That's also what Porsche guys say about the Ferrari guys...

 

boiling point for wilwood EXP 600 is 626F, one of the highest DRY boiling point fluid in the industry. In comparission, Motul RBF600 is 593F, Brembo LCF600 is 601F.

If wilwood fluid is kept fresh and bleeded frequently, there is NO WAY they should boil/fade. THE best race fluid is supposedly(hard to get commercially) CASTROL SRF, which as DRY boiling point of 590F. and costs $70 USD per liter.

If you boil wilwood EXP 600 there is something wrong (or you are screwed).

http://bmwquebec.ca/bmw/technical/brake_fluids

 

Than I'm screwed ! :P

 

The Ferrari Club in Montreal now runs private events only. Seems they didn’t like being passed by modded Civics and Preludes!

 

I just called porterfield to order the Raybestos ST-43 pad for the non-brembo rear, and they quoted me $180! I know I gotta pay to play, but this is getting rediculous. Daveh, are you still able to order your set for $120? They also quoted custom cut PFC-01 at over $200.

Porterfield's number is (949) 548-4470. If you guys get better pricing, please let me know, as I can't do another event on these HPS pads. My rotors look all messed up from all the deposits. Plus, the HPS's don't have much bite to them at all, so I'm quite certain that I've pushed the brake balance way forward due to the high mu from the Spec VR's up front.

 

I'm not sure why they quoted you higher than what I paid. I don't really have any relationship with them that would have gotten me a special price (other than the NASA discount that you can get too). Maybe they were looking at the wrong pad size. Tim is the person I spoke with who originally recommended them to me. Maybe you can ask for him.

 

I don't think I have a 'pad only' issue, as my rear right caliper seems to have leaked. The car is on jacks right now as I'm going to change the transmission and differential oil. I'll clean up the caliper before putting the wheels back on and then monitor it. I don't think it will leak again on the street but it's probably not a good idea to go back on the track until I do something about it. I'm guessing that the seal partially melted. Anyone know if complete failure/loss of brake will happen if I keep going with these calipers ?

Using the Raybestos pads won't solve this problem so I might be left with no choice than to upgrade. Does the Stoptech or AP racing still use the rear parking brake or do you loose that ?

 

Mberthia,

I went through the same gyrations last fall that you are now. My dust boots melted, "high performance" pads were smeared all over the rotors, and it dumped enough heat into the hub to loosen up the plastic wheel centercaps in their bores. I quit halfway through my 2nd ever track day because I thought it was a dangerous situation.

I decided that if I was going to do this with any confidence I had to get something to dump the heat (ducts) and upgrade pads/rotors, or just break down and get the right tool for the job - a 4 wheel BBK.

I researched the net and found this board to be the best real world reference and that a few other people were going through the same thing. Search this forum for "brakes" or "brake kit" and you'll find an interesting poll, taken by amolaver I believe, that helped me make a decision I didn't regret (hint-Stoptech has an excellent tech reference section. I hope this helps.

 

Since I've had a few people ask, I just wanted to give another update after 6 months (and too many track days to count). The pads have held up wonderfly. The front and the rears are wearing at about the same rate. Since I've lost count, I'd have to say they will last me roughly 15 days. I'm still not crazy about the modulation but you can't beat the wear and stopping power. I wouldn't drive with anything less then an R compound tire with them as I think they would absolutely overpower any street tire. Other than that, nothing new to add.
I do want to say that I always do at least one cool down lap without using ANY brakes to cool things back off. I also bleed the fluid out of my calipers after EACH track day. If I go to a two day event, I have to bleed before the second event to avoid a mushy pedal. The rears usually let out some air bubbles.

Perhaps those who have driven my car on the track can comment on them..

 

Wish I would have seen this thread earlier this year. I stuck it out with Carb-slo-tech's all year and it was a PITA.


StaticCling and I were at a PCA event last month and a Porsche guy came up to each of us and asked which one of us was fastest out of the Z's. (There are about 4/5 of us Z's that run with the PCA regularly.) I said that I don't know, but that it was probably between me and one other car. Then he says to me (and earlier to Bruce) well you guys are pretty fast. I've been trying to chase you out there all day. But you guys are fast, you just don't always have the best lines. I just had to laugh. Didn't have the heart to tell him our cars have between 50 and 100 less hp.

 

The rear st-43 pads held up at Laguna Seca which is notoriously hard on brakes. I've been waiting for a dry day at this track for months to put them to the true test and was happy to see that they passed. I was getting up to 112mph down the hill into turn 2 and was consistently able to threshold brake down to 40mph without any fade or drama.
My fronts are wearing faster than my rears (the way it should be), but I've got to get around to installing some brake ducts up front since the front pads show some minor spider web cracking.

 

have anyone tried the EBC yellow stuff? How does it compared to the st-43 on the track? And also, do you guys have brembos or non-brembos?

 

I just installed the rabyestos st41/43 (41 in front and 43 in rear); I also put on a new set of 'racing brake' dilled/slotted OE replacement rotors and finnaly flushed my brake lines w/ Motul 600.

I took the car out to bed the brakes last night around midnight...I did 4X 70 to 35 MPH and by the 4th time the pads were biting so hard I was on the ABS super quick. then I did 75 to 10 MPH about 6 times and ABS engaged very quickly and lasted the whole time. (* I was on the OE 17" rims w/ bridgestones...for the track I have Toyo RA-1's)

-The smell of the pads was different from anything I've experienced - it's fairly different from any street/performance pad smell.
-The brakes have a lot of noise when slowing down around town, but that's to be expected.
-Brake modulation didn't seem too difficult...I was a little worried it'd be an on/off type of reaction, but I'll be able to say more once I get to the track this weekend.
-The intial bite of the pads when they're cold doesn't seem to be as good as OE, but it's not so bad that it's not safe to drive on the street. (I plan to drive to/from track events with them mounted)

My plan is to swap pads/rotors for street/track use, that way the pads will be matched up with the same rotors.

If it doesn't rain this weekend, I'll probably have more of a reveiw.

-Peter

 

Try and avoid ABS activation as this tends to ruin the even pad material deposition.

You will experience some vibration for some time after the ABS has quicked in under heavy braking.

 

bringing the thread back from the dead to see if anyone else has gone the st43 route...

i just ordered mine and they'll be on the car for VIR Nov 20th. this is (i believe) the same setup as daveh - stoptech 13" up front, non-brembo oem rear. i've been using pagid black up front, but am not in love with them. at least they didn't smear all over like the orange's did.

i didn't realize how easy it is to get custom cut pads from porterfield, so have been trying to get by using off the shelf (ie, street) pads for the rear. i didn't have 'problems' per se, i just lost any real braking from the rear after 2 or 3 laps. i'm looking forward to running these with the goodyear gscs... ought to be a good combo.

while i can't comment on these pads yet, i can highly recommend porterfield. i spoke to them for 20 minutes or so (Tim) discussing the options (HT10 vs ST43/42/41), and he was knowledgable and patient. it really is easy to get any compound you want. just give 'em a call, tell 'em what car you have and the compound you want, and blammo, they cut 'em and ship 'em. it really is that simple. don't know why i waited this long...

my only concern is fit (with the rears). daveh can you comment on that? did you have to dremel or otherwise mod the pads to get 'em to fit, or did they drop in like an off the shelf item? i've never had to do it, but i've heard from other folks (even with off the shelf items) occasionally getting a bad fit. and to be clear, this is not in reference at all to porterfield, but in general. i just assume that since these are being cut the chance of fitment problems are higher - don't know if that's true or not.

ahm

 

never had any issues with fit on this car. Had issues once on my last car. I basically scraped it against the cement until it fit.
I just ordered a set of rears this week myself. They ship out on the same day. I was tempted to try something else but figured I've been happy with these so why mess with it. Curious what he said about the HT-10's. They would also have the heat capacity of the raybestos.

Be sure to bed them properly, or better yet get a second set of rotors. They don't mix well with street pads.

edit: hope you don't have problems with the rears having too much bias since these probably have a higher coef of friction than your pagids do up front.

 

to clarify, i've ordered the st43's for both front (stoptech 13") and rear (non-brembo oem). i have been running the pagid blacks, but am planning on pulling them and setting them aside as a spare set. i'll be using the st43 front and rear.

regarding comparisons with the HT10, Tim indicated the ht10 were lower Mu, but similarly temperature survivable. he believes the ST43 will last longer. he didn't seem inclined to agree with your description of their bite, but i surmise this may be related to application. i'm inclined to use caution initially and be aware of your experience before making any judgements.

i'm trying to get rear rotors (see other new thread) - have any suggestions for an inexpensive source?

ahm

edit: corrected ht10 vs st43 comparison comment

 

I updated my comments on the crazy bite in post #30 (I know this thread is getting quite long). Once I switched to the dedicated track rotors, the bite was what I was expecting. I may even try the 41's up front next for more bite. Again bed them very well because they do not mix with street pads. I got terrible judder and sticky modulation when I was trying to share the rotors for street and track.
I think you will be very happy with your choice. We have the exact same setup. I do have front ducts though.

 

oooh front ducts - that's a winter project for me. do you have any pics posted of your setup?

ahm

 

this is good to know....I experienced this bedding my wilwood front bbk a few months ago, it would vibrate on braking because the ABS kicked in on the bedding process.

I just installed new pads/rotors rear about a month ago but I didn't bed them because I'm still running the wilwood pads up front. Plan on throwing hawks up front to match the rears shortly and I'll bed from there.