Reliability Stock Motor and FI
10-17-2018, 03:29 PM
#1
Reliability Stock Motor and FI
I was considering getting a Vortec S.C.
I'm looking to get a bump in HP for my track days. I'm tired of watching the V8's pull away from me on the straights.
What I'm worried about is messing up the reliability of the stock motor. I would want a conservative tune to keep it safe, but will I be looking to replace the motor sooner with it FI than none? 79k on it right now. 2005, 35th anniversary edition.
I'm looking to get a bump in HP for my track days. I'm tired of watching the V8's pull away from me on the straights.
What I'm worried about is messing up the reliability of the stock motor. I would want a conservative tune to keep it safe, but will I be looking to replace the motor sooner with it FI than none? 79k on it right now. 2005, 35th anniversary edition.
10-17-2018, 03:54 PM
#2
350Z/370Z Tech Moderator
MY350Z.COM
MY350Z.COM
FI ALWAYS puts more stresses on an engine. Period.
Pretty clear reason why mfgr’s turbo/SC engines are always built with more robust internals, seals, tolerances than their NA counterparts.
That said, however, if one takes the necessary precautions in a build by adding increased oiling, cooling, fuel tune (bigger injectors and fuel supply components to keep the motor from leaning out) plus, OF COURSE, proper re-tune of the entire motor function, e.g., timing, spark, etc., no reason your motor should turn into a grenade at the slightest hint of heavy right foot.
But, a certain amount of driver restraint is needed as well. Roll-in versus stomping, prolonged cooldowns, minding of the rev count, etc and you should be good.
I’ve built several turbo motors and have owned ~10 FI cars. Never broke a single one.
Pretty clear reason why mfgr’s turbo/SC engines are always built with more robust internals, seals, tolerances than their NA counterparts.
That said, however, if one takes the necessary precautions in a build by adding increased oiling, cooling, fuel tune (bigger injectors and fuel supply components to keep the motor from leaning out) plus, OF COURSE, proper re-tune of the entire motor function, e.g., timing, spark, etc., no reason your motor should turn into a grenade at the slightest hint of heavy right foot.
But, a certain amount of driver restraint is needed as well. Roll-in versus stomping, prolonged cooldowns, minding of the rev count, etc and you should be good.
I’ve built several turbo motors and have owned ~10 FI cars. Never broke a single one.
Last edited by MicVelo; 10-18-2018 at 06:48 AM.
10-17-2018, 04:32 PM
#3
350Z-holic
iTrader: (13)
I think it's common knowledge that the VQs will hold 450hp...
the vortech is a great option for making more power. If I was in your shoes look to push 8-10psi of boost pressure to create 400hp, maybe 425hp.
sorta what Mic said in that you'll do more damage sooner by neglecting and abusing the engine/components than you will by pushing output to 400hp.
Furthermore - give the car the components it needs. Adequate fuel injects that stay below 80% duty cycle (probably an 800cc) a quality fuel pump that will maintain fuel pressure (320lph+), consider a return fuel system, run an oil cooler, run a adequately sized intercooler, get a good tune that is efficient in low load areas of the map and supplies enough fuel in your high load areas, have conservative timing, plan on running shorter durations on your oil, let the car warm up and cool down adequately between driving sessions and see what others have done / are doing and mimic those habits.
the vortech is a great option for making more power. If I was in your shoes look to push 8-10psi of boost pressure to create 400hp, maybe 425hp.
sorta what Mic said in that you'll do more damage sooner by neglecting and abusing the engine/components than you will by pushing output to 400hp.
Furthermore - give the car the components it needs. Adequate fuel injects that stay below 80% duty cycle (probably an 800cc) a quality fuel pump that will maintain fuel pressure (320lph+), consider a return fuel system, run an oil cooler, run a adequately sized intercooler, get a good tune that is efficient in low load areas of the map and supplies enough fuel in your high load areas, have conservative timing, plan on running shorter durations on your oil, let the car warm up and cool down adequately between driving sessions and see what others have done / are doing and mimic those habits.
The following 2 users liked this post by bealljk:
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10-17-2018, 04:32 PM
#4
Seen a few boosted vqs get it on track, and not one was anywhere close to the reliability of stock. You may not blow it up, but the upkeep and constant tinkering can add up. Check out user 'Mooddude' or similar, he was boosted around '07 running around the track hard.
Are you trying to go faster or get better? Is your setup optimal? A reliable FI setup is worth quite a few sets of slicks if you just want to run with lightly prepped mustangs and c5 vettes. Most newer v8s will probably still have your number all things equal.
As they say...how fast can you afford to go?
Are you trying to go faster or get better? Is your setup optimal? A reliable FI setup is worth quite a few sets of slicks if you just want to run with lightly prepped mustangs and c5 vettes. Most newer v8s will probably still have your number all things equal.
As they say...how fast can you afford to go?
10-17-2018, 11:42 PM
#5
Registered User
I think it's common knowledge that the VQs will hold 450hp...
the vortech is a great option for making more power. If I was in your shoes look to push 8-10psi of boost pressure to create 400hp, maybe 425hp.
sorta what Mic said in that you'll do more damage sooner by neglecting and abusing the engine/components than you will by pushing output to 400hp.
Furthermore - give the car the components it needs. Adequate fuel injects that stay below 80% duty cycle (probably an 800cc) a quality fuel pump that will maintain fuel pressure (320lph+), consider a return fuel system, run an oil cooler, run a adequately sized intercooler, get a good tune that is efficient in low load areas of the map and supplies enough fuel in your high load areas, have conservative timing, plan on running shorter durations on your oil, let the car warm up and cool down adequately between driving sessions and see what others have done / are doing and mimic those habits.
the vortech is a great option for making more power. If I was in your shoes look to push 8-10psi of boost pressure to create 400hp, maybe 425hp.
sorta what Mic said in that you'll do more damage sooner by neglecting and abusing the engine/components than you will by pushing output to 400hp.
Furthermore - give the car the components it needs. Adequate fuel injects that stay below 80% duty cycle (probably an 800cc) a quality fuel pump that will maintain fuel pressure (320lph+), consider a return fuel system, run an oil cooler, run a adequately sized intercooler, get a good tune that is efficient in low load areas of the map and supplies enough fuel in your high load areas, have conservative timing, plan on running shorter durations on your oil, let the car warm up and cool down adequately between driving sessions and see what others have done / are doing and mimic those habits.
10-18-2018, 05:52 AM
#6
Thanks for all the input guys. I'm not new to boost, just boost and a 350z. I had a 2010 Camaro that I put a 2.9 Whipple on. It made 600WHP. I also have a 2009 Pontiac Solstice Coupe, but that's turboed from factory.
I never had an issue with the Camaro and the Solstice is still running strong. I just didn't want to add boost to a Z without doing my research in the reliability aspect.
As for track days. I am on the V8's asses in the corners, but when a straight comes they just pull right past me. Lap after lap the same thing, until I start being aggressive in the corners until they let me past.
I never had an issue with the Camaro and the Solstice is still running strong. I just didn't want to add boost to a Z without doing my research in the reliability aspect.
As for track days. I am on the V8's asses in the corners, but when a straight comes they just pull right past me. Lap after lap the same thing, until I start being aggressive in the corners until they let me past.
10-18-2018, 06:54 PM
#7
There is usually quite a bit of time in setup and driver training/data analysis. Usually that and some sticky are enough to take care of most HPDE v8s. They seldom keep up in TT warmup and last chance sessions with Nasa, which are run combined with the HPDE4 group.
And in TT you dont have that issue too often, because 1) you grid based on time and 2)all drivers are aware that even though the track is open TT is still technically not w2w racing, and DE rules still apply...
In these instances, taking another progressive warm up lap, creating some distance, never hurts and is better than risking what can go wrong riding up someones fangul. Front lockup, abs issues, mechanical, unflagged debris/oil/coolant...all of which have happened to me and happen to most throughout the course of their track life. Some lessons are harder learned than others, mostly due to blind luck has been my experience.
Sorry not sure what groups you run but just food for thought...and just for the record you are free to go as fast as you want. Dont let the man hold you down...man.
And in TT you dont have that issue too often, because 1) you grid based on time and 2)all drivers are aware that even though the track is open TT is still technically not w2w racing, and DE rules still apply...
In these instances, taking another progressive warm up lap, creating some distance, never hurts and is better than risking what can go wrong riding up someones fangul. Front lockup, abs issues, mechanical, unflagged debris/oil/coolant...all of which have happened to me and happen to most throughout the course of their track life. Some lessons are harder learned than others, mostly due to blind luck has been my experience.
Sorry not sure what groups you run but just food for thought...and just for the record you are free to go as fast as you want. Dont let the man hold you down...man.
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10-19-2018, 08:23 AM
#8
With constant abuse, would it be ideal to get the V3 over the V2?
I grenaded my previous V2 from aeration of constant roll races so I wonder if a contained unit would be more ideal. If you're that worried then the 3.33 pulley should save you from any concern honestly.
I grenaded my previous V2 from aeration of constant roll races so I wonder if a contained unit would be more ideal. If you're that worried then the 3.33 pulley should save you from any concern honestly.
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0taku (10-20-2018)
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OldManZ350 (10-24-2018)
10-31-2018, 02:15 AM
#13
Registered User
Did you already get an answer? If you have a 7k rpm rev limit instead of 6600, its a revup, also the camshaft covers on the top front of the engine looks different from De Nonrev to revup, DE looks more pearshaped, Revup looks like two Orange slices beside each other. Hilarious comparison/example but i hope you understand.
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Franknbeans (10-31-2018)
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