Name other cars in the 35k to 40k range that are comparable.

The WRX is a good comparison on paper, but in the end, is a tricked out 20k econobox. A _fantastic_ deal on a great car, but hardly qualifies as direct competition unless your whole life is done "a quarter mile at a time". I was close to buying one, but the styling got on my nerves. It was a bit too overdone, too ricey.

The only BMW you can get in the right range is 330 [or lower], and while a nice car, is not going to get the looks or performance that a Z is out of the box. The RX-8 styling is a bit overworked. The Mustang is too old.

I was your age when the last generation Z was released. I always wanted one, but it was hardly within my price range, and it was completely impractical for many things. Life's different now -- I do lots of driving by myself in my line of work, and I want something fun, but that doesn't bust the bank. The only 2 cars on the marked that produce anything close to the Zs performance at or less than the cost of the Z is the stang and the WRX. The stang is getting a new chassis for the `04 year, so buying one now would be kinda silly. The WRX sti, which will likely beat the Z are only made in very limited quantities starting early next year... and you better hope you've been on a waiting list for at least 6 months for that one cuz there's only about 4k of them for all of north america.

 

I think you have a good point. When/if the Z gets to be more mainstream, then we will see test drives.

I think we are still getting over the initial pre-order stage.

Todd

 

I have driven all the cars mentioned in your post, and I bought the 350Z. The WRX feels EXTREMELY cheap. When I got out of that car and got into my '95 240SX it felt like I was in a luxury car. The only reason the WRX has a 0-60 anywhere near the Z is because of the AWD launch.. try launching the car at a moderate RPM and you will be owned by a 350Z. The Celica didn't really do anything for me.. I didn't like the seating position and the engine had NO torque. It is cool being able to rev the motor to 8 grand, but I didn't like having to beat it to get some sense of power.
I also drove and M3 and a BMW 330Ci, and I liked the Z better than these also. It was a very hard choice between the BMWs and the Z. The BMWs are nice on the inside, and they have that prestige factor, at least where I live. The biggest problem with the BMWs was the price. I actually liked the 330Ci a bit more because I thought it was more car for the money and had a more useful torque band for daily driving. However, with the cost of the Z and the looks/performance, it was just too much to resist. Everyone I've shown the car to loves it, and it is awesome to drive. I haven't regretted my decision once, and I'm sure if you get a Z you won't either.

 

if you want to get real nitpicky about being accurate in replying and reading posts, if i said in the original post that i was 15 when the 300zx's were out that means i'm in my early 20's now

My fault!! I was trying to think of some reason why you may not be getting much cooperation in the way of a test drive. Guess thats not the reason. Actually, some dealers probably still don't think of you as a "serious" buyer, even at 20. I'm 23, and believe me, I still occasionally run into that problem! Hell, the salesman at my local dealership would have probably been the same way towards me, if I wouldn't have told him everything he knows about the Z. Guess he figured with all my research, I must have been pretty serious. Now he calls me every week!!

Anyway, no harm intended!!

 

Hear Hear to what 3rdpower said. You pretty much hit the nail on the head on what I wanted to say :-)

 

I was at my dealer today and I believe they were allowing prospective people take their showroom enthusiast for a test drive. Not all dealers are bad.

I'm not sure if you followed the design stages of the Z but the designers were very clear on making the new Z a true affordable sport car. I believe they said that they want the Z to feel "selfish" allowing only the driver and his/her passenger the experience. In fact they deliberately designed the door and seats so there were no hints of back seats.

Yeah... if you want to get a Z... it's not such a practical car. I don't think it was intended to be. The G35C or G35 is the pratical alternative to the Z if you want to stay in the same line. Also I think it was deliberate of Nissan/Infiniti to do the G35 coupe and Z. One is a sports car, one is the sports sedan. Nearly identical platform to suit both sets of customers w/o impacting either car line-up. Even the 300ZX was a 2-seater ( I think ).

 

well the local dealer has one in and i'm not going to push for a test drive but at least i get to look at the car and such. i'm going today and the guy wasn't as much of an a**hole as all the other people were. i really like the car and i just have to decide whether to look for a more useful auto like the jeep i have (i got used to 5 seats and the storage) or to go ahead and get a car that i actually would enjoy driving (350z) or wait for a few months and see which is what i'll do probably...

 

I'm not sure if you're still making payments on the jeep... but when I bought my Z, I kept my other car around. Insurance is about 1600 for both cars. One is liability only, the Z comprehensive. So as long as you got the jeep paid off, adding a new car to your budget may not be as bad as it seems.

I saw the Murano the other day. I liked it (even though it's an SUV class vehicle).

 

If the dealers won't let you test drive the car - you may want to look in the mirror. Your interpersonal communication skills may need a little polishing. You see, you pushed people for information here by placing them into a defensive posture with all your negative comments about the Z. A lot of people here have already purchased or have on order a Z. They come from a history of driving and appreciating cars like the 350Z, which it seems you are new to.

I shopped around at 5 local dealers in my area. All wanted over MSRP (which broke the deal), but two offered me a test drive. I declined since both cars were automatic and I want to drive a stick, which I now have on order. If you used the same manner of negative communication with the dealers you talked with as you appear to do here in anger, I don't blame them for not letting you test drive one of their vehicles.

Yes, the overall dealer experience with BMW, Infiniti or any high-end car market dealer will be better. That is just a fact, although you will pay for it in the long run. I am turning in my BMW for my 350 and I am not looking forward to returning to waiting for my car during oil changes as opposed to driving in a new X5 loaner from my BMW dealer. You are seeing the differences in dealers first hand on the sales side.

If you want a 350Z 2+2, write to Nissan. Then take a hard look at the G35. It is a 350Z that has been extended 10 inches to add those back seats. 7 less horse power should not make any difference to a person who is used to driving a jeep. The comment about comparing the Z to a Celica is so far out I am not even going to touch it, even if it was made under rage.

It is clear you need to perform more research into the cars. This should be a staple of your environment if your enrolled at UNC. I don't know if you are, but you have an e-mail address and stated you are around 20 years old which is where I get my assumption. Instead of calling each dealer I visited 4 of the 5 local dealers on a Saturday morning and got more brochures than I can keep for myself. (Nice ones too, like 20 pages with a seal and cover instead of your 2 page pamphlet) I suggest that you go to an Infiniti dealer and sit in a G35 if you are looking for a sports coupe.

Also, try not to use your current, negative/defensive research method in any of your courses (unless required by sociology), you may fail to graduate. Just a little positive advice to counter your negative post.

 

dmcgibbo, what did u say u r driving/own now?

 

yeah well i dont know if i could afford the insurance. my jeep is paid off but i was looking more to replace it since its a 96 and has so many miles on it and its american made...

at the dealer the guy offered me a test drive b/c it was a car that had a deposit on it and the person drove and turned it down b/c they didn't like it. but then he found out that it already had a second deposit on it. the salesman was MUCH nicer, not an sob, and he owned a 96 300zx and actually liked the cars so he was a nice guy. i really like the 350z but will probably wait until next year since I cannot give up the utility of my jeep as a senior in college (moving out, hauling things and people, etc.) but am definitely thinking the Z will be my next car if i can afford it. hopefully by then they will be offering some of the options a la carte instead of having to get the touring/track mode which i can't afford. all in all it was a good dealer experience, i loved the dark grey color, and really like the auto. i don' tknow what i like about Z's but ever since i first saw one in '91 i took a liking to them. for now i'll just have to be jealous that you all get to own a Z and drive it around and i will have to wish for a miracle so i can get one soon. ttyl

 

when i was 21 i had a '78 280Z. lots of fun but no room. i was in school and needed to haul things around liks kegs. i went and bought a beater truck to use as my every day driver and weekend keg hauler this truck had the least amount of insurance i could get. Now i have a 350Z, and a truck. nothing changes. keep your jeep or something like it for ur daily driver and the 350Z for dates.
as to your questions about the 350Z i will tell you this. it does not seem as fast as it is. you never feel a surge of power it just gets faster and faster. very smooth power delivery. it does push in a hard turn, ie: your in over ur head. easy enough to fix. stiffer rear sway bar should do it. the car does drift to the right. it is a sports car and both front wheels are alighned with the same specs. this is so it will turn right just like its turns left. not go strght down the road like old farts car. just deal with it untill someone make a caster adjustment plate to correct the problem. the overall quality of the car is great. it is what i would expect for 30k. i would question if this was a 50k car but it is not. i can not say this car is for everybody. it is for people who want a fast car that handles like it was on rails and do not want to pay 45k or more for the like of a vette or bmw or any of the rest of the over priced snob cars. imho it is the best sports car for the $$ and i think you will find no real complaints from the Z owners on this site.
btw since you are not to far from SC you should be able to pick up a good used BMW in the greenville area from an employee. look around and see

 

You really need to find an oppty to drive the car, or at least ride with someone else.

As a former owner of a C5 and M5, I can say the 350Z is a great car.

The comparrisons to the Celica or Wrx are just silly - those cars are nothing like the Z.

While I can understand trying to get information about a car, doing it the way you have simply looks like trolling, not genuine interest in one of the great cars of the last 10 years.

ps - one more WRX troll and I'm going balastic. I hate that car and comparring it to the Z is just ludicrous.

 

Yawn. Isn't anyone else bored with people trying to start something when they have no idea what they're talking about?

 

Well, if you're looking for a car that's going to last you a while, go with the Z. We have an 82 280ZX with about 600,000 miles. (not sure exactly, odometer broke a while ago). And that's on the same engine. The car has not been babied, either, it has been driven in bad weather, and almost never gets an oil change. I expect my 350Z to have the same quality, too.

Nissan makes good cars. There's a reason that there are so many S-13 240SXs still on the road.

 

lol 600,000 miles? geez you got your money out of that one if that's accurate...

why do you think nissan is thought of as less than honda/toyota? i haven't heard any huge complaints or anything about nissan, but people just assume nissan isn't as good. you know ever since they discontinued the z32 nissans' brand image has decreased and i hope it goes back

edit - by the way some of the people that posted for their avatar they have keys - what is that? i saw a picture of the key and keyless entry after searching the forums but those keys look different - like its a combo keyless entry and key? what is it?

 

The following are quotes from dmcgibbo's post "why the 350Z sucks... " and below them are my responses:

1.
"However, it seems like the 350Z is once again just like the aging 300ZX - overpriced and not a phenomenal performer. For a few grand more you can buy a BMW that has much better sales, customer service, resale value, brand image, luxury/standard options, AND better performance." "Nissan had such opportunity with this car but although it is a nice car, I couldn't see spending almost $40k for a 2 seater that only holds two people (which would be fine if its goal was performance/sports car) but at the same time had lackluster performance (which would be fine if its goal was luxury/touring) and the car is mostly plastic and has cheap interior parts."

First of all, I don't know where you come up with $40k. Of course if you get the optional live-in service man who will wash your car and change your oil you could possibly get the price up to $40k. By the way most people end up paying $30k - $32k which is an incredible price. If these prices were adjusted for inflation to the early 90s when the 300zx came out, they would probably equate to about $18k-$20k which would have blown away the previous 300zx. By the way it's not fair to compare the absolute highes price +tax and tags with the low end of another car. Do you know that with enough options, you can get a Boxster for $80-$85k!! Then I can say why get a Boxster when you can get 911? Does that sound right?
Second, which BMW performs better? Certainly not the 325 nor the 330. None of the 3, 5, or 7 series. Oh you're talking about the M3? Have you checked that the Base MSRP price is $54,500! How does that compare to the Base MSRP price on the Z at $27k? It's only about $27.5k more...about the price of a second base Z! I'd be willing to bet an M3 with every possible option is probably $65k - $70k. I guess it is only a few more thousand...


2.
"I have always liked Z's and I like this new 350Z, but I was just asking why people don't think this car is overpriced and misdirected? I mean, if you want an affordable sporty, good performing car, why not get a Subaru WRX which is a much better deal, much faster/better handling, and fits more people?"

Get one if you want. In stock form it's still about 60 horses short. As it's been mentioned, the only reason it pulls those nice numbers is because of the hard launches you can get with AWD. From a rolling start, it doesn't compare to the Z. Also note the 1/4 mile times...not that close to the Z. In terms of handling, the Z wins hands down. The Z has some of the highest slalom times recorded recently. Also, the Z even beat an M3 on a track course (do a search). To top it off, it is only an opinion but many will agree, the Z is a much more beautiful car and has a much more 'expensive' feel to it. You're complaining about the Z being cheap...just take a look at the WRX. By the way the WRX base MSRP price is $23,695. This is about $3000 less than the Z. If you think that's a deal then go for it. The Z wins hands down without a doubt in my opinion.

3.
"If they introduce the TT it will be another few grand and once again it will be a $40-45k 2 seater car that doesn't have phenomenal performance or utility and the economy is slow and the same thing is going to happen to the ill-fated 300ZX."

If they do come out with a TT which doesn't seem probable at this time, no one can predict what the price will be. One thing is sure. With the current 350Z able to match the previous 300zx TT performance without a turbo, a Twin Turbo 350Z should be about (400 - 450 horses) and should be able to take on the Z06 and 99% of all cars out there. This sounds like phenominal performance to me don't you think?

4.
"...and a car that doesn't have that high quality or exclusivity in materials and is just a glorified Toyota Celica or something like that. What is the difference between the Toyota Celica and 350Z by the way? Why is the Nissan SO much more money?"

How about 107 extra horses and 144 extra ft-lbs of torque. How about rear wheel drive (a true sports car layout - try doing a nice drift with a front drive car). The Celica is $21,970. The Z is only about $5000 and is in a whole different league. Not even close to the Celica. Is this even a question?

5.
"...I was hoping for input from you all so that you could change my mind or give alternate viewpoints besides you suck Z's are awesome..."

Yeah, do a little research before you post something like "why the 350Z sucks...". How about "why you suck...". You don't know your facts, don't know how to compare apples to apples and go about making illogical statements. It's very insulting. Why not post something like: How does the WRX compare to the Z or what do you think about the Celica Vs the Z? Or what do you think about the price of the Z versus other cars? Nothing compares to the Z for it's price. Go buy your Celica, save yourself about $5k and spend about $10k to bring it's performance up to the Zs meanwhile voiding warranties and reliability and still not being as beautiful as the Z!

Kan-O-Z

 

The whole dealer attitude is giving this car a bad name. I was to several dealers that tried to screw me hard with the same fukd up attitude he refers to. This is an import in america they should be kissing our @sses, not the other way around. My z is due for delivery in late Jan early Feb. But I can appreciate what most of these people go through with the dealers. The highest quote for a 3yr lease I got was 680.00 a month with 3k down at 12k a year needless to say I told the dealer to **** off. Not all dealers are the same but no matter what the performance is on this car, All these storries will get out of the fourms and in headlines eventually. Then do you think everyone is going to have high reguards for this sports car, nawwwwwwwwww they will say Nissan is over priced garbage. So all the bad karma on this car can be traced back to all these bastard dealers. The Z shall live for the moment, but do you think it will sell at insane prices, and do you think Nissan will keep producing them if sales fall. I think not so enjoy your Z while you can................................

 

No need to start a new thread.

Threads merged.

-Ethan

 

Would you like some cheese w/ your whine? The only people who the dealers will give the car a bad name for are those who are too simple-minded to distinguish between Nissan and it's dealers, who Nissan has limited control over at best.

Dealers are a necessary evil, and it seems like all brands except Saturn have them. BTW, how is Saturn doing these days?

I had a hellish S2000 buying experience, but it doesn't diminish the ownership experience one bit.