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HR gains from intake? (still false advertising?)
why are sellers still claiming HP and torque gains? are they going off sound or something. i keep running across post in the marketplace and they have one in particular that claims 16hp and 16 ft.lbs of torque and of course no dyno. . . from everything ive read ive actually come to the conclusion that there is a power loss beyond a reason of a doubt with all applications? are they dynoing cars that are FI with these intakes and these are the numbers being claimed or is it just false advertisement? its actually quite upsetting cause i hear alot of people buy these and end up just taking them off.
If it was a cheap mod to do i would say oh well and not even worry about it, but some of these intakes run up to 600$+. I'd be pretty pissed off if i bought something that promises gains and doesnt deliver. |
how else would they sell it...
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Originally Posted by krono
(Post 7731619)
why are sellers still claiming HP and torque gains?Because they want to sell you the intake. are they going off sound or something. i keep running across post in the marketplace and they have one in particular that claims 16hp and 16 ft.lbs of torque and of course no dyno. . . from everything ive read ive actually come to the conclusion that there is a power loss beyond a reason of a doubt with all applications? No, I believe the only intakes that have shown a slight gain were the injen CAIare they dynoing cars that are FI with these intakes and these are the numbers being claimed or is it just false advertisement? Pretty much impossible to dyno these intakes with turbos :confused:, but you are correct on false advertising.its actually quite upsetting cause i hear alot of people buy these and end up just taking them off.
If it was a cheap mod to do i would say oh well and not even worry about it, but some of these intakes run up to 600$+. Even the Injens are not that expensive, dont take "retail" prices from online stores. They are usually trying to rip you off.I'd be pretty pissed off if i bought something that promises gains and doesnt deliver. |
Are you guys tuning after installing your intakes? I keep hearing this all over these boards but I have a hard time believing that Stillen, Jim Wolf, AEM, and K&N ALL provide negative gains...
I still have yet to acquire an aftermarket intake so I can't speak from experience, but seriously. Injen can't be the ONLY intake that works... That's ludicrous. |
Originally Posted by TheOtherRob
(Post 7731681)
You can always just add K&N filters and call it a day, or spend the money on the injens like most HR owners seem to be doing.
chancewarren: injen isnt the only one that claims gains. I'm honestly thinking the gains are through F/I modded engines hence why they will never show the dynos and how they get away with advertising gains. spoke to someone reputable and he said the same thing that you would definetely see gains if you were FI. |
Originally Posted by ChanceWarren
(Post 7731761)
Are you guys tuning after installing your intakes? I keep hearing this all over these boards but I have a hard time believing that Stillen, Jim Wolf, AEM, and K&N ALL provide negative gains...
I still have yet to acquire an aftermarket intake so I can't speak from experience, but seriously. Injen can't be the ONLY intake that works... That's ludicrous.
Originally Posted by krono
(Post 7732964)
yea i already know about the k&n drop ins which is the path i am goign to take, but i just cant get over the fact that they keep on false advertising. . . and if it's not false advertisements i want to know what circumstances they are using to provide gains.
chancewarren: injen isnt the only one that claims gains. I'm honestly thinking the gains are through F/I modded engines hence why they will never show the dynos and how they get away with advertising gains. spoke to someone reputable and he said the same thing that you would definetely see gains if you were FI. |
OP I agree with you about it being false advertising. No intake will get you 15+hp gains. I recommend keeping the stock intakes on the HR, but if you're going to replace them then I suggest buying Injen. Due to the design of the Injen ones being located directly in front of the radiator, they seem to work better than the stock ones. They add power on the top end.
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I'll concede that most of the setups in question are not shielded from the heat created by the engine and that the stock boxes are taking air from outside the engine bay, but that still doesn't make any sense... Aren't the Stillen CAIs boxed as well (like the OEM?) Why would they be detrimental? And what about the fact that all the after market setups are using smooth, mandrel bent (esque) tubing as opposed to the OEM's bendy straws, promoting less restricted airflow?
I'm going out on a limb here... but if you guys aren't getting any improvement with Stillen's CAI, considering it's nothing if not an improvement over stock from an engineering standpoint... You must be doing something wrong. Granted, I'm not saying you should get 15+hp, but SOME improvement should be expected. And all I ever hear is, "Injen is the only CAI system that adds any power! Everything else REDUCES power! Bah! :icon6::icon23::icon22::gotowned:" |
IMHO I feel intakes are a waste of money! Some members say headers are a waste of money!!! But me personally, I believe its intakes. I bought into it @ first. I bought the Nismo intakes.. Started reading threads with Dyno's claiming there were no gains.
Then the Injen's came out. I bought into those as well... I just dropped some K&N's in and called it a day! Much cheaper! I have all the sound from my exhuast that I need ;) No intrest in sacrificing any bottom end to gain alittle whistle from an intake. lol To each their own but I'll remain with the stock air boxs. Just IGNORE the silly advertisements with absured claims!!!! |
^so true!
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Originally Posted by krono
(Post 7732964)
chancewarren: injen isnt the only one that claims gains.
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My Injen's gained good power. Especially after UPREV tuned my car for them.
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My experience with Injen CAI's is all positive. I go through my gears quicker. It sounds mean. Looks good. Feels good...
With stock air boxes, in 1st gear at 3,000rpm i would be at 14mph. (5,300 ft elevation) With Injen CAI's, in 1st gear at 3,000 rpm i would be at 18mph. (5,300ft elevation) Yeah, not THAT big of a difference, but there IS change. And the benefit will increase when i get a tune. Is it worth the money?!?!? Only the buyer can decide that... It was worth it to me. But what do i know, i'm just human. |
Originally Posted by TheOtherRob
(Post 7733135)
Yes, I did tune after installing all my bolt on's. The reason that those intakes you mentioned dont seem to produce gains on a dyno is because the filters are located right inside the hot engine bay sucking in hot air. The injens have the advantage of being located out into the front bumper out of the engine bay. Just because an intake does not make power on a dyno does not mean that its not making power when the car is moving at say 60mph. Now, if you are happy with spending money on the AEM or JWT intake and not seeing gains or very minimal gains on the dyno, then that choice is yours. I believe that the only dual intakes that have made some power on a dyno were the injens. Read any HR NA power thread and everyone is either running the injens or the filters on oem intakes.
Why do you keep bringing up FI, you do realize that every single intake mentioned in this thread will not work with any 350z turbo kit on the market, de or hr motor. I am sure that each manufacture has tested the intake on the dyno, whether or not you believe the numbers is up to you. Rob... you do realize that the Z is designed to flow air directly to the intakes. No need to have the filters located outside the engine bay to accomplish getting ambient air to the filters. CAI's FTL on the Z. On the other hand, my 02 civics intake has no way of getting air other than from the engine bay so in that car CAI's FTW. |
Originally Posted by biggersNISMO
(Post 7733941)
With stock air boxes, in 1st gear at 3,000rpm i would be at 14mph. (5,300 ft elevation) With Injen CAI's, in 1st gear at 3,000 rpm i would be at 18mph. (5,300ft elevation) Yeah, not THAT big of a difference, but there IS change. And the benefit will increase when i get a tune. |
^^^ The only thing i added was the Injen Intakes. Nothing else...
Might be my throttle position |
On my car at least, the stock tune was not happy with the Fujita intakes. A/F was in the low 10s/high 9's on the dyno with just those intakes and a Tanabe exhaust. I was making probably less than stock power.
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Originally Posted by Nexx
(Post 7733949)
Rob... you do realize that the Z is designed to flow air directly to the intakes. No need to have the filters located outside the engine bay to accomplish getting ambient air to the filters. CAI's FTL on the Z. On the other hand, my 02 civics intake has no way of getting air other than from the engine bay so in that car CAI's FTW.
What I said: Yes, I did tune after installing all my bolt on's. The reason that those intakes you mentioned dont seem to produce gains on a dyno is because the filters are located right inside the hot engine bay sucking in hot air. The injens have the advantage of being located out into the front bumper out of the engine bay. Just because an intake does not make power on a dyno does not mean that its not making power when the car is moving at say 60mph. Now, if you are happy with spending money on the AEM or JWT intake and not seeing gains or very minimal gains on the dyno, then that choice is yours. I believe that the only dual intakes that have made some power on a dyno were the injens. Read any HR NA power thread and everyone is either running the injens or the filters on oem intakes. I think you see the keyword here: Dyno I do understand what you mean, but I purposely mentioned dyno results, not driving results. |
So you dont have any of the intakes mentioned, but you insist that all the people that have actually "owned" these intakes and have come back to this forum and posted their results are full of bs because it does not compute to your logic? So the people that installed the Stillen CAI's have all done something wrong if they have not gained any power? Did you ever stop and think that maybe adding an intake without tuning the car could be an issue? Like said above, the Fujitas messed with the a/f and caused the car to run a little more rich than factory. Same thing when I too had the fujitas, running rich. Bad design? I dont know, I am not an engineer on building intakes. But I know that my a/f leaned out a bit with the injen and then even more with HFC's and it was all smoothed out and corrected with UpRev Osiris. Now the car pulls hard and has phenomenal response compared to stock. Maybe I will make a thread if I ever put my stockers back on and dyno the car back to back to see if the Injens make more power or not on MY setup.
Originally Posted by ChanceWarren
(Post 7733474)
I'll concede that most of the setups in question are not shielded from the heat created by the engine and that the stock boxes are taking air from outside the engine bay, but that still doesn't make any sense... Aren't the Stillen CAIs boxed as well (like the OEM?) Why would they be detrimental? And what about the fact that all the after market setups are using smooth, mandrel bent (esque) tubing as opposed to the OEM's bendy straws, promoting less restricted airflow?
I'm going out on a limb here... but if you guys aren't getting any improvement with Stillen's CAI, considering it's nothing if not an improvement over stock from an engineering standpoint... You must be doing something wrong. Granted, I'm not saying you should get 15+hp, but SOME improvement should be expected. And all I ever hear is, "Injen is the only CAI system that adds any power! Everything else REDUCES power! Bah! :icon6::icon23::icon22::gotowned:" |
I've called people out for parroting information before, without providing proof. "__don't make power"
More than half the people who are quoted saying such, have no personal experience with said products, and have seen no proof to support the statement. I've seen it with headers, now with intakes on the HR. Just assume the forum is filled with idiots (and it is) and do your own research. There are a couple of dyno's floating around which can provide you with some basis of comparison. That in itself is more reliable than word of mouth. |
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