PDX_Racer

iTrader: (2)

Obviously you weren't at Nationals, so you didn't see me show up with my personal stuff (plus some of my race gear) in my Z and my tires and the rest of my "dry" race gear on a small (4x4) trailer -- after driving 1800+ miles (each way, and still getting 22+ MPG). Last year, I showed up with everything inside the car, but since I brought my family, we towed the Z on an open car trailer (that also gave my family something to "run around" in while I was participating at Nationals).

The first several months I had my Z, I toted everything *inside* the Z (4 275/35R18s plus tools and jack) -- I just couldn't take anyone with me. One tire in the spare tire well, one in front of the rear strut bar, two in the passenger seat area -- and there was still room for the spare on top of the tire in the spare tire well.

In stock class, the 350Z is properly classed in B Stock. It would be nice for a Street Touring class, but right now the only two-seater ST class is STS2 -- and the Z would absolutely decimate that class.

One thing that helps most of the other cars in Street Touring is that they are often come with relatively soft springs and lots of body roll. Increasing spring rates, lowering the car, changing sway bars, and increasing static negative camber help those cars quite significantly.

The 350Z does not suffer from soft springs or excessive body roll, and while it doesn't have a lot of static negative camber, the lack of body roll takes care of a lot of the need for gobs of static negative camber.

If you want to get the Z classed into STU, letters need to be written to the SEB (seb@scca.org). Ask for the Z to be classed into STU with a tire limit of 245-section-width tires, the same as the AWD sedans. Plan on showing up to at least one national tour (and preferably also the National Championships) to show support for the car in the class (and to show that the Z isn't an overdog with those restrictions). Also plan for the car to be low trophy material -- at best -- until it can be demonstrated that the car is no danger of upsetting the class.

terrasmak

iTrader: (8)

Hell no , let us have up to 275's like any other 2wd STU car. We would get stomped in STU with only 245's.

ULLLOSE

Not going to happen, doubt you would even get in the door on 245s. STU had 47 cars at natls, no way they are going to rock the boat by putting the Z in there. Maybe one day if STU numbers start to drop and they need a way to wake the class up, but not now.

You want to help your case, have someone fast (natl level fast not a second off the pace) drive an ST setup 350Z and come up with some data. This could mean you have to take one for the team at a natl event, by entering BSP in an "STU" setup Z just to show how fast it is. You have all year to come up with data, as no class changes can take place for 2008 anyway.

Keep in mind just because the natl rules say no does not mean you cant do it at local events. Your local club can make any rules they want, they can even let two seat cars run in STU. I hear one region in the NE may already allow this.

DriveI65

All of this talk of access to STU is to eliminate the need for carrying tires to an event but it doesn't.

Most street tire participants are changing tires at even regional events. They switch to a race set of street tires which are not generally driven on the street. Look around the paddock at the extra set of tires surrounding the STU guys & girls.

first350

iTrader: (24)

+1...there's a few guys in our local club that trailer their ST cars.

but ST classes allow ppl to be competetive w/out having to go through all of the trouble...it's virtually impossible to be anywhere near the top for non-street tire classes unless you have R-comps.

mw9

iTrader: (51)

This Sunday I will be in my first autocross in the BSP class on street tires. SO what I have been reading, to be competitive I will have to purchase some different tires?

tmak26b

How do you race with street tires on the Z? The car will just have endless amount of plow, power slide coming off the corner, yuck!

mw9

iTrader: (51)

I figured it would be alot of fun

DavesZ#3

iTrader: (26)

That all depends on what your competition is. You might well be competitive or you might be up against really prepared cars that you have no chance against. I could run BSP here and win all the time as there is virtually no other entries. Go out and have some fun. Lot's of fun. It will be a while before you have to worry about different (R-compound) tires. Get fast first!

first350

iTrader: (24)

+1...in many cases, the driver can make up the difference. But in a competetive group, R-comps are needed to keep up. (I've run the same course w/ both R-comps and street tires...there was more than a 2s difference on a 50s course)

If you're just starting, don't worry about being competitive, go out, have fun, and learn as much as possible. Street tires can be easier and more helpful in learning autoX (they tend to give more warning of the limits of traction and are usually more forgiving)...plus you won't have to spend lots of $$ and time on a 2nd set of tires/rims.

Z1NONLY

iTrader: (2)

I suspect that none of the other B-stock cars had to jump through such hoops. It doesn't seem right to make the Z do a song and dance just to run against cars from the same class. (Or faster A-stock class)

When you talk of not wanting to "rock the boat" it sounds like a "we four and no more" policy. That may be the politics of the present situation, but it doesn't make it right.

After all, I am willing to go head to head with S2k's, fully expecting them to be a bit faster than the Z. I don't want a class that guarantees victory for my car. I am asking for a street tire class and I don't think asking to compete against other B-stock and A-stock cars is unreasonable.

My third autocross event ever was a national SCCA event held here in Fort Myers. The one thing I remember most about that experience was how the top positions, in B-stock, were RX-8's and all the Z's were left fighting for the leftovers. I can't imagine that many RX-8 drivers are really worried about racing a Z with the same rules.

I just checked the results of the national 2007 solo event.....
http://www.scca.org/documents/result...0-%20Res31.pdf

B-stock: 9 RX-8's and then, in tenth place, the fastest 350Z....1.5 seconds off first!!!

And "they" don't want to let the Z's run against the RX-8's on street tires, straight up?????

I guess finding a "natl level fast not a second off the pace" Z/driver will be quite difficult.

ULLLOSE

Other BS cars not in STU: with back seat, 968, 944S2, 928, 911 all; without back seat, MR2 Turbo, M coupe, M roadster, C3 Corvette, Lotus Esprit, 2nd gen RX-7. Yep they opened the flood gates to STU only to leave out the Z.

I have heard many people say Lee was in the wrong Z this year, even though he was a very close 3rd at the Prosolo Finale (less than .2 out of 1st). Check the 2006 Natls results, when imho the best Z driver out there was only .1 away from the win. Notice that same guy in an RX-8 was further back in 2007. Do you think he forgot how to drive or does the Z just work better for him. Not trying to hate on Lee or Glen, but no one had the time in setting up the car and drove the Z like Carter. Look back at the last few years results and you can see Glen has found some time in the last year, I am sure some due to the new tire setup. Far as I know Lee only had this year in the car, I am sure he would also get faster. Without a doubt the fastest Z driver was not in one at the 2007 natls.

Even if both cars are 100% equal you will have more guys in the RX-8. The fast guys follow the money, and the Mazda program is way better than the Nissan one. Does not hurt that the RX-8 also cost less. If Nissan put up a better contingency plan you would see more fast guys in them.

ULLLOSE

While you are busy hating on the RX-8 take a look at the rules and see how it gets the shaft.... It is a 1.3Li NA motor, it is within the rules for STX yet it is excluded. While the WRX with AWD and a turbo, which makes more power than the RX-8, runs away with it.

While they may not all make sense to you or help your car, the ST classes are among the biggest at every event. It will take a lot of convincing to mess with that.

Z1NONLY

iTrader: (2)

One car takes the top 9 spots and you attribute that solely to the drivers? Yet if the Z, or any other car from A or B-stock, were to be competitive in STU and upset the balance of power, you (the SCCA) would attribute that to.......the car?????

It seems the Z (and all the other A and B-stock cars) will only be allowed into a street tire class if the can prove they will make good whipping boys for the existing cars. (RX-8's on 275's vs Z's on 245's???)

This is surreal.

If cars are evenly matched in the stock classes there should be a presumption of equality (or at least parity) carried over into subsequent modified classes. -Especially when there is absolutely no evidence to the contrary. As in this case, where the fear of a given car, like the Z, running rough-shot over other cars from the same feeder class is completely unfounded.

Z1NONLY

iTrader: (2)

RX-8 comes from B-stock and the A-stock AWD cars get hobbled with smaller tires. If they could close the power-mod loopholes of the turbo cars, it would probably level the playing field between the A-stock and B-stock cars that compete in STU. But hell, I would take that action, as the rules are set now.

And I am not hating on the RX-8. Never have.

ULLLOSE

If you look at the STU results you would see no one is going to be a whipping boy to the RX-8 in STU.

So you are going to tell me that the 350Zs at natls this year had the same level of car prep and quality of driver as the RX-8s? I stand by the 2006 results as to what can be done with a setup 350Z and the right driver. Hell even Glen got his head out of his @ss long enough to put down a dirty run faster than my winning time this year, yep them cars are turds.

I see very little support for including the Z in STU, and this is on a Z forum. It is going to take a lot more than a few post on this forum to make it happen. Better start getting every member you know to support your idea with a letter.

ULLLOSE

I was talking about STX, everyone is on the same size tire in STX and the Sti is not allowed either. The standard WRX, that is in STX, makes more power than an RX-8. imho the RX-8 should be in STX on 245s, but just because I think that does not make it so.

I know you were not hating, that is why I gave you the .

tmak26b

I guess I am the only person that hates plow through turn in and at the center, and then power slide coming out.

A stock RX-8 would have an advantage against a stock 350z on street tires due to the fact that they are a lot more netural and balance. ST would put the Z at a huge disadvantage unless you can find some good mods on it.

The only thing I wish for on the Z is a set of camber plates and a set of 17x9

ULLLOSE

You can have camber plates, or adjustable A arms in ST, that will help the Z. You can also upgrade your LSD.

PedalFaster

You'll be able to make a much more compelling argument of your point once you have enough seat time and experience to understand why both of these statements are totally false.