rhino1

i run a small paint and body shop, insurance companies go off of a % of what the car is worth. its generally around 70-80% of what the car is worth. my 04 touring w/ 32k on it is worth, by nada, 17k (well thats what the bank told me when i went to get the loan for it a week ago), so it would rough take over 12k to total it. i have seen them fix some that the damages went well over 80% of the value of the car. a lot of the times its not the damage that totals a car, but the cost of parts and repair.

being that you are coming out of pocket, none of that matters. a written quote before they take it all apart isnt worth a dime really though. untill its taken apart, and every bit of damage can be evaluated, every plastic clip, every body panel, etc. the estimate is not finalized. if there is frame damage, it will need to be racked and they will have to messure it out before they will know where it needs to be pulled and how long they think it will take. most the time with insurance companies, the estimate is left open untill the car is roughly completed. we can send in an estimate the day we return it to the customer if need be.

if you do want to save it , find a shop that has good frame measuring equipment, i sub out my hard hits to a shop close to me because they have better measuring equipment than i do. a good computerized measuring system will tell the tech if the rails are to high, too low, to the left, to the right, etc. etc. so generally, if they have the right tools, the repair will be done properly. a lot of times the rear reinforsment bar and brackets will bend before it gets to the frame. if it did get past that point, it probably damaged the rear body panel and maybe the tub that holds the spare tire. our frame rate is 65 an hour. so yeah, it racks up some money fast.

rhino1

if he has liablity, nobody is going to total it. if insurance isnt paying for it, they do not care what you do with it. i have bought plenty of cars that people had liabilty on and got into accidents and didnt want to fix. i fix them and sell them.

trackstar19

Thanks for the responses again guys,vI think I'm just going to cut my losses and buy a new Z. Probably my best move in the long run. That being said... I finally was able to get ahold of the collision company to tell them I'm not fixing it through them (have been trying to get ahold of them since the 22nd).... the guy said "well fine but there will be a storage fee, removal of rear bumper fee, re attaching rear bumper fee.... it's gonna cost you 500-1000+ just for us to give you it back.


How the ***... can they do that? I asked for an estimate, I wanted my vehicle back the DAY after I got the estimate... I just could never get ahold of them. I understand charging me something for taking apart the back and looking at it... but storage fees?!? and 500-1000 bucks for an ESTIMATE?! Are they trying to hose me right now, or is this fair?!?

davidv

iTrader: (2)

Storage fee sounds like BS. A reputable shop will give you a no-charge estimate.

rhino1

storage fees are legal, i dont normally charge them to customers, unless i have tried to get them to pick up their vehicle and get no response. then i leave a message telling them what i am going to start doing, storage fee, then start from that point. they are either trying to make something cuss times are slow or they want to make it so that you dont pick it up, they can file papers for abandoned vehicle, get a title, fix it, then sell it, or drive it. they will basically make money for suckering you or they will get your car, legally, and do what they want with it. i would go there and ask to speak with the owner, see what you can get out of him. if that doesnt work, call the police and have them come and explain to them what happened, dropped car off for estimate, was told nothing about an estimate fee or storage, couldnt help that they were off for the holidays and see what they can help do.

most companies i know would not charge a estimate fee to a customer, taking the bumper off and putting it back on would be 1 hr- 1.5 hrs of labor. labor rate is 42 hr here. when i do charge storage, its generally 25 for outside storage and 35-40 for inside storage. plus, we generally charge insurance companies 60 for an estimate fee when they total one after we have wrote an estimate. 500-1000 is way over kill.

i would still get it back and keep it. i would find a desent shop and see if you could have it done in parts. fix this, pay for it, fix this, pay for it, etc etc. then you would have a spare car or could sell it as long as you dont spend too much on the repairs

Z_enthusiast

iTrader: (16)

I can vouche for everything he just said... i work at a body shop and we charge storage fees after customer is unreachable etc. and as far as estimating fee? ive heard of people doing that so you dont take that estimate and bring it elsewheres. but at our shop. youd be paying $0. id get police invloved if they are persistant... Never bring your car to a rinkadink place unless you want rinkadink service. Lesson learned lol

trackstar19

Thanks again guys for the responses, I'm clueless on this stuff so you guys have helped me big time! Secondly, the shop is located in a ford stealership. I was seeing if my insurance would cover it, and that was their preferred place to tow it to.

So I then find wont cover any of it (my fault for ony getting liability) and it's stuck there. I'm driving there tomorrow and getting this all settled. The place I bought it from offered me 5k for it as is, so I really do think it should only be a 2.5-4k fix job.

trackstar19

I'm RAGINGGGG right now guys. Wow. I rode over there on my cbr to try and get this all sorted out (sick of playing phone tag/having trouble reaching these people). So when I get there I see my car outside in the back. I decide to walk and check it out before going inside. The trunk was jerry rigged semi shut with phucking wire, the rear lights were not even there(just exposed wires in their place), the exhausts/pipes were sitting in my trunk, and the whole rear bumper looked like it was put on by a 5 year old... hastily at that. The ***?! At this point I was raging, but reminded myself to keep my composure and that yelling/being enraged will not get me anywhere.

So I go inside and say "I'm here to pick up my 350z"... the secretary finds the folder and says "dave(guy i've been dealing with/head shop guy) said there will be storage fees"... I then said "I will need to speak to Dave about that, among other things, as I had tried to get ahold of him and get my car out of here since the 22nd (day after he told me the estimate). His voicemail is full, and he never picks up. She was surprised his voicemail was full, but told me he won't be in until Monday. So here I am, stuck waiting until MONDAY now. So they expect me to pay between 500-1000+ dollars... and didn't reassemble the rear the way it was when I brought it in, or even close to it.

I had to cool down and call up my Dad since I had told him what had been going on, and needed to vent. (Didn't want to get on the bike raging that badly... last thing I need to do is something foolish on my bike.)

So, what should I do at this point guys? I'm beyond frustrated, this is the worst service I've ever experienced in my life. I make a living off marketing/SEO (search engine optimization)... so I was tempted to politely remind them that is how I make my living, and how I could legally tell my experience and thoughts on their company online, and be sure it's the first thing that pops up on google when anyone google's their collision shop. Is that a bad idea? I need a game plan for Monday. I am extremely fortunate for having you guys on this website to help me out, I would seriously be down a creek without a paddle SOL if it wasn't for you guys. If you ever need any help regarding computers (software/website side mostly), or working out (I'm a nationally ranked hurdler and amatuer bb'er... I'd be MORE than happy to help in any way I can.

Thanks again guys, sorry I just wrote a novel.

Netko350Z

iTrader: (8)

CRIDDA

iTrader: (10)

Sounds like they are trying to bend you over. GL

davidv

iTrader: (2)

Take a deep breath, and let it out slow. See you feel better already.

If you have an inoperable vehicle towed to my shop, and dropped off, I may charge you a storage fee. One, I have had the vehicle since 12/22. Two, there is no money in this for me. All I have is a busted down car on my lot.

Plan of action: Take a tow truck to the shop. Negotiate a reasonable storage fee. Get the hell out of there fast!

porschett

As an attorney, I agree, with one exception. I'd let the towing company know what's going on and call the police. If the towing company does business with this body shop, it may cause problems. Did you see any kind of notice at the body shop detailing storage fees? I would bet not. Call your Statae's Attorney Office and tell them the situation.

The bottom line is you want the car back fast and at the least amount of out of pocket exspense. Pay it if you have to and then take them to small claims court.

trackstar19

Thanks man, haha after quickly typing out my last response I hopped in my other car and went to the gym to let out all this frustration. And the thing is, it was technically operable, it just looked like possible frame damage, and I had a flat tire. I couldn't open the trunk to get to the spare tire (it was jammed a little from the accident) so I had it towed. With the donut on, or a new tire, it was completely operable.

So are they legally allowed to re-essemble the back without putting the rear lights or exhaust back how it was? It looks like after I told them i won't be going with them they just took 10minutes to shove the rear bumper back on (poorly) and let it sit in the back. There are also a lot more scratches on the rear bumper now.

Can I legally just go there with my friends tow truck tomorrow and take it? I mean I never signed anything and it is MY vehicle. Do I have to wait until Monday or pay their ridiculous 1000+ dollars for making my vehicle worse than it previously was?
I sort've posted my questions to you in the above response to davidv, but no there wasn't any talk of storage fees, nor did I see anything saying that. So I guess tomorrow I shall call the State's Attorny's Office and let them know. Can I legally take my vehicle back tomorrow with my friends tow truck? Do I need consent of the shop even though it's mine and I merely asked for an estimate?

Thanks! I feel so much better after that workout, just what the doctor ordered. I am sort of on a timeline getting this car fixed, as I need to drive it back to school mid January, so the sooner I can take it from their shop and bring it to my preferred shop the better.

Oh, and happy holidays everyone!

rhino1

if they do not have it posted about storage and you have not signed anything saying you agreed to it, I'd say you would have a good argument as to why you shouldn't be held to such high chargers. paying an estimate fee and some storage is one thing, but being told nothing about any of it and them throwing it at you because you dont want to have it repaired is another. explain to them that you arent taking it anywhere else, not that its there business, but that you have come to the conclusion that you could get another car for close to the same amount as having it repaired.

i dont take anything apart untill the customer or insurance co. says whos paying and that its ok to start the process. i give a estimate of what i think it will take to do the repairs and explain that 90% of the time the final number changes when i take it apart because there could be damage that i can not see. is dave the owner?

trackstar19

It is located in a ford dealership, but yes Dave is the person in charge of the body repair shop.

porschett

Yes, you have the legal right to take it at any time. I would still call the police and ask for a civial standby. If you haven't signed anything, there's nothing they can charge you for, with the exception of storage, and in most States, that must be clearly posted. Even if they have it posted, I believe you have a good case against them, since it was brought in for an estimate. Also, in most States, if the work involved is going to be over a cetain amount, you must sign a consent form before that work can begin. If you have signed something, you are entitled to a copy. If you have signed something, let me know and I'll look at it.

Z_enthusiast

iTrader: (16)

At our dealership theres a sheet of paper stating that you (the customer) is allowing the shop to work on that car. if you signed nothing of that sort then technically your car isnt there nor do they have permission to touch it.

And as for the bumper/tail lights, If my boss told me to do a quik tear down on this vehicle to look for hidden damage. id rip all the damaged parts off (bumper,lights,interior peices trim) then let estimator finish estimate then if customer wants car back they get the peices i took off the car off seperate. Us techs dont get paid if we tear a car down then u take it. so be glad the bumper was at least hung on lol.

ARMSTRONGARMS

iTrader: (65)

Still no F'ing pictures?

trackstar19

I didn't sign anything at all in any of this process. The only verbal agreement we had was that he couuld take the bumper off in order to give an accurate estimate. That was it. And haha after hearing that end part, duely noted. :P
I honestly remembered I should take pictures when I was about a mile away on my bike (both for this thread, and for my own having just in case). I was so upset I decided it would be best I didn't turn around and go back,and it would have to wait until tomorrow. Sorry. I'm taking my vehicle back tomorrow tho, and there will be all the pictures of everything.

Z_enthusiast

iTrader: (16)

well our bumpers require taking the lights out in order to remove bumper. id check the tail lights to see if they broke them... they break easily.