Z and 911
12-25-2004, 04:06 PM
#22
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I'm actually buying a 997S Cab/targa (gotta wait for pricing).
I didnt used to "get" the porsche thing - but now I do.
Sure there's badging gooing on - hell its a LUXURY product, so even if a Z were faster - the Z is still a Z (kinda like how you guys dis the EVO/STi as 4 door econoboxes).
However, there is certainly something beyond the luxury branding going on in a porsche. I've driven 10 various 911 in the last two months (+3 NSXs and 2 ferrraris). There's was only ONE car that had that specific feel - thats why ppl who want a porsche - get one.
I was on the fence for a great while re: getting a C6 vs a 911S. Even with similar performance the 911 is the superior car. Even when you factor out the name branding - sit in a chevy corvette, sit in a 997 blindfolded...operate the switches. Driv e the car - drive it HARD! Theres a clear diff.
Honestly, I wish I couldnt tell, b/c I'd be happy with a C6 + $33K.
I didnt used to "get" the porsche thing - but now I do.
Sure there's badging gooing on - hell its a LUXURY product, so even if a Z were faster - the Z is still a Z (kinda like how you guys dis the EVO/STi as 4 door econoboxes).
However, there is certainly something beyond the luxury branding going on in a porsche. I've driven 10 various 911 in the last two months (+3 NSXs and 2 ferrraris). There's was only ONE car that had that specific feel - thats why ppl who want a porsche - get one.
I was on the fence for a great while re: getting a C6 vs a 911S. Even with similar performance the 911 is the superior car. Even when you factor out the name branding - sit in a chevy corvette, sit in a 997 blindfolded...operate the switches. Driv e the car - drive it HARD! Theres a clear diff.
Honestly, I wish I couldnt tell, b/c I'd be happy with a C6 + $33K.
12-27-2004, 05:26 AM
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As the owner of 3 porsches I have to say that the Z is not in the same league. I picked up my Z last week and I have several small complaints. But I have to say that the Z has the most bang for the buck. It was a impulse buy. I only plan on keeping it until my Lotus Elise arrives sometime in the next several months. That car has ruined me for all other cars. But my wife is thinking about keeping the Z for herself. Sports cars are my life. And I've driven just about every car on the market including the entire porsche and Ferrari line. And I must say that the Z fills a niche in the sports car market. It doesn't stand out in any one performance category. But in my opinion it performs onpar across the board. It is what it is . A very good all around fun sports car. I can't think of another sub 40 grand two seater that offers the comfort and performance that the Z does. Not to mention that it looks better than most sports cars no matter what the price.
12-27-2004, 06:56 AM
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The new C6 Corvette is just as good as the new Porsche Carrera, but costs $25000.00 less.
Thats the funniest thing I have heard in a while.
Gotta love the fast=good mentality
12-27-2004, 07:52 AM
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Originally posted by EdgeOfSanity
If you're talking stricly performance, then yes there are plenty of other cars that will kill any porsche under $100k. I'd much rather have a carrera S than anything else under 100k simply because i love the style and overall feel of these cars. Once you hit 911 turbo territory... there isnt anything else out there that can touch it for the price.
If you're talking stricly performance, then yes there are plenty of other cars that will kill any porsche under $100k. I'd much rather have a carrera S than anything else under 100k simply because i love the style and overall feel of these cars. Once you hit 911 turbo territory... there isnt anything else out there that can touch it for the price.
12-27-2004, 08:44 AM
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Originally posted by EdgeOfSanity
If you're talking stricly performance, then yes there are plenty of other cars that will kill any porsche under $100k. I'd much rather have a carrera S than anything else under 100k simply because i love the style and overall feel of these cars. Once you hit 911 turbo territory... there isnt anything else out there that can touch it for the price.
If you're talking stricly performance, then yes there are plenty of other cars that will kill any porsche under $100k. I'd much rather have a carrera S than anything else under 100k simply because i love the style and overall feel of these cars. Once you hit 911 turbo territory... there isnt anything else out there that can touch it for the price.
just yesterday I killed a Porsche 911 Turbo.. Now don't get me wrong the 911 is a great car but with a TT on the Z that’s a different ball game 
Please refer to this link (at that time my Z was stock) "A 350Z among Porsche's"
Az
12-27-2004, 11:02 AM
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Originally posted by 350zluvr
a 4-car lead within a 60 mph range is a huge difference.
Speaking of overpaying for the name, what other track ready 3.6 liter engine do you know of that produces 381 hp and 185 lb/ft of torque for $90,000? Not to even mention the handling. I love my Z and would probably never give it up for anything, but Porsches are in a completely different league altogether and that is the reason for the price tag.
by the way, there is no such thing as a 911 S-type. Porsches do not resemble Acuras or Hondas in their name badging. The vehicle's name is 911 Carrera S or 911C2S.
a 4-car lead within a 60 mph range is a huge difference.
Speaking of overpaying for the name, what other track ready 3.6 liter engine do you know of that produces 381 hp and 185 lb/ft of torque for $90,000? Not to even mention the handling. I love my Z and would probably never give it up for anything, but Porsches are in a completely different league altogether and that is the reason for the price tag.
by the way, there is no such thing as a 911 S-type. Porsches do not resemble Acuras or Hondas in their name badging. The vehicle's name is 911 Carrera S or 911C2S.
Last edited by FLZ; 12-27-2004 at 11:06 AM.
12-27-2004, 11:14 AM
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My father has owned 3 different Porsches and I can also say first hand that a Porsche is in a different league altogether. The build quality and the quality of the materials themselves do not compare. Sure I admit the Z is a great bargain and does perform better than most other cars in its price range BUT I also admit that the only reason I have a Z and not a 911 is because I can't afford the latter....yet.
12-27-2004, 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by FLZ
In the mid 70s to late 80s The 911 had an S or an SC label....I had a 1977 911 S Targa..........
In the mid 70s to late 80s The 911 had an S or an SC label....I had a 1977 911 S Targa..........
12-27-2004, 11:48 AM
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Originally posted by 350zluvr
Sure there was the S and SC, but never was there an S-type. Usually when people hear S-type it is referred back to Hondas or Acuras, but Porsche S or SC is referred to differently.
Sure there was the S and SC, but never was there an S-type. Usually when people hear S-type it is referred back to Hondas or Acuras, but Porsche S or SC is referred to differently.
Agreed, and I also just showed my age,(but not my maturity), by my post.....Feeling a little too old right about now.....:-)
12-27-2004, 11:49 AM
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Originally posted by Sr. Panza
My father has owned 3 different Porsches and I can also say first hand that a Porsche is in a different league altogether. The build quality and the quality of the materials themselves do not compare. Sure I admit the Z is a great bargain and does perform better than most other cars in its price range BUT I also admit that the only reason I have a Z and not a 911 is because I can't afford the latter....yet.
My father has owned 3 different Porsches and I can also say first hand that a Porsche is in a different league altogether. The build quality and the quality of the materials themselves do not compare. Sure I admit the Z is a great bargain and does perform better than most other cars in its price range BUT I also admit that the only reason I have a Z and not a 911 is because I can't afford the latter....yet.
12-27-2004, 12:56 PM
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Ive had the door slammed on me by a 911 once. Even though he got a better launch then I did, I could tell that it wouldnt have made that much of a difference. Was it THAT much faster than my Z?? Well no, not really, but it was pretty decisive.
12-27-2004, 04:03 PM
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Originally posted by EnthuZiast
Thats the funniest thing I have heard in a while.
Gotta love the fast=good mentality
Thats the funniest thing I have heard in a while.
Gotta love the fast=good mentality
http://www.caranddriver.com/article....&page_number=1
I never said fast=good, but Car and Driver did rate the new Corvette as better then the new Carrera, so how about you quit pulling stuff out of your a** and grow up.
Oh, and I am sure you will say that Car and Driver sucks, because you don't seem to have anything decent to say.
12-27-2004, 04:51 PM
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I never said fast=good, but Car and Driver did rate the new Corvette as better then the new Carrera, so how about you quit pulling stuff out of your a** and grow up.
Hmmm....as if Car and Driver isn't biased at all.
These are the same people who constanly quote 1/4 mile times that are far from real life. My fav was some of the EVO 8 ringers they got their hands on during teh big Mitsu. push.
Trap 105 my @ss.
Dude to say the C6 is "just as good" is the most innacurate blanket statement I have heard in a while and I think it deserved a laugh so no apoligies here.
I think the C6 is a marvel in performance but I think the extra 25K is VERY warranted. Bersides the prestige and respect that goes along with the Porsche name the Porsche has a far better interior...higher quality NON GM parts and a hand built motor that is storked and engineered to German perfection...not an oversized 6.0 liter V8 which which produces comprable numbers mostly due to its advantage in displacement.
Havent read this article BUT.....Let me guess...the review from Car and Driver gave it to one or the other by a hair...am I right? What a surprise!!
Just close enough for the Porsche driver to make my argument and ego stroking enough for the larger American car maker to keep pumping out Vettes in record numbers.
IMO car and Driver has about as much loyalty to truth as a politician during an election campaign. Now show me a review from "Car" or another prestigeous car mag and I will give it a second look.
12-27-2004, 04:59 PM
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By the way American car bias is nothing new from Car and Driver:
http://www.web-cars.com/gto/c-d_pf-gto.php
Some quotes for the lazy people like me
"News Flash!
It turns out the Pontiac GTO tested by car and driver was quite a ringer. It actually featured a Super Duty 421 featuring 370 hp and was breathed on quite heavily by Royal Pontiac, a noted Pontiac GTO tuner with connections to the Pontiac engineering staff. Since the 421 is visually identical to the 389, the fix was believeable. For more info, visit http://www.contes.com/ccvmore.htm and scroll to the bottom."
"The Car and Driver staff may not have succeeded in their quest to match up the two legendary cars, but they did manage to put the magazine on the map. The issue was controversial and sales skyrocketed. The April 1984 "GTO vs. GTO" article paid homage to it's 20 year old predecessor, calling it "The hook on which we hung a magazine".
http://www.web-cars.com/gto/c-d_pf-gto.php
Some quotes for the lazy people like me
"News Flash!
It turns out the Pontiac GTO tested by car and driver was quite a ringer. It actually featured a Super Duty 421 featuring 370 hp and was breathed on quite heavily by Royal Pontiac, a noted Pontiac GTO tuner with connections to the Pontiac engineering staff. Since the 421 is visually identical to the 389, the fix was believeable. For more info, visit http://www.contes.com/ccvmore.htm and scroll to the bottom."
"The Car and Driver staff may not have succeeded in their quest to match up the two legendary cars, but they did manage to put the magazine on the map. The issue was controversial and sales skyrocketed. The April 1984 "GTO vs. GTO" article paid homage to it's 20 year old predecessor, calling it "The hook on which we hung a magazine".
12-27-2004, 06:03 PM
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Originally posted by 350zluvr
a 4-car lead within a 60 mph range is a huge difference.
Speaking of overpaying for the name, what other track ready 3.6 liter engine do you know of that produces 381 hp and 185 lb/ft of torque for $90,000? Not to even mention the handling. I love my Z and would probably never give it up for anything, but Porsches are in a completely different league altogether and that is the reason for the price tag.
by the way, there is no such thing as a 911 S-type. Porsches do not resemble Acuras or Hondas in their name badging. The vehicle's name is 911 Carrera S or 911C2S.
a 4-car lead within a 60 mph range is a huge difference.
Speaking of overpaying for the name, what other track ready 3.6 liter engine do you know of that produces 381 hp and 185 lb/ft of torque for $90,000? Not to even mention the handling. I love my Z and would probably never give it up for anything, but Porsches are in a completely different league altogether and that is the reason for the price tag.
by the way, there is no such thing as a 911 S-type. Porsches do not resemble Acuras or Hondas in their name badging. The vehicle's name is 911 Carrera S or 911C2S.
actually i used to have a 924S '87 model
12-27-2004, 06:06 PM
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Originally posted by EnthuZiast
By the way American car bias is nothing new from Car and Driver:
http://www.web-cars.com/gto/c-d_pf-gto.php
Some quotes for the lazy people like me
"News Flash!
It turns out the Pontiac GTO tested by car and driver was quite a ringer. It actually featured a Super Duty 421 featuring 370 hp and was breathed on quite heavily by Royal Pontiac, a noted Pontiac GTO tuner with connections to the Pontiac engineering staff. Since the 421 is visually identical to the 389, the fix was believeable. For more info, visit http://www.contes.com/ccvmore.htm and scroll to the bottom."
"The Car and Driver staff may not have succeeded in their quest to match up the two legendary cars, but they did manage to put the magazine on the map. The issue was controversial and sales skyrocketed. The April 1984 "GTO vs. GTO" article paid homage to it's 20 year old predecessor, calling it "The hook on which we hung a magazine".
By the way American car bias is nothing new from Car and Driver:
http://www.web-cars.com/gto/c-d_pf-gto.php
Some quotes for the lazy people like me
"News Flash!
It turns out the Pontiac GTO tested by car and driver was quite a ringer. It actually featured a Super Duty 421 featuring 370 hp and was breathed on quite heavily by Royal Pontiac, a noted Pontiac GTO tuner with connections to the Pontiac engineering staff. Since the 421 is visually identical to the 389, the fix was believeable. For more info, visit http://www.contes.com/ccvmore.htm and scroll to the bottom."
"The Car and Driver staff may not have succeeded in their quest to match up the two legendary cars, but they did manage to put the magazine on the map. The issue was controversial and sales skyrocketed. The April 1984 "GTO vs. GTO" article paid homage to it's 20 year old predecessor, calling it "The hook on which we hung a magazine".
12-27-2004, 06:11 PM
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Wow, one article huh? Guess people should judge a magazine based on one article.
Is it not enough that by Car & Driver's own admission they used a ringer.
Can you not see the correlation between magazine sales and profit. Of course not
You think a C6 is just as good as the Porsche
Don't worrie newbie...just keep on mag racing and not questioning things in life...its much easier than thinking and experiencing things for yourself.
I tried to help.
