as Capitol and it was colder (less traction) you couldnt cope with the changes (you dont have a lot of experience-especially before the track day) and you ran worse 60ft's and worse times, simple as that. That was the main reason for you and other guys running slower-that first 60ft was KILLING them. That was the diff bewteen me, Todd, Aceman not running diff. The good thing is, you dont go around blaming the DA/temp like most of these guys do.
If we are gonna start putting notes by every time its gonna be stupid. For example:
Alberto 13.3--> Good weather, good da, bad track conditions, wind was 5mph cross wind, 12 people watching me run made me nervous, I could have shifted faster into 3rd, 3/4 tank of gas weighed me down, left floor mats in, my left nut ithced so my clutch leg was slow this run, etc etc.
Post your fawking time and leave it alone, too many variables between people, tracks and conditions to attribute most of the differences to DA!
11-07-2007, 12:36 PM
#83
Originally Posted by Alberto
How would Luie know how the track felt he didnt run his car? If your not out their its all speculation. Karl-you know I like you (not in a gay way other Z owners!) your a perfect example of an avg driver bewteen tracks.
Mason Dixon wasnt prepped as well as Capitol and it was colder (less traction) you couldnt cope with the changes (you dont have a lot of experience-especially before the track day) and you ran worse 60ft's and worse times, simple as that. That was the main reason for you and other guys running slower-that first 60ft was KILLING them. That was the diff bewteen me, Todd, Aceman not running diff. The good thing is, you dont go around blaming the DA/temp like most of these guys do.
Mason Dixon wasnt prepped as well as Capitol and it was colder (less traction) you couldnt cope with the changes (you dont have a lot of experience-especially before the track day) and you ran worse 60ft's and worse times, simple as that. That was the main reason for you and other guys running slower-that first 60ft was KILLING them. That was the diff bewteen me, Todd, Aceman not running diff. The good thing is, you dont go around blaming the DA/temp like most of these guys do.
Oh yeah the "liking me part" ... think I was going to let that slide ... homo.
Last edited by dutchboy350Z; 11-07-2007 at 12:44 PM.
11-07-2007, 12:38 PM
#85
Originally Posted by dutchboy350Z
I know davidv wouldn't want this known, but he didn't even break into the 13s on his street setup (He just recently got a PB of 13.3). Which in turn made me feel a lot better about my times.
11-07-2007, 12:41 PM
#86
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 5,998
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Alberto
Post your fawking time and leave it alone, too many variables between people, tracks and conditions to attribute most of the differences to DA!
Run for "i8acobra"
60 foot time: 1.918
1/8 Mile ET: 8.795
1/8 Mile MPH: 77.72
1/4 Mile ET: 13.766
1/4 Mile MPH: 98.31
Density Altitude: 3000'
Track Name: Las Vegas Motor Speedway
The conditions for this run were during almost perfect weather conditions for Las Vegas... Most of the time, the DA here is 4-6k'. There is not much room for driver improvement in regards for the above time. DA was pretty much the sole reason for the slow time (extremely fast for Vegas).
Just because someone uses DA as a factor for their run, doesn't mean the effect was minimal and the person is throwing it out as an excuse.
And you hit the nail on the head in an earlier post. Most driver's here don't have a clue what DA is or what it means. Which means most of the driver's here would look at the time I posted for i8acobra and assume he must suck as a driver. Because they will base their observations completely on what is contained in the Top 25 list.
11-07-2007, 12:41 PM
#87
Originally Posted by Alberto
LOL-btw I have some HILARIOUS vid of you from Saturday's party-you and that "gypsie" LMFAO....if the price is right it wont leak
Last edited by dutchboy350Z; 11-07-2007 at 12:43 PM.
11-07-2007, 12:45 PM
#88
Originally Posted by HDPD350Z
Perhaps you are correct about DA/conditions not varying the times that much when dealing with differences of say +-500' (maybe even 1000'). But there is a large number of tracks across the country that exceed that level.
Run for "i8acobra"
60 foot time: 1.918
1/8 Mile ET: 8.795
1/8 Mile MPH: 77.72
1/4 Mile ET: 13.766
1/4 Mile MPH: 98.31
Density Altitude: 3000'
Track Name: Las Vegas Motor Speedway
The conditions for this run were during almost perfect weather conditions for Las Vegas... Most of the time, the DA here is 4-6k'. There is not much room for driver improvement in regards for the above time. DA was pretty much the sole reason for the slow time (extremely fast for Vegas).
Just because someone uses DA as a factor for their run, doesn't mean the effect was minimal and the person is throwing it out as an excuse.
And you hit the nail on the head in an earlier post. Most driver's here don't have a clue what DA is or what it means. Which means most of the driver's here would look at the time I posted for i8acobra and assume he must suck as a driver. Because they will base their observations completely on what is contained in the Top 25 list.
Run for "i8acobra"
60 foot time: 1.918
1/8 Mile ET: 8.795
1/8 Mile MPH: 77.72
1/4 Mile ET: 13.766
1/4 Mile MPH: 98.31
Density Altitude: 3000'
Track Name: Las Vegas Motor Speedway
The conditions for this run were during almost perfect weather conditions for Las Vegas... Most of the time, the DA here is 4-6k'. There is not much room for driver improvement in regards for the above time. DA was pretty much the sole reason for the slow time (extremely fast for Vegas).
Just because someone uses DA as a factor for their run, doesn't mean the effect was minimal and the person is throwing it out as an excuse.
And you hit the nail on the head in an earlier post. Most driver's here don't have a clue what DA is or what it means. Which means most of the driver's here would look at the time I posted for i8acobra and assume he must suck as a driver. Because they will base their observations completely on what is contained in the Top 25 list.
There are FAST tracks in FL yet everytime somebody posts a run the cry babies post "and it was 85 degrees out btw" No $Hit, like it doesnt get hot (or hotter) in other parts of the country? They are likely the first to complain about conditions yet they have fast tracks. Not picking on anybody specifically but you know who you are
Last edited by Alberto; 11-07-2007 at 12:47 PM.
11-07-2007, 12:47 PM
#89
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 5,998
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Alberto
I agree with your post above. The last part is also true-very similar to dyno #'s war, it means nothing they are all different, yet some people believe serg's 280whp claim, those that know would crack a smile. Lets educate people instead of make excuses for why others dont get recognition. That would be the best thing to do.
11-07-2007, 12:49 PM
#90
If Todd-35zer0 want to make this a condition-we can make people submit DA with their timeslips to get verified. If they are willing to do the work-I even offer to help, we can add a column for it and start adding it from here on out.
We can easily provide a link in the first post to show them how to go about doing it, in turn the Z community gets smarter, and everybody that submits a time from now on can learn something...it will only take 1 min to figure out.
We can easily provide a link in the first post to show them how to go about doing it, in turn the Z community gets smarter, and everybody that submits a time from now on can learn something...it will only take 1 min to figure out.
11-07-2007, 12:49 PM
#91
Originally Posted by DanielW
Key to drag racing = Never Granny Shift and Always Double Clutch some bald guy taught me that
11-07-2007, 01:03 PM
#92
New Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Quad Cities
Posts: 849
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Alberto
Im sick of these guys complaining about not running 13's with DA's of "only" 2000 that is a joke.
11-07-2007, 01:06 PM
#93
Originally Posted by Alberto
If Todd-35zer0 want to make this a condition-we can make people submit DA with their timeslips to get verified. If they are willing to do the work-I even offer to help, we can add a column for it and start adding it from here on out.
We can easily provide a link in the first post to show them how to go about doing it, in turn the Z community gets smarter, and everybody that submits a time from now on can learn something...it will only take 1 min to figure out.
We can easily provide a link in the first post to show them how to go about doing it, in turn the Z community gets smarter, and everybody that submits a time from now on can learn something...it will only take 1 min to figure out.
As the list continues now, they wont even make the list if its not a good time.. Things are becoming more competive.
Create a post under the drag section with info about the day, track and conditions for all to see.
Todd
11-07-2007, 01:11 PM
#95
Retired Admin
Thread Starter
iTrader: (95)
Originally Posted by Alberto
If Todd-35zer0 want to make this a condition-we can make people submit DA with their timeslips to get verified. If they are willing to do the work-I even offer to help, we can add a column for it and start adding it from here on out.
We can easily provide a link in the first post to show them how to go about doing it, in turn the Z community gets smarter, and everybody that submits a time from now on can learn something...it will only take 1 min to figure out.
We can easily provide a link in the first post to show them how to go about doing it, in turn the Z community gets smarter, and everybody that submits a time from now on can learn something...it will only take 1 min to figure out.
Again, the point of this thread was to stop unexperienced people handing out their 2 cents as advices. The point was NOT to get into arguments about DA and how it's the mostest importantest factor.
I say we leave the list as is. The people can talk about their DA and/or conditions in their own separate thread or in a post in the top 25 list thread, if need be. I'd rather not clutter the list more than it already is now.
11-07-2007, 01:11 PM
#96
Originally Posted by aceman
You guys forgot about Tywinter.. He ran a 13.7 on street tires that evening aswell. Yes, the ones on slicks will and SHOULD run better. But i think it comes down to me and TY being use to running on a track that is not prepped all that well. Most of you guys that were at Mason Dixon are used to a better prepped track.
Todd
Todd
Last edited by davidv; 11-07-2007 at 02:44 PM.
11-07-2007, 01:42 PM
#97
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SoCal
Posts: 785
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Alberto
SergEK-this is a perfect example of a guy who would cry about his times. Why? Look at his sig...He beleives his bogus Church automotive dyno numbers. Known for very high #'s he'd go to the track run high 13's and complain about the weather. But hey-lets adjust the complete drag registry to show people that he really isnt that bad of a driver
I respect peoples opinions in here-ESPECIALLY those that run their cars. If you havent you shouldnt even post in this thread. Serg-have you even run your car?
I respect peoples opinions in here-ESPECIALLY those that run their cars. If you havent you shouldnt even post in this thread. Serg-have you even run your car?
I ran my stock EK at Capitol Raceway and ran a 16.7 bone stock....the same car at at track at 2700ft ran 17.2 .....at this track it would eventually go 14.0@98 there....or about a 13.6@101 (elevation correction only) with a 1.8L motor I/H setup that dyno'd 160whp on a local dynojet on crummy DRs
I am an import bracket class track champion at my old track that consistently see's above 4000DA for most of the year and 7-8K during the summer....I have made more than my fair share of passes with enough consistentcy to secure a championship....that was in 2002...my first full season of drag passes along with test and tune nights and club racing nights.....if you called the owners today, they would know me by the metion of my first name....very nice people
I bought the Z in Cali and havent had the time to run it....but I generally run all my cars for a full season if the opportunity presents itself
If you want to paint me as a noob to drag racing, you picked the wrong person.....I learned to drag race with practice, and advice from friends who consistently set top times for their platforms....ala a guy who went 11's in his bolt-on EVO there, went 12.2 or so in his stock turbo SRT and recently went 12.8@108 in his near stock Mazdaspeed 3
I learned alot and still try to learn everyday....but your ignorance and attitude towards DA is staggering....and then to attack me....
I am not the best but I hold my own
11-07-2007, 03:08 PM
#98
Originally Posted by SergEK
The fact you compare a hub dyno to a roller dyno is laughable and the only thing I am concerned about it the deltas....if you read my sig carefully it says hp NOT whp....if your gonna try to discredit me at least try to come up with something better than that and the fact I put DYNAPACK in my sig should tell you I have nothing to hide or prove....
I thought brake hp was used strictly by Car salemen and Mag Racers.
11-07-2007, 03:31 PM
#99
Sorry Serg-you can have all the experience you want racing Honda's, every platform is different. You not even having 1 pass down the track in your Z discredits what your saying. You dont have a baseline to compare to other slips, I can compare to stock guys, bolt-ons, Single turbo and now TT. Thats a ton of experience on this platform over you. An 1/8 time that I would argue needs improvement you may think it good because you base that off of others...
So your saying your sig states crank hp? LOL how did you get under stock? Obviously its stated as whp without you needing to write that-great mentality you have there...Im gonna write 670hp in my sig cuz thats what my car produces at the crank given my 17% factory drivetrain loss
Originally Posted by SergEK
The fact you compare a hub dyno to a roller dyno is laughable and the only thing I am concerned about it the deltas....if you read my sig carefully it says hp NOT whp....
Last edited by Alberto; 11-07-2007 at 03:36 PM.
11-07-2007, 04:44 PM
#100
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SoCal
Posts: 785
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Alberto
Sorry Serg-you can have all the experience you want racing Honda's, every platform is different. You not even having 1 pass down the track in your Z discredits what your saying. You dont have a baseline to compare to other slips, I can compare to stock guys, bolt-ons, Single turbo and now TT. Thats a ton of experience on this platform over you. An 1/8 time that I would argue needs improvement you may think it good because you base that off of others...
So your saying your sig states crank hp? LOL how did you get under stock? Obviously its stated as whp without you needing to write that-great mentality you have there...Im gonna write 670hp in my sig cuz thats what my car produces at the crank given my 17% factory drivetrain loss
So your saying your sig states crank hp? LOL how did you get under stock? Obviously its stated as whp without you needing to write that-great mentality you have there...Im gonna write 670hp in my sig cuz thats what my car produces at the crank given my 17% factory drivetrain loss
DA effects every NA car no matter the brand dude...are you that dense....does an NHRA official have to have a pass down the 1320 in a Z for him to credible too? Or does the fact he doesnt have a pass null and void a known rule aka the correction factors
Anybody who knows dynapacks or googles a dynapack can see its HUB horsepower not wheel which means it will yield about a 5% higher reading because I am not spinning a 19" wheel combo on a roller.......stating its WHEEL hp when the wheels are sitting next to the car would in fact be WRONG and saying its CRANK hp would be WRONG because its through the trans/drivshaft/diff/axles/hubs....still some drag....the missing link...the heavy *** 19" wheels...thus a slightly higher reading
My base line was 263 (249est dynojet) and my current is right about 280 (266whp est) ...does that sound HIGH for a RevUp with my mods...I dont think so but it really doesnt matter....there are tons of Z's to compare my deltas with and that matters more to me because no matter what they are rolling on when the come into Shawns everyone spins the dyno connected at the hubs....so one guy may have 17's and the other 20's but the numbers will stay consistent based on actual hub measurements vs heavy/light wheels skiny/wide wheel combos that could help or hurt the numbers and make the results an apples to oranges comparison
If you dont know, just save it.....you keep coming up with ridiculous responses
I guess all the LS1 guys who complain about DA are crazy too and shouldnt be listened too because they havent made a pass in a Z
Nevermind most of the older owners have been drag racing for 10-15 years....without stepping into a Z you just arent allowed to point at the FACTSIf DA doesnt matter send an email to the NHRA to change the rules....apparently you know more about drag racing than they do
Heres a link to the NHRA website for youhttp://www.nhra.com/tech_specs/altitude.html