Boosted Performance single turbo fabrication
06-02-2014, 06:24 AM
#181
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Common sense and the laws of physics dictate a larger turbo WILL allow you to make more power EFFICIENTLY. Comparing a single small frame T3 to a large frame T4 would be like comparing a V6 to a V10 engine..Its not a fair comparison.
At some point the smaller turbo will become less efficient and begin to create more heat and lead to more detonation. Where the larger turbo will keep huffing away.. But the bottom line is you still need to put that set up on a properly designed and efficiently built motor. You can have the biggest turbo in the universe, and if you throw it on a poorly built motor with mismatched components, your doomed..
Also bragging that you can make or did make 850whp on pump gas is amateur at best. You put a $10,000 turbo set up on a $10000 built motor so why in the hell would you even want to run everyday pump gas where you dont even know if your getting 89 or 93 octane or if it is watered down or dirty gas? Why? Why take those chances in the first place, when you can simply use a good quality race gas and have the piece of mind that your running XYZ octane all the time every time..
When I tuned my Z I didnt really have an aggressive lean tune with tons of timing on my race gas..In fact my race gas map was exactly the same as my pump gas map with maybe 2 degrees of timing added after peak TQ, which made zero difference.. The VQ motors liked a certain A/F rate and there was zero to be gained by leaning them out to much.I mainly used the race gas as assurance when I ran 24 psi over my 18 psi street map. Mainly due to its lower flash point and more stable burn rate, reducing the chances of detonation. Race gas doesnt magically make more power, it just allows you to safely run more aggressive and lean tunes and assures a constant burn rate.
Detonation can be caused by a plethora of reasons, but mostly on the Z platform back in the days it was from aggressive timing or the turbos simply maxing out efficiency. So I can see where larger turbos would be warranted, but unless your drag racing, does one really need much more than 550hp on a street car? Hell anything over 450 on a street Z was considered fast and ran into traction issues..
With such good quality fuels available, why would one even want to skimp out and shortcut to use pump gas? There is no extra bragging rights to blowing up a motor on shitty gas..I have a N/A 600 HP motor in my Camaro that has the same compression ratio as a stock 350Z, I run nothing but Sunoco 100 octane in it. Why? Because the motor alone cost me over $15000 to build and I want it to stay that way..
The stuff that is said on these forums even from way back in the days, always had me shaking my head..
At some point the smaller turbo will become less efficient and begin to create more heat and lead to more detonation. Where the larger turbo will keep huffing away.. But the bottom line is you still need to put that set up on a properly designed and efficiently built motor. You can have the biggest turbo in the universe, and if you throw it on a poorly built motor with mismatched components, your doomed..
Also bragging that you can make or did make 850whp on pump gas is amateur at best. You put a $10,000 turbo set up on a $10000 built motor so why in the hell would you even want to run everyday pump gas where you dont even know if your getting 89 or 93 octane or if it is watered down or dirty gas? Why? Why take those chances in the first place, when you can simply use a good quality race gas and have the piece of mind that your running XYZ octane all the time every time..
When I tuned my Z I didnt really have an aggressive lean tune with tons of timing on my race gas..In fact my race gas map was exactly the same as my pump gas map with maybe 2 degrees of timing added after peak TQ, which made zero difference.. The VQ motors liked a certain A/F rate and there was zero to be gained by leaning them out to much.I mainly used the race gas as assurance when I ran 24 psi over my 18 psi street map. Mainly due to its lower flash point and more stable burn rate, reducing the chances of detonation. Race gas doesnt magically make more power, it just allows you to safely run more aggressive and lean tunes and assures a constant burn rate.
Detonation can be caused by a plethora of reasons, but mostly on the Z platform back in the days it was from aggressive timing or the turbos simply maxing out efficiency. So I can see where larger turbos would be warranted, but unless your drag racing, does one really need much more than 550hp on a street car? Hell anything over 450 on a street Z was considered fast and ran into traction issues..
With such good quality fuels available, why would one even want to skimp out and shortcut to use pump gas? There is no extra bragging rights to blowing up a motor on shitty gas..I have a N/A 600 HP motor in my Camaro that has the same compression ratio as a stock 350Z, I run nothing but Sunoco 100 octane in it. Why? Because the motor alone cost me over $15000 to build and I want it to stay that way..
The stuff that is said on these forums even from way back in the days, always had me shaking my head..
Last edited by Dajersyrat; 06-02-2014 at 06:26 AM.
06-02-2014, 08:15 AM
#182
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Its funny how this forum hides the truth and protects certain people and shuns others.. I know the past is the past, but the least we could do is be honest about it..
https://my350z.com/forum/drag/388671...l#post10400540
And proven, but NOT on the top 25 list. This car would and should be sitting at #5 under the top 4 other shops at the time. You cant hide the truth forever, at least give credit where credit is due...
https://my350z.com/forum/drag/388671...l#post10400540
And proven, but NOT on the top 25 list. This car would and should be sitting at #5 under the top 4 other shops at the time. You cant hide the truth forever, at least give credit where credit is due...
06-02-2014, 08:42 AM
#183
It's nt a smear campaign
Look at this thread
https://my350z.com/forum/forced-indu...headers-8.html
It's. Full on BS, calling other kits dynos BS...and n00bs again don't know better....and his "evidence" is full of crap, in fact it makes me almost wonder if he even knows what he is talking like how the pulses equalize spooling a turbo, or he simply is on a smear campaign of his own proving BS out there... All his evidence shows is the more psi the more power...there no other difference there to compare, so he either doesn't know or he is just being disingenuous.
Like you said, he has no experience to talk about other kits, if he was going to do that and then jump on this thread as the victim then he is full of it.
I know hal too budy,....so what? Lol
Look at this thread
https://my350z.com/forum/forced-indu...headers-8.html
It's. Full on BS, calling other kits dynos BS...and n00bs again don't know better....and his "evidence" is full of crap, in fact it makes me almost wonder if he even knows what he is talking like how the pulses equalize spooling a turbo, or he simply is on a smear campaign of his own proving BS out there... All his evidence shows is the more psi the more power...there no other difference there to compare, so he either doesn't know or he is just being disingenuous.
Like you said, he has no experience to talk about other kits, if he was going to do that and then jump on this thread as the victim then he is full of it.
I know hal too budy,....so what? Lol
You can say whatever you want, but just look at post #133 in that thread. It clearly shows that there is a huge difference in performance between OEM headers and after-market headers combined with a larger T4 turbine. If the header is the only changing variable, and significant improvements are noted, then what is so magical about other dyno graphs that are floating around?
More PSI doesn't equal more power...more flow equals more power. So when you have restrictive OEM headers or a small turbine, you can have 100psi out of your turbo, but you will still only make as much max power as you did on 10psi, because that is all the headers/turbine can handle. This is a very simple concept.
I have EBP printouts from a few runs, both with OEM header and after-market, with small a/r T4 turbines and large T4 a/r turbines. I have shared those with the community, no other turbo kit manufacturer has had the courage to share their R&D on this forum, even when customers ask for it, or question the advertised performance numbers. I call it how I see it, and I am seeing actual data from testing I have done over the years. There is a big difference between that and "I saw it once, so it must be true". I am not singling out any turbo kit, but making a blanket statement about ST kits for those that are on the market (because you do know that there is more than one), and for those that choose to build their own kits from scratch.
I have had countless people PM me here asking what I think they should do when building their own kit...and I have been happy to get back to them. I tell them the same thing I just posted up...don't use a small turbine, and upgrade your headers.
More recent tests of the twin scroll kits for the 370Z's will tell you that a 1.15 a/r T4 turbine is approaching it's flow limitation on a stock block at 540whp and 470ft/tq. So for anybody with a built VHR block, to go anything smaller than a T4 1.32 a/r would be just wrong. Same thing for the 350Z kits, although on a stock block a 1.0 a/r T4 turbine would do just fine. Again, all this stems from actual data/testing gathered.
06-02-2014, 10:15 AM
#185
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Well perhaps you and Super mod Romey could have me banned again and then orchestrate a 36 page thread of lies bashing me with me not being able to defend myself against the liable and slander? Im guessing when Romey and Sam turned the entire community against me they didn't tell the truth, it wasn't until I found a video that told the truth that Romey admitted it was his own fault.
06-02-2014, 11:22 AM
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And FWIWI at least my posts generate forum traffic for the OP
06-02-2014, 12:12 PM
#188
Roid infused rant well **** guess i need some roids yo validate your arguement. The ONLY one here with **** reading comprehension is yourself. He stated that x power is not possible on a t3 on these engines. THE FACT is that you got a bug up your *** about this and started bashing him providing VERY select dynos, with VERY rare instances. YOUR ENTIRE arguement valids his point of view that it was in a time when everyone was trying to one up each other on race gas. They used slect parts an optimized for THEIR dyno. YOUR arguement is literally the exact same as popping in and telling people the DE will support mid 500s stocl block because a couple people did it. Its not going to happen for most people, Hell its not going to happen for even 5% of people. NONE of these individuals provided any REAL benchmark other then dynos to even compare to. You know the REAL benchmark for power, the track. Your defending them without having any real details about what they did. HELL i bet i could post up a 500whp stillen kit( i know for sure i can because i have experience with the blower on ecotecs) on racegas spinning it so high it wont last long on a VERY select dyno of my choosing. So does that mean i should advertise that to customers and esentially scam them? Thats what your defending, you bash certain shops like GTM for scamming people(i do too the really have no ****ing clue what they are doing) but then defend others for using the same practices. What i DO care about is dumbasses spouting off without any real knowledge of their own. I mean **** quicksilver is running a turbonetics kit and we are supposed to take him seriously? Really? If anything he is upset because he made the worst decision possible.
This is why my350z is made fun of just like nico club now because the only people left are checkbook tuners, trolls, and people who talk alot of **** based on something they read online but have no real world experience on the subject
This is why my350z is made fun of just like nico club now because the only people left are checkbook tuners, trolls, and people who talk alot of **** based on something they read online but have no real world experience on the subject
WTF? Nice emotional rant (even though you're not defending Sasha and supposedly couldn't care less 
). Your reading comprehension sucks ****. LOL Nuthugging the T3? Another swing and a miss. I have aftermarket headers and a T4, which I decided on long before Sasha started selling the BP kit. Again, since you completely missed the point... the T3 was never marketed as superior to T4 and the race gas numbers were during an era in this community when shops/people were trying to one-up each other in the whp war with kits maxed out on race gas. I never said it was the right or wrong thing to do. I was just providing some historical context about the forum and the VQ market at that time, which was overlooked or dismissed because it doesn't fit certain folk's agendas to smear other ST kits. And your roid infused rant doesn't change the fact that Sasha created his own false narrative about other ST kits on the market (particularly PL) as he asserted a malicious twist on how those old race gas numbers were presented and insinuated that there was deception involved in how their kits were marketed.
). Your reading comprehension sucks ****. LOL Nuthugging the T3? Another swing and a miss. I have aftermarket headers and a T4, which I decided on long before Sasha started selling the BP kit. Again, since you completely missed the point... the T3 was never marketed as superior to T4 and the race gas numbers were during an era in this community when shops/people were trying to one-up each other in the whp war with kits maxed out on race gas. I never said it was the right or wrong thing to do. I was just providing some historical context about the forum and the VQ market at that time, which was overlooked or dismissed because it doesn't fit certain folk's agendas to smear other ST kits. And your roid infused rant doesn't change the fact that Sasha created his own false narrative about other ST kits on the market (particularly PL) as he asserted a malicious twist on how those old race gas numbers were presented and insinuated that there was deception involved in how their kits were marketed.
06-02-2014, 12:29 PM
#189
So why argue the point? You bash bp but then valid his primary points in regards to t3 turbos.
LOL not worth bragging about really? 1) show me another 3.5l doing it here 2)10k turbo and 10k engine? How about 10k for both togeather.
3)i do it on stock heads and cams with a modified stock intake WITHOUT a spacer.
4) why do it? How about because no one is going to daily a car on race gas. Seriously in my case that would be over 150 a week in gas WITHOUT any racing. Despite your conspiracy on gas you know what your getting. That **** is HIGHLY regulated and evey batch gets tested before it leaves the refinary. Its pretty hard to **** up. Refine oil. Add x xylene or toulene to reach x octane and x other additives to meet x areas requirements. Every car i run with runs pump 92 unless negotiated previously for race. Gt500s, supercharged z06s, big turbo supras, twin turbo vipers, couple 900 hp evos and sti's. In fact none of them will even run me on high boost anymore. Guess thats what happens when you have 850 whp and get down to 2800 lbs race weight.
As far as them liking a certain afr that is all about the injector location and why im building my own sheet metal intakes. Stock location is great for small injectors. Its **** for big injectors. Ive seen 1000hp engines gain 50 whp going from 7 inchs from valve face to 14 it simply idles like ****. People spout off on this forum about how "you dont need dual injectors!" Without knowing the real advantages of such a setup.
As far as traction i have no issues on low boost running 305/35/18 toyo r888s (600whp) and its on stock suspension. Will be moving to 335/45/17 drag radials for high boost soon.
LOL not worth bragging about really? 1) show me another 3.5l doing it here 2)10k turbo and 10k engine? How about 10k for both togeather.
3)i do it on stock heads and cams with a modified stock intake WITHOUT a spacer.
4) why do it? How about because no one is going to daily a car on race gas. Seriously in my case that would be over 150 a week in gas WITHOUT any racing. Despite your conspiracy on gas you know what your getting. That **** is HIGHLY regulated and evey batch gets tested before it leaves the refinary. Its pretty hard to **** up. Refine oil. Add x xylene or toulene to reach x octane and x other additives to meet x areas requirements. Every car i run with runs pump 92 unless negotiated previously for race. Gt500s, supercharged z06s, big turbo supras, twin turbo vipers, couple 900 hp evos and sti's. In fact none of them will even run me on high boost anymore. Guess thats what happens when you have 850 whp and get down to 2800 lbs race weight.
As far as them liking a certain afr that is all about the injector location and why im building my own sheet metal intakes. Stock location is great for small injectors. Its **** for big injectors. Ive seen 1000hp engines gain 50 whp going from 7 inchs from valve face to 14 it simply idles like ****. People spout off on this forum about how "you dont need dual injectors!" Without knowing the real advantages of such a setup.
As far as traction i have no issues on low boost running 305/35/18 toyo r888s (600whp) and its on stock suspension. Will be moving to 335/45/17 drag radials for high boost soon.
Common sense and the laws of physics dictate a larger turbo WILL allow you to make more power EFFICIENTLY. Comparing a single small frame T3 to a large frame T4 would be like comparing a V6 to a V10 engine..Its not a fair comparison.
At some point the smaller turbo will become less efficient and begin to create more heat and lead to more detonation. Where the larger turbo will keep huffing away.. But the bottom line is you still need to put that set up on a properly designed and efficiently built motor. You can have the biggest turbo in the universe, and if you throw it on a poorly built motor with mismatched components, your doomed..
Also bragging that you can make or did make 850whp on pump gas is amateur at best. You put a $10,000 turbo set up on a $10000 built motor so why in the hell would you even want to run everyday pump gas where you dont even know if your getting 89 or 93 octane or if it is watered down or dirty gas? Why? Why take those chances in the first place, when you can simply use a good quality race gas and have the piece of mind that your running XYZ octane all the time every time..
When I tuned my Z I didnt really have an aggressive lean tune with tons of timing on my race gas..In fact my race gas map was exactly the same as my pump gas map with maybe 2 degrees of timing added after peak TQ, which made zero difference.. The VQ motors liked a certain A/F rate and there was zero to be gained by leaning them out to much.I mainly used the race gas as assurance when I ran 24 psi over my 18 psi street map. Mainly due to its lower flash point and more stable burn rate, reducing the chances of detonation. Race gas doesnt magically make more power, it just allows you to safely run more aggressive and lean tunes and assures a constant burn rate.
Detonation can be caused by a plethora of reasons, but mostly on the Z platform back in the days it was from aggressive timing or the turbos simply maxing out efficiency. So I can see where larger turbos would be warranted, but unless your drag racing, does one really need much more than 550hp on a street car? Hell anything over 450 on a street Z was considered fast and ran into traction issues..
With such good quality fuels available, why would one even want to skimp out and shortcut to use pump gas? There is no extra bragging rights to blowing up a motor on shitty gas..I have a N/A 600 HP motor in my Camaro that has the same compression ratio as a stock 350Z, I run nothing but Sunoco 100 octane in it. Why? Because the motor alone cost me over $15000 to build and I want it to stay that way..
The stuff that is said on these forums even from way back in the days, always had me shaking my head..
At some point the smaller turbo will become less efficient and begin to create more heat and lead to more detonation. Where the larger turbo will keep huffing away.. But the bottom line is you still need to put that set up on a properly designed and efficiently built motor. You can have the biggest turbo in the universe, and if you throw it on a poorly built motor with mismatched components, your doomed..
Also bragging that you can make or did make 850whp on pump gas is amateur at best. You put a $10,000 turbo set up on a $10000 built motor so why in the hell would you even want to run everyday pump gas where you dont even know if your getting 89 or 93 octane or if it is watered down or dirty gas? Why? Why take those chances in the first place, when you can simply use a good quality race gas and have the piece of mind that your running XYZ octane all the time every time..
When I tuned my Z I didnt really have an aggressive lean tune with tons of timing on my race gas..In fact my race gas map was exactly the same as my pump gas map with maybe 2 degrees of timing added after peak TQ, which made zero difference.. The VQ motors liked a certain A/F rate and there was zero to be gained by leaning them out to much.I mainly used the race gas as assurance when I ran 24 psi over my 18 psi street map. Mainly due to its lower flash point and more stable burn rate, reducing the chances of detonation. Race gas doesnt magically make more power, it just allows you to safely run more aggressive and lean tunes and assures a constant burn rate.
Detonation can be caused by a plethora of reasons, but mostly on the Z platform back in the days it was from aggressive timing or the turbos simply maxing out efficiency. So I can see where larger turbos would be warranted, but unless your drag racing, does one really need much more than 550hp on a street car? Hell anything over 450 on a street Z was considered fast and ran into traction issues..
With such good quality fuels available, why would one even want to skimp out and shortcut to use pump gas? There is no extra bragging rights to blowing up a motor on shitty gas..I have a N/A 600 HP motor in my Camaro that has the same compression ratio as a stock 350Z, I run nothing but Sunoco 100 octane in it. Why? Because the motor alone cost me over $15000 to build and I want it to stay that way..
The stuff that is said on these forums even from way back in the days, always had me shaking my head..
06-02-2014, 01:21 PM
#191
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So why argue the point? You bash bp but then valid his primary points in regards to t3 turbos.
LOL not worth bragging about really? 1) show me another 3.5l doing it here 2)10k turbo and 10k engine? How about 10k for both togeather.
3)i do it on stock heads and cams with a modified stock intake WITHOUT a spacer.
4) why do it? How about because no one is going to daily a car on race gas. Seriously in my case that would be over 150 a week in gas WITHOUT any racing. Despite your conspiracy on gas you know what your getting. That **** is HIGHLY regulated and evey batch gets tested before it leaves the refinary. Its pretty hard to **** up. Refine oil. Add x xylene or toulene to reach x octane and x other additives to meet x areas requirements. Every car i run with runs pump 92 unless negotiated previously for race. Gt500s, supercharged z06s, big turbo supras, twin turbo vipers, couple 900 hp evos and sti's. In fact none of them will even run me on high boost anymore. Guess thats what happens when you have 850 whp and get down to 2800 lbs race weight.
As far as them liking a certain afr that is all about the injector location and why im building my own sheet metal intakes. Stock location is great for small injectors. Its **** for big injectors. Ive seen 1000hp engines gain 50 whp going from 7 inchs from valve face to 14 it simply idles like ****. People spout off on this forum about how "you dont need dual injectors!" Without knowing the real advantages of such a setup.
As far as traction i have no issues on low boost running 305/35/18 toyo r888s (600whp) and its on stock suspension. Will be moving to 335/45/17 drag radials for high boost soon.
LOL not worth bragging about really? 1) show me another 3.5l doing it here 2)10k turbo and 10k engine? How about 10k for both togeather.
3)i do it on stock heads and cams with a modified stock intake WITHOUT a spacer.
4) why do it? How about because no one is going to daily a car on race gas. Seriously in my case that would be over 150 a week in gas WITHOUT any racing. Despite your conspiracy on gas you know what your getting. That **** is HIGHLY regulated and evey batch gets tested before it leaves the refinary. Its pretty hard to **** up. Refine oil. Add x xylene or toulene to reach x octane and x other additives to meet x areas requirements. Every car i run with runs pump 92 unless negotiated previously for race. Gt500s, supercharged z06s, big turbo supras, twin turbo vipers, couple 900 hp evos and sti's. In fact none of them will even run me on high boost anymore. Guess thats what happens when you have 850 whp and get down to 2800 lbs race weight.
As far as them liking a certain afr that is all about the injector location and why im building my own sheet metal intakes. Stock location is great for small injectors. Its **** for big injectors. Ive seen 1000hp engines gain 50 whp going from 7 inchs from valve face to 14 it simply idles like ****. People spout off on this forum about how "you dont need dual injectors!" Without knowing the real advantages of such a setup.
As far as traction i have no issues on low boost running 305/35/18 toyo r888s (600whp) and its on stock suspension. Will be moving to 335/45/17 drag radials for high boost soon.
Jerry,
Your post looks like an eclectic mess of scrambled thoughts. I really cant respond in a clear and concise manner.
If your saying you made 850whp on pump gas on a 3.5L VQ35 engine,stock heads and stock cams, I'm interested in seeing the dyno graph and or video as well as 1/4 mile trap speeds.
If your saying you made that on a Supra, then I am not impressed in the least. That car can make 850 on stock internals.
As far as the fuel consistency comment I will agree since I worked an a jet fuel storage facility back in my early 20's. The fuel at the refinery is quality checked under tight regulations and guidelines. However the issue is when "Joe Blow's" gas station takes delivery of it, you have no clue what happens to it at that point. their tanks could have water in them, contamination, or simply be selling you a swill mix of 87 and 92 octane from the same pump. You just dont know what you are getting consistently.
As far as vipers and Z06's ect ect...You referring to cars with double the diplacement,some of them supercharged with forged internals from the factory, and tons of safeguards in place. Consumer automobiles are not tuned to the ragged edge of performance or explosion...They are released with plent of HP left on the table to be unleashed for many reasons.
Next response could you please utilize either paragraph or numbered outline format. K. thanks.
06-02-2014, 02:25 PM
#192
only dyno i have handy, mind you this is ONLY 20 psi on a slipping clutch, which concept z replaced on their own dime with a custom built unit from southbend since it didnt hold the 825 lb ft they claimed. on sasha's old midmount 6765 kit with .96 t4 housing, it only dynoed like this because thats what the clutch would hold and i was on the phone with concept z that day very pissed off, it honestly wasnt even holding 20 it was bouncing back and forth between 17 and 20 from the engine unloading.. I run 32 psi, with a 6766 1.34 divided t4 and quick spool now i simply havnt had it on the dyno at that power i know what it is making from injector pulsewidth and calculating based on that compared to this dyno(and the 850 number is me being conservative the numbers say it should be closer to 880.) when i put it back togeather with the new kit i can provide a new dyno it will have even more down low due to proper intake, exhaust manifolds and the 4 port bcs. i can also take it to the 1/8th, we dont have a 1/4 here and technically dont have a 1/8th yet its not officially opened but i can get on the track to run, know some of the workers there. I havnt redynoed because i am constantly messing with the car testing things(like the AEM during pre release), developing new parts(intake, the two different turbo kits, super charger kits, core support, new suspension in the rear that literally is ready to begin production the day i get the car back to ohio although i doubt a whole lot of people will be interested due to the massive changes required to the rear of the car. althought it completely eliminates the rear sub frame so no issue with mounts, bracer, or cracking in exchange for a setup that is somewhat similar to the old vettes torque arm setup and overall much better for traction.), building other peoples cars(have had a few here, mustangs mostly although a g35 twin turbo as well.), going to school, and still working since i have to work for the army until my retirement is finalized. 
The doubt you express is rather amusing since you claim to be a innovator and have a 600whp NA camaro(what setup? my Z is the first import ive owned i built mostly domestics prior to this with some helping out at switzer and buschurs and owned 3 third gens and a 4th gen myself) yet do not realize how amazing the stock head setup on the vq flows. literally it is better then all the LS up until you get to ls3 heads or go for race ported heads, stock they flow better then all but the most extreme ported 2jz heads and then dont flow less by much.
I never said anywhere i run a supra, i run WITH big turbo supras, im the only vq that runs with the "big power" crowd here. you simply said 10k turbo setup and 10k engine setup. which isnt even close i paid 10k combined for both. my engine was 4k i built myself and the turbo setup was 5600 for sasha's midmount several years ago. i run pauter rods and wossner 8:1 pistons(something that i hardly know anyone who knows about let alone runs anything wossner in the states)
as far as consistency when it gets to the pump im not sure about where you lived but ive watched stations in ohio get inspected to ensure the customer receives what they are paying for. never here in hawaii but i have also not seen any knock ive always tuned the car myself.
the cars im talking about not one of is stock, i make some of the least power in the group outside the vettes(they are zo6's none supercharger from the factory). the vettes are kinda the low power guys who hand around with most of them making 700-780 whp. the vipers are all running 900-1000, the GTR's are running alpha 10 and 12 packages with one sp engineering car running 800 whp no idea what he makes pump because he only comes out when he is running someone and runs race gas for that. two of the GT500's are no longer supercharged and run twin turbos. all of them make 900+ but they are still heavy as ****.
The doubt you express is rather amusing since you claim to be a innovator and have a 600whp NA camaro(what setup? my Z is the first import ive owned i built mostly domestics prior to this with some helping out at switzer and buschurs and owned 3 third gens and a 4th gen myself) yet do not realize how amazing the stock head setup on the vq flows. literally it is better then all the LS up until you get to ls3 heads or go for race ported heads, stock they flow better then all but the most extreme ported 2jz heads and then dont flow less by much.
I never said anywhere i run a supra, i run WITH big turbo supras, im the only vq that runs with the "big power" crowd here. you simply said 10k turbo setup and 10k engine setup. which isnt even close i paid 10k combined for both. my engine was 4k i built myself and the turbo setup was 5600 for sasha's midmount several years ago. i run pauter rods and wossner 8:1 pistons(something that i hardly know anyone who knows about let alone runs anything wossner in the states)
as far as consistency when it gets to the pump im not sure about where you lived but ive watched stations in ohio get inspected to ensure the customer receives what they are paying for. never here in hawaii but i have also not seen any knock ive always tuned the car myself.
the cars im talking about not one of is stock, i make some of the least power in the group outside the vettes(they are zo6's none supercharger from the factory). the vettes are kinda the low power guys who hand around with most of them making 700-780 whp. the vipers are all running 900-1000, the GTR's are running alpha 10 and 12 packages with one sp engineering car running 800 whp no idea what he makes pump because he only comes out when he is running someone and runs race gas for that. two of the GT500's are no longer supercharged and run twin turbos. all of them make 900+ but they are still heavy as ****.
Jerry,
Your post looks like an eclectic mess of scrambled thoughts. I really cant respond in a clear and concise manner.
If your saying you made 850whp on pump gas on a 3.5L VQ35 engine,stock heads and stock cams, I'm interested in seeing the dyno graph and or video as well as 1/4 mile trap speeds.
If your saying you made that on a Supra, then I am not impressed in the least. That car can make 850 on stock internals.
As far as the fuel consistency comment I will agree since I worked an a jet fuel storage facility back in my early 20's. The fuel at the refinery is quality checked under tight regulations and guidelines. However the issue is when "Joe Blow's" gas station takes delivery of it, you have no clue what happens to it at that point. their tanks could have water in them, contamination, or simply be selling you a swill mix of 87 and 92 octane from the same pump. You just dont know what you are getting consistently.
As far as vipers and Z06's ect ect...You referring to cars with double the diplacement,some of them supercharged with forged internals from the factory, and tons of safeguards in place. Consumer automobiles are not tuned to the ragged edge of performance or explosion...They are released with plent of HP left on the table to be unleashed for many reasons.
Next response could you please utilize either paragraph or numbered outline format. K. thanks.
Your post looks like an eclectic mess of scrambled thoughts. I really cant respond in a clear and concise manner.
If your saying you made 850whp on pump gas on a 3.5L VQ35 engine,stock heads and stock cams, I'm interested in seeing the dyno graph and or video as well as 1/4 mile trap speeds.
If your saying you made that on a Supra, then I am not impressed in the least. That car can make 850 on stock internals.
As far as the fuel consistency comment I will agree since I worked an a jet fuel storage facility back in my early 20's. The fuel at the refinery is quality checked under tight regulations and guidelines. However the issue is when "Joe Blow's" gas station takes delivery of it, you have no clue what happens to it at that point. their tanks could have water in them, contamination, or simply be selling you a swill mix of 87 and 92 octane from the same pump. You just dont know what you are getting consistently.
As far as vipers and Z06's ect ect...You referring to cars with double the diplacement,some of them supercharged with forged internals from the factory, and tons of safeguards in place. Consumer automobiles are not tuned to the ragged edge of performance or explosion...They are released with plent of HP left on the table to be unleashed for many reasons.
Next response could you please utilize either paragraph or numbered outline format. K. thanks.
Last edited by jerryd87; 06-02-2014 at 02:38 PM.
06-02-2014, 02:52 PM
#193
lets also not forget that stock cams are actually BETTER for the new generation billet turbos(well intake side anyway) since the billet wheels flow exactly the same as a cast one unless exceeding 30 psi. past 30 psi is where they get all the extra flow and why the 6765 billet wheel was performing exactly the the same as a 6765 cast wheel on domestics that dont see such high pressure ratios.
06-02-2014, 04:11 PM
#194
New Member
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Originally Posted by jerryd87
, with VERY rare instances..... Hell its not going to happen for even 5% of people..... NONE of these individuals provided any REAL benchmark other then dynos to even compare .... quicksilver is running a turbonetics kit and we are supposed to take him seriously? Really? If anything he is upset because he made the worst decision possible.
This is why my350z is made fun of just like nico club now because the only people left are checkbook tuners, trolls, and people who talk alot of **** based on something they read online but have no real world experience on the subject
This is why my350z is made fun of just like nico club now because the only people left are checkbook tuners, trolls, and people who talk alot of **** based on something they read online but have no real world experience on the subject
LOL, do us a favor and do you research before you even speak/write or just stfu. It's cool you want to nutwing because that was the kit you owned but I have owned and driven on several kits to know your statements are incorrect.
I don't know of any car with a capable flowing kit(most of them since 2008) that can't make 500whp with the fuel system, ems and fuel system... Most dial the psi down due to stock motor.
There are several threads here on cars with dynos and 1/4 track numbers from reputable shops just as sound performance, injected, titan, etc with cars running over 500 whp, this are proven dynos and and 1/4 mile times are too
Since you obviously don't know who I am, if you are trying to attack me at least do your research so you don't sound stupid, I had a Turbonetics kit in 2005-2006....i now run a PL single turbo setup with a 76s turbo and running a 3.5" downloads pipe(that Sasha says its not possible from other kits)... I didn't loose ac, didn't have to relocate radiator, or "extreme" lol modifications, everything is fine...my setup pushes 760 whp on 91, and pushed it to 967 on race gas, the 91 octane was tested on ums, proefi,and fullrace(bmr) dyno...
Last edited by IIQuickSilverII; 06-02-2014 at 04:49 PM.
06-02-2014, 04:28 PM
#195
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You can say whatever you want, but just look at post #133 in that thread. It clearly shows that there is a huge difference in performance between OEM headers and after-market headers combined with a larger T4 turbine. If the header is the only changing variable, and significant improvements are noted, then what is so magical about other dyno graphs that are floating around?
Just do the turbo change (t3-to-t4) and you get the improved curve...nobody is arguing the t3 is better ...just the lie that says you can't make 500whp, or headers are a must...
Heck I have custom headers myself, but I don't go around misinforming people saying that if you don't do them you can't get to 500+ whp
More PSI doesn't equal more power...more flow equals more power. So when you have restrictive OEM headers or a small turbine, you can have 100psi out of your turbo, but you will still only make as much max power as you did on 10psi, because that is all the headers/turbine can handle. This is a very simple concept.
Most kits are capable of of flowing enough to get to close yo max out the turbos they are designed for...you don't have to parade or have Jerry try tell people that its BS BECAUSE...actually I don't know what coherent reasoning he can say about it that isn't true.
[/quote]
I have EBP printouts from a few runs, both with OEM header and after-market, with small a/r T4 turbines and large T4 a/r turbines. I have shared those with the community, no other turbo kit manufacturer has had the courage to share their R&D on this forum, even when customers ask for it, or question the advertised performance numbers. I call it how I see it, and I am seeing actual data from testing I have done over the years. There is a big difference between that and "I saw it once, so it must be true". I am not singling out any turbo kit,
Plenty of tuners in the past have posted enough dynos 1/4 mile times same as costumers that have just moved on yo other platforms now...most people that are from those days around here still "in" the community remember that well.
06-02-2014, 04:34 PM
#196
hey dick nuts how about taking your own advice 1) ive already done research 2)not only have i done research i HAVE DONE THE **** I TALK ABOUT FIRST HAND, i HAVE experience unlike you. you say im misinformed? prove me wrong, your not going to do that with that shitty turbonetics kit. not only that i know for a FACT no one here has been a part of a 800 whp SINGLE t3 kit like i have. which holds true to what i said before MASSIVE compressor, MASSIVE wastegate to bypass everything that cannot run through the t3 housing and race gas. IN FACT every other platform that runs t3 turbos this isnt even a questionable item they all know the flow limits of a t3 housing is around 500 whp depending on the dyno go ahead and head over to the evo forums, supra forums, the turbo forums(which has ACTUAL turbo engineers from garrett that frequent) they will tell you the same. the ONLY way to get around this is MASSIVE wastegates that NO kit comes with and start bypassing over 60% of the exhaust the engine makes through the wastegate.
go ahead and look at the dynos of them at 500whp the t3 kits ARNT a capable flowing kit they are t3 and since you didnt notice both of rude and julian have already admitted the t3 limits compared to t4. the dynos are peaky as **** and cant sustain the power at all. none of them have track times because none of them will have any noticeable time difference. an extra 30 isnt going to do **** if it only makes that extra power for 300 rpms, shifting will have more of an impact on a race at that point.
titan? show me that now i know your full of **** since i have NEVER seen anything from titan this isnt the supra forums. go pick up the dynos from sound performance, injected and the others please do because that just proves my point you dont know what your talking about even more since they are running t4 turbos or twins.
for one if your running a 76mm turbo and only hitting those numbers, i feel sorry for you thats pitiful and thats giving you the benefit of the doubt that the greenish blue g35 is actually yours. although if you really are running ac(i highly doubt i am intimately familiar with the space in the area the power lab runs.) then where is your condensor?
not only that IF that is you then you are running the shitty "behind the engine" exhaust for the passenger side header resulting in a major loss in efficiency and spool to the already significant hit taken by running such a large turbo when significantly smaller can perform just as good. in this case all this info is telling me you have NEVER built **** and trying to pretend like you know something because you know how to fill out a check. leave the tech talk to people who ACTUALLY build cars otherwise you look stupid.
go ahead and look at the dynos of them at 500whp the t3 kits ARNT a capable flowing kit they are t3 and since you didnt notice both of rude and julian have already admitted the t3 limits compared to t4. the dynos are peaky as **** and cant sustain the power at all. none of them have track times because none of them will have any noticeable time difference. an extra 30 isnt going to do **** if it only makes that extra power for 300 rpms, shifting will have more of an impact on a race at that point.
titan? show me that now i know your full of **** since i have NEVER seen anything from titan this isnt the supra forums. go pick up the dynos from sound performance, injected and the others please do because that just proves my point you dont know what your talking about even more since they are running t4 turbos or twins.
for one if your running a 76mm turbo and only hitting those numbers, i feel sorry for you thats pitiful and thats giving you the benefit of the doubt that the greenish blue g35 is actually yours. although if you really are running ac(i highly doubt i am intimately familiar with the space in the area the power lab runs.) then where is your condensor?
not only that IF that is you then you are running the shitty "behind the engine" exhaust for the passenger side header resulting in a major loss in efficiency and spool to the already significant hit taken by running such a large turbo when significantly smaller can perform just as good. in this case all this info is telling me you have NEVER built **** and trying to pretend like you know something because you know how to fill out a check. leave the tech talk to people who ACTUALLY build cars otherwise you look stupid.
Sheez, the misinformation its worse than in 2006
LOL, do us a favor and do you research before you even speak/write of just stfu. It's cool you want to nutwing on Bp because that was the kit you owned but I have owned and driven on several kits to know your statements are incorrect.
I don't know of any car with a capable flowing kit(most of them since 2008) that can't make 500whp with the fuel system, ems and fuel system... Most dial the psi down due to stock motor.
There are several threads here on cars with dynos and 1/4 track numbers from reputable shops just as sound performance, injected, titan, etc with cars running over 500 whp, this are proven dynos and and 1/4 mile times are too
Since you obviously don't know who I am, if you are trying to attack me at least do your research so you don't sound stupid, I had a Turbonetics kit in 2005-2006....i now run a PL single turbo setup with a 76s turbo and running a 3.5" downloads pipe(that Sasha says its not possible from other kits... I didn't loose ac, didn't have yo relocate radiator, everything is fine...i out 760 who on 91, and pushed it to 967 on race gas, the 91 octane was tested on ums, proefi,and fullrace(bmr) dyno...
LOL, do us a favor and do you research before you even speak/write of just stfu. It's cool you want to nutwing on Bp because that was the kit you owned but I have owned and driven on several kits to know your statements are incorrect.
I don't know of any car with a capable flowing kit(most of them since 2008) that can't make 500whp with the fuel system, ems and fuel system... Most dial the psi down due to stock motor.
There are several threads here on cars with dynos and 1/4 track numbers from reputable shops just as sound performance, injected, titan, etc with cars running over 500 whp, this are proven dynos and and 1/4 mile times are too
Since you obviously don't know who I am, if you are trying to attack me at least do your research so you don't sound stupid, I had a Turbonetics kit in 2005-2006....i now run a PL single turbo setup with a 76s turbo and running a 3.5" downloads pipe(that Sasha says its not possible from other kits... I didn't loose ac, didn't have yo relocate radiator, everything is fine...i out 760 who on 91, and pushed it to 967 on race gas, the 91 octane was tested on ums, proefi,and fullrace(bmr) dyno...
06-02-2014, 04:39 PM
#197
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I now run a 67 Camaro set up for road racing with a full custom frame and cage. It has a pissed off dry sump 383 stroker with a 4.065 bore, nasty cam and weighs about 2500lbs. Jerico 4 speed, 12 bolt with 3.08 gears, 335/35/17 rears..Nasty ****!!
The damn thing scares the hell out of me honestly. I thought the Z was fast but this car is scary cause its so light and glued to the road.
My Z was CP pistons, Pauter H beams,knife edged stock crank, unsleeved stock block, Brian Crower Stage 3 cams and a full head job from Headgames with Ferrea components. The turbos were a bit on the small side to really take advantage of the porting and polishing job on the heads, but the potential was there if I upgraded.
I was running an APS extreme kit, which I believer were GT30r's but on the smaller side. I was in the process of doing a twin front mount with twin GT35RS turbos at the time, when the business fell apart.
The thing that broke on my car was a turbo, that the turbine broke off and sent bearings and material into my oil pan. when I pulled the motor apart it was in pristine condition. Since I didnt have the business any more the wife threatened to cut my nuts off if I spent another penny on the car, so to make her happy I got out of the game cause I also had an Evo at the time and had just had my 2nd child, so out of the car game I went for a few years...
I miss the **** out of my Z. Some kid in western PA has it now..Looks the same except a NA junkyard motor...
If I was gonna buld another Z to drag race only, I would go with a rear back half and a Chevy 12 bolt, TH400 mounted to a VQ3.7L engine and a big *** single turbo up front..And rip all the BS out of the car.
My 10.0 run was definitely a 9 second pass, but believe it or not, I mis-shifted my TH400 from 1 to 2 and slipped into 3 and then pulled back to 2 mid way down the track..A few more weeks I would have had the 2 step dialed in a bit better cause if you look you can see the car launch, then kind of bog then go again..The 2 step I had too much timing being pulled and it killed the 60 foot..And eventually the turbos
The last time I had it out when it broke was an Import Vs Domestic event and I decided to foot brake it and not used the Trans brake, and went 10.27/10.27 and 10.26....then some supra was running 9.90's so I decided to show off and 2 step it on my 4th time trial and bam...The rear of the turbine actually came off and was in the damn down pipe..LOL...
The damn thing scares the hell out of me honestly. I thought the Z was fast but this car is scary cause its so light and glued to the road.
My Z was CP pistons, Pauter H beams,knife edged stock crank, unsleeved stock block, Brian Crower Stage 3 cams and a full head job from Headgames with Ferrea components. The turbos were a bit on the small side to really take advantage of the porting and polishing job on the heads, but the potential was there if I upgraded.
I was running an APS extreme kit, which I believer were GT30r's but on the smaller side. I was in the process of doing a twin front mount with twin GT35RS turbos at the time, when the business fell apart.
The thing that broke on my car was a turbo, that the turbine broke off and sent bearings and material into my oil pan. when I pulled the motor apart it was in pristine condition. Since I didnt have the business any more the wife threatened to cut my nuts off if I spent another penny on the car, so to make her happy I got out of the game cause I also had an Evo at the time and had just had my 2nd child, so out of the car game I went for a few years...
I miss the **** out of my Z. Some kid in western PA has it now..Looks the same except a NA junkyard motor...
If I was gonna buld another Z to drag race only, I would go with a rear back half and a Chevy 12 bolt, TH400 mounted to a VQ3.7L engine and a big *** single turbo up front..And rip all the BS out of the car.
My 10.0 run was definitely a 9 second pass, but believe it or not, I mis-shifted my TH400 from 1 to 2 and slipped into 3 and then pulled back to 2 mid way down the track..A few more weeks I would have had the 2 step dialed in a bit better cause if you look you can see the car launch, then kind of bog then go again..The 2 step I had too much timing being pulled and it killed the 60 foot..And eventually the turbos
The last time I had it out when it broke was an Import Vs Domestic event and I decided to foot brake it and not used the Trans brake, and went 10.27/10.27 and 10.26....then some supra was running 9.90's so I decided to show off and 2 step it on my 4th time trial and bam...The rear of the turbine actually came off and was in the damn down pipe..LOL...
06-02-2014, 04:40 PM
#198
and since you have selective memory like a **** here how about i introduce you to a thread. you guys keep getting on sashas nuts about bashing the bp kit but he is by FAR not the first to start it. https://my350z.com/forum/forced-indu...500-hp-24.html i have actually seen ALOT of ACTUAL customers make the claim seems you both are just nut hugging intense power because the power lab is what they seem to be pushing mostly.
bottom line? sasha actual has TEST DATA from REAL WORLD testing of BOTH t3 AND t4(did you forget he originally used a t3 in his kit and that didnt last long due to the constraints of the housing? oh it seems you did forget that.) someone who denies a EBP test log is just ****ing dumb, seriously that is the best test out there for determining restriction in the system and what EVERY big name company uses. **** some people even tune the car with it(meatbag i believe was setting it up to do so?)
come back when you have actually turned a wrench or better yet built your own turbo kit. so far the only one i have any respect for is julian since he ACTUALLY did ****.
bottom line? sasha actual has TEST DATA from REAL WORLD testing of BOTH t3 AND t4(did you forget he originally used a t3 in his kit and that didnt last long due to the constraints of the housing? oh it seems you did forget that.) someone who denies a EBP test log is just ****ing dumb, seriously that is the best test out there for determining restriction in the system and what EVERY big name company uses. **** some people even tune the car with it(meatbag i believe was setting it up to do so?)
come back when you have actually turned a wrench or better yet built your own turbo kit. so far the only one i have any respect for is julian since he ACTUALLY did ****.
06-02-2014, 04:52 PM
#199
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I told the guy that owns my Z now, if he ever sells it to call me. I want it back..God help all yall if I ever decide to get back in the Z game..
You guys thought I was a dick before? I would have no shop to worry about and could basically be a real DB, worse than I was..LOL...
Another thing guys dont take into account in the import world is gearing and tire sizes. When I had my TH400 made I selected gearing inside it to closely match the Z stock gearing and a 28" rear slick..
I would get the same tranny, same TQ converter that Pro TQ made us and clean up all the useless crap in the Z engine bay and run that AEM infinity set up which looks bad ***!! I would do dual injectors 750ccx2 on each cylinder and a custom one off manifold. Dual long tube headers running up front to a large twin scroll T4 turbo..With a 12 bolt solid rear, you could set up the car to hook on a dirt road..LOL
Now if I wanted a street Z to just drive around at 500-550 hp, I would do a simply T3 twin turbo set up which would give me the best of both worlds. Neck breaking TQ and some respectable top end.
You guys thought I was a dick before? I would have no shop to worry about and could basically be a real DB, worse than I was..LOL...Another thing guys dont take into account in the import world is gearing and tire sizes. When I had my TH400 made I selected gearing inside it to closely match the Z stock gearing and a 28" rear slick..
I would get the same tranny, same TQ converter that Pro TQ made us and clean up all the useless crap in the Z engine bay and run that AEM infinity set up which looks bad ***!! I would do dual injectors 750ccx2 on each cylinder and a custom one off manifold. Dual long tube headers running up front to a large twin scroll T4 turbo..With a 12 bolt solid rear, you could set up the car to hook on a dirt road..LOL
Now if I wanted a street Z to just drive around at 500-550 hp, I would do a simply T3 twin turbo set up which would give me the best of both worlds. Neck breaking TQ and some respectable top end.
06-02-2014, 04:57 PM
#200
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Does that say 1400ft lbs of TQ? Perhaps that dyno was effed up..Why would it read so high on the TQ and low on the HP?
Was the clutch a dual or triple carbon by any chance? My dual carbon slipped if it was cold, I would have to literally slip it to warm it up then it would hold.
