Just when you think you are done spending money...
Well, I literately just finished installing my suspension I have been waiting for months to finally get it all together. Finally installed it all and took it to the alignment shop to get it aligned, drove back to my place, dropped off some stuff, on the way to the gas station, I was going 145ish (ya ya ya, I shouldn't do that on roads) and I noticed that the rpms were staying the same, and speed was dropping off... heard a ticking at the gas station but thought something might have been loose on my new suspension. Made it back to my friend's place and left the motor running and got out and there it was, my motor knocking away... I do drive the piss out of my car and I can't really say I didn't expect it, but it was sooner than I thought. So, just when I thought I spent the last dollar on modifying my 350z, the motor is giving up. So here I am in the NA forum, about to do a NA build on my daily driver. Nothing too crazy though. Here is a basic list
Wiseco Pistons 11.0:1 Ceramic/Moly Coated Eagle Rods JWT C8 272 cams w/springs ATI Fluid Dampner crank pulley Rev up Oil pump ARP Head Studs Along with all the bearings (coated), gaskets and machine work that is involved with a rebuild. Balanced and blueprinted CD009 Transmission (have one collecting dust) ALSO, I was wondering what areas I should look into to make it safe to rev to 8,000 and if I should go to a rev up lower plenum And ball parking from my previous dyno of 269.1hp/249tq I am hoping for 315+hp and I am not really sure what to expect from torque. Previous dyno had the following mods -OBX Longtube headers -Ebay HKS knockoff exhaust -Z1 Angled Plenum Spacer -ported lower manifold, lower plenum, upper plenum and polished TB -Fujita Intake -tuned by uprev themselves in Austin TX -JWT clutch/flywheel |
RPM's stayed the same but speed dropped off, sounds more like the clutch is letting go.
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How many miles are on the engine?
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you sound fairly knowledgeable, so i assume you may have thot of this already....but i still gotta say. theres alot of things the VQ does that sound "kinda" like rod knock.
Even detonation and misfire sounds like rod knock at 4k. Now sitting and idling..not sure.... may still be clutch issues... rod knock is more audbile from under the car than above..try that.. may save yourself a crap load of money. pull your plugs.. see if theres oil in the tubes etc.. etc etc.. but id jack it up and listen underneath before i bought new engine internals. |
A N/A pull to 145 could have easily cooked your bearings if you're not running an oil cooler...just sayin.
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Clutch is still fairly new, the sound is very audible at idle, but speeds up as I rev it, I am not trying to dick with it too much, just too much of a chance of having a catastrophic failure. It is loud, you can hear it in the car, and you can feel it when you put your hand on the intake manifold. There are 73k miles on it, and I have been having oil issues with it, not leaking anywhere, but it has been burning about 2+ quarts of oil every 3k miles. The oil was only 300 miles old when it happened and it is still full on oil right now.
I do plan on pulling the plugs, and letting them tell the story hopefully and also doing a compression test, I have been on a bit of a vacation and have been kinda lazy about finding out specifics. ANYWHO, I hate buying package deal stuff, BUT, I saw this on Z1motorsports. http://www.z1motorsports.com/350_g35...oducts_id=4265 and possibly this, I am actually aiming for this one because I do want ARP hardware and the valve seals arn't a bad idea either since I might have messed up a valve or 2 if it is valve on piston contact. http://www.z1motorsports.com/350_g35...oducts_id=4266 |
I would get the car checked out before dumping more money in it. That's just me... It could be as simple as a vacuum leak.
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I really doubt my car would be knocking because of vacuum, but eh, I am already knee deep in the build, like I said, I was kinda planning it anyways and it excites me to have a motor and tranny I can trust to put through it's paces rather than one that worries me. I purchased the cams today and tomorrow the rest should be purchased.
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what cams did you go with?
good luck with the build. |
JWT C8's I think the 272 cams will be perfect for what I want, I can daily drive on it but also have awesome HP at the top for when I track it, and I want to raise my idle anyways because of the JWT clutch/flywheel noise.
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Get rid of the UR crank pulley. It doesn't dampen vibrations and is potentially harmful to your motor during high RPM. ATI, Fluidampr, and even the stock OEM crank pulleys are all dampened.
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Funny you should bring this up, I have added the ATI fluid dampner to my list on my computer for just that reason, and it will make it alot easier to time than the UR
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Originally Posted by Classy
(Post 9052390)
Clutch is still fairly new, the sound is very audible at idle, but speeds up as I rev it, I am not trying to dick with it too much, just too much of a chance of having a catastrophic failure. It is loud, you can hear it in the car, and you can feel it when you put your hand on the intake manifold. There are 73k miles on it, and I have been having oil issues with it, not leaking anywhere, but it has been burning about 2+ quarts of oil every 3k miles. The oil was only 300 miles old when it happened and it is still full on oil right now.
I do plan on pulling the plugs, and letting them tell the story hopefully and also doing a compression test, I have been on a bit of a vacation and have been kinda lazy about finding out specifics. ANYWHO, I hate buying package deal stuff, BUT, I saw this on Z1motorsports. http://www.z1motorsports.com/350_g35...oducts_id=4265 and possibly this, I am actually aiming for this one because I do want ARP hardware and the valve seals arn't a bad idea either since I might have messed up a valve or 2 if it is valve on piston contact. http://www.z1motorsports.com/350_g35...oducts_id=4266 Which kit did you go with? |
Originally Posted by RudeG_v2.0
(Post 9053357)
Get rid of the UR crank pulley. It's not harmonically balanced and is potentially harmful to your motor during high RPM. ATI, Fluidampr, and even the stock OEM crank pulleys are all harmonically balanced.
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^ Check my edit above.
It's a topic that has been discussed a lot over the years, especially in the FI section. Here's a few quotes that discuss the risks and arguments against running an undampened crank pulley such as the UR pulley, as well as the reasons/benefits for running an ATI or Fluidampr crank pulley.
Originally Posted by QuadCam
(Post 5128924)
fluidamper or the ATI damper are both great units.
there are torsional vibraqtions and harmonics that occur due to the forces applied duing each combustion process in each cylinder. These devices are designed to absorb the vibrations. these vibrations can cause major fluctuations in valve timing and can ultimately cause a crank failure.
Originally Posted by phunk
(Post 5133074)
good luck proving a dampner or lack thereof destroyed the engine. just run one, who cares about the wimpy power gains from running an aluminum one. it isnt worth any potential risk. if a solid metal pully was adequate, why didnt our car come with one? surely it would be a lot easier to make a plain solid one than to put a dampner in it.
Originally Posted by Hal@Dynosty
(Post 5877938)
From memory (which is poor), the ATI uses 9 bolts, all loctighted and 6 of them are taper heads for more sealing surface. I don't have any fear of it coming apart, and it is serviceable for long life. Having used both, the ATI is my preference though I personally run a Fluidampr on my car. You can't lose with either of them.
Completely necessary - that is up to you all. I would advise using one on a built motor, and heavily advise against the unorthodox-style crank pulley on a built motor.
Originally Posted by XKR
(Post 8047761)
I have the Fluiddampr ...... I used to have the UR ... But it caused some crank damage. Stock is better than that UR.
Originally Posted by str8dum1
(Post 8343270)
the stock pulley is balanced for the stock redline. if you plan on exceeding that, then a aftermarket dampened pulley is a good idea.
The UR pulley just isn't worth the risk IMO, especially if the OP is building his motor. |
I completely agree, I was going through my head yesterday about everything I need to do to build a high revving motor, and flipping through some sites, I saw the ATI and I felt dumb for not thinking about it! No, there is no solid proof that an all aluminium pulley will damage your engine, and I still feel that for someone who is just bolting on a few things, that it isn't that big of a deal. BUT if you go FI or raise your redline like I am, then the roll of the pulley to balance your crank is much more needed.
I am probably going to pull the trigger on the Z1 stage 3 motor rebuild kit today, Wiseco Pistons 11:1 Piston Ring set Wrist pins Eagle Rods with caps Cometic Head Gaskets (stock thickness) ACL Engine Bearings (Rods, Mains, Thrust) ARP Head And Main Stud Kits Z1 Viton Valve Seals and find an ATI pulley today probably too. |
Lol, Stance coils from Japan
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Thanks for mentioning you were doing 145mph, that really made the thread an experience for me.
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That ain't classy!
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GL OP...hope to see ya at mineral wells soon or perhaps at one of the auto-x events..
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