Spec_Tacular

The LSD is viscous? Liquid/Mechanically driven. Is there an electronic one as well? If so its news to me.

Pusha_Z

I do believe I got it from the Best Motoring video "The 350Z Shock" when Keiichi Tsuchiya takes it for a test drive. He also said something along the lines of "VDC is good for the novice driver looking to make a good run, but I wish they left that out." Every Z owner should pick up the DVD from their local Tower Records. The video gave me a lot of information on the Z before I purchased it

G Monster

TCS can be turned off 100%. It is superior in that it only uses the speed sensors which are only on the the rear drive wheels and will only use brakes as opposed to the VDC interference using brakes and throttle cut. VDC is never 100% off. It uses throttle cut and ABS to control the car. It is only 100% off when the switch is off and you stay off the brakes. Not everything about the engineeriing can be found in the manual.

gmitro

I am at work so I don't have the manual available. Read the section dealing with the LSD. If I remember right it states that electronic braking is used on the spinning wheel, as well as the mechanical/viscous portion to lock up both wheels. It mentions no disabling of this feature.

I always wondered if this could somehow reduce performance??

Greg

zPilott

iTrader: (3)

There are several interrelated systems in our cars, that people seem to have some confusion over because they often work together. TCS VDC ABS LSD EBD....

TCS and/or VDC can be turned off 100% just pressing the switch. Take it out to a track or autocross, and you will see for yourself. You can spin the car pretty easily, just by getting too hard on the throttle.

The other systems cannot (except maybe by pulling fuses or hacking) be turned off.

I don't think that the braking of the wheel for the LSD should reduce performance. There needs to be resistance on one wheel for the other to be driven. The braking is only applied when one wheel is spinning so much, that the other wheel is not getting any torque.

gmitro

That was the thinking I had regarding the LSD. Since the spinning wheel isn't helping much i.e. traction, slight braking to engage the LSD would be beneficial.

As far as VDC/TCS, and the percentage of each controlled by the button, I have no idea. I assumed they would be completely disengaged, and I have had no evidence otherwise while driving aggresively (or over-aggressively). Unless someone who completely understands the system is available, I'm afraid the true answer will be unknown.

Greg

G Monster

You can lead a horse to water...

Aggro_Al

In all cars, Stability Control (VDC), Traction Control (TCS) and Anti-lock Braking (ABS) are all part of the same system. Think of it as stages. Stage 1 is ABS, Stage 2 is TCS and Stage 3 is VDC. Each successive stage builds on the previous stage. In the Z, ABS is always on there is no way to turn it off even though it is part of the VDC/TCS system. Turning the switch off has no effect on ABS. Now here is where most of the confusion likely is. TCS is the system employed when the wheels lose traction. It does this by cutting the throttle and/or by applying the brakes and in the 5AT it may also downshift the transmission. VDC also employs TCS but in addition it has a sensor that checks for yaw to correct oversteer and understeer and uses individual brakes to change the direction of the car. How are TCS and VDC different? TCS will only check for traction where VDC will also check for yaw. Turning off the VDC/TCS switch will disengage those features. Now here is the caveat, even though the yaw sensor and traction sensors are turned off the Z has a safety feature independent from the regular stability control system that will activate TCS if certain conditions are met. This safety feature will employ the current TCS system to cut throttle to about 30% if it senses that the brake and accelerator are engaged at the same time above a given RPM. TCS was designed to cut throttle so this safety feature uses TCS instead of adding another system to do the same thing. This situation sometimes occurs in a panic situation where the driver might step on both brake and accelerator at the same time. To help the brake win out over the accelerator the computer will engage TCS to cut the throttle. Now in racing situations there may be certain times when you want to have the brake and accelerator pressed at the same time, such as in Brake Torquing. In this case, the only way to keep TCS from engaging is to remove the brake fuse or have some sort of switch to bypass it. Doing this will disable all stability control and the brake lights.

jreiter

iTrader: (6)

I also recall reading from some folks on this board that, after a while of having the brake light fuse pulled, the check engine light would come on. (Or some other warnig light.) I don't remember what they said happened other than the warning light, but they basically had to plug in and remove the fuse again to shut it off. I believe one guy just rigged up a switch so he could turn it on and off as needed.

Aggro_Al

This is what I've hear so correct me if I'm wrong. When the VDC/TCS switch is in the off position that disables only the yaw and the traction sensors. The anti-lock sensors, ABS and LSD sensor stay on no matter what. When the brake fuse is pulled it keeps the stability systems (VDC, TCS, ABS, BA, EBF, LSD) from engaging. The sensors for anti-lock and LSD slip sensors are still active even though the systems won't engage. If the driver applies the brakes hard enough to trip the ABS sensors and the ABS doesn't come on the computer thinks that it is an ABS failure and light the warning light. The same happens with the LSD if it detects slippage and can't engage the system it registers a failure.

jckolnturn

iTrader: (1)

This thread has reached it's fullest capacity of misinformation

dank311

iTrader: (8)

So, What is the real answer? I really want to get a Z, but I dont want all this stuff to engage when I dont want it to.

Would the Base or Enthusiast model be best for drifting b/c they dont have VDC?

Jon

samw1978

yeah i saw it on Best Motoring saying that the VDC will still activate on hazardous conditions even if it's off.... that's why they removed the whole control module (or something like that) in one of the Zs(was it the Esprit Z? can't remember)...

Aggro_Al

jdckolnturn

Don't hold out on us. Let us know what the answer is.

dank311

iTrader: (8)

Yea, I have that Best Motoring too. Its a great DVD. I believe the reason the Espirit Z33 didnt have VDC was b/c it was a base model.

I remember Orido saying that if you get the model w/o VDC is can be a great drifting machine...even the narrator said that the base model was the best tuning platform b/c of the absence of VDC.

They also showed in one Z that was on there before the Espirit Z had a switch to turn it off under the center console near your elbow.


Jon

dank311

iTrader: (8)

Also, What about the G35? Can you turn VDC off 100% on it? The Best motoring says it comes on even when its switched off under emergency situations.
Jon

DJDaizzy

Your problem is not the VDC, it's the stupid Viscous LSD. The biggest problem I've found on my Z was the stock viscous limited slip, it's waaaay to slow. That's the first thing you'll need to replace imho if you want to get into any kind of serious motorsports or drifting competitions. Get a 2 way LSD, problem solved.

Pusha_Z

LOL! this guy doesnt give any real reasons, just states "misinformation". Go ahead and enlighten us, because like G Monster said; you can lead a jacka$$ to water..... I mean horse

And he ACTUALLY gave us information and a reason why VDC is never 100% off
Please jckolnturn, give me a reason to not believe Best Motoring, and believe what you say

dank311

iTrader: (8)

Yea, I would really like to know this b/c I am looking into getting a Z or a G and I dont want to get one with VDC if its not able to be turned off.
Please someone, whats the real deal on the VDC issues?
Jon

Them Bones

What more does he need to say? The answer has already been given a number of times before the guessing games started.

G_Monster is completely wrong in his explanation. There are speed sensors on all wheels. This is how ABS works. TCS DOES cut throttle. And, yes, VDC/TCS can be completely disabled by the switch.

Just try it yourself. Turn it off, and you can slide all over the place. The only things that remain are brake LSD and ABS (all models). Brake LSD controls the spinning of just one wheel. If you're going to drift, you'll want to replace the stock LSD with something better anyway, so the brake LSD should not be a problem.