Exactly!

 

Yep, youd be the one Maybe my numbers were over estimated but the last time I saw one of your dynos they were relatively high. Oh well, my mistake. Hows the car running?

 

I'd like to know Andy's mods as well. So what's up Andy?

 

I'm not saying it is not possible - I just have not seen any data (dyno chart)
that show someone has 300 HP at the wheels. Seems to me someone claimed it a few months back but could not prove it? And can it be done for less than going FI?

 

I have a friend that has plenty of experience with Motec, and he is begging me to tune my car. He's tuned a few racing drag boats, as well as american V8 cars. His 454 Baja topped out at 67 when he bought it, and after tuning, it does 93mph. He thinks he can get at least 20% gain in horsepower over stock in the Z with a few breathing mods... 287*20%=57.4 Thats' 345 crank horespower.

How hard will it be to adapt a software program for the 350? Who has experience with Motec and the Z?

 

Look further into this please, take him up on his offer and get back to us

 

Hi Andy....

My car is going strong and well!!! cheers mate... I still haven't got any new upgrades yet because I know it is pretty darn hard to get even 1 HP now from my car though going with N/A tuning...

About the wheel HP... I have got around 285.75 RWHP... having say that, our AUD dynos are loaded dyno, and we are seeing our drivetrain loss as around 19%... therefore, from the wheel HP to the engine HP will be... 285.75 x 1.22 = around 348 HP....

cheers,

richie

 

Why isnt there an NA froum?? theres FI...wheres the NA love?

 

Umm this question is redundant. If a Z engine isn't FI, then what would it be? (psss... here's a hint. NA ) Every other forum IS na...

-Acree

 

Let's see, the Porsche 3.6 has a longer rod and shorter stroke for better high rpm use than the current VQ, an 8400rpm redline to prove it, variable valve timing on both cams and variable lift with their variocam plus II system or whatever Bosch is calling it now on their Motronic system, a boxer 6 design for perfect 1st, 2nd, and 3rd order harmonic balance to keep things smooth at that rpm, and lordy only knows what kind of tricks they have on the pistons, rods, and crank along with the heads and a slick variable length intake manifold. So, to get that much out of the VQ might take a little bit of cash, but I'm only guessing. But have hope, the VQ35 in the Dakar Rally Nissan makes 450hp all motor according to Nissan Motorsports , so maybe 400hp can be had for a relatively reliable street tolerable engine.
Will

 

One point no one has considered when comparing the Porsche motor to VQ is that the porsche is rear-engined and uses a transaxle. With no driveshaft, you have far less driveline loss, so you get better hp numbers at the rear wheels.

Another point is a GT3 crate motor cost aprox $40k. They are mostly hand assembled, use very trick internals (sodium filled exhaust valves, mahle pistons etc). The VQ is a mass produced motor, mostly assembled by automation. If you spent 30-40k on a NA VQ motor you would have no problem getting 450+ hp.

 

Jason had me scared with 360-380whp claim. Glad it was corrected to CRANK hp. I've spoken to a few NA racing team/shops that have tuned their engines to the low 300whp range, which probably puts in the 350-380 engine hp range. There are some additional bottlenecks in this engine that need to be addressed, before the 400 crank hp number will ever be reached.

 

N.A. horsepower is a result of RPM. Look at a Formula 1 car, 2.4L V-8 making 750 hp @ 19,500 rpm. That is a tiny motor making a boat load of power.

A 3.5L is a relatively large engine compared to other performance cars. Large size equals heavy weight. I maybe proved wrong but to get 300whp about 40-50 hp would need to be added. I don't think it will happen with bolt on parts. I don't consider any part that requires breaking any engine seal a bolt on part.

 

super high compression, and specialized fuels also help.

 

I also know some of those teams are only in the low 300 range because of the rule limitations on cam sizing plus other things.

 

any input on what are some of the other bottlenecks in the engine?

 

Obviously huh? I mean in terms of building a motor for NA applications, ie cams, headwork, pistons, boring, honing etc..not intake and exhaust...go to anyother forum and theres an FI section and NA along with a bolton section. A section for people who didnt turbo their car and want more than exhaust and 5/16 mod. Plus I just asked a question, no need for a smart a** remark.

 

The truth is, yes it can be done but at what cost.

The porsche GT3 engine is a piece of art. Meticulous engineering goes into all those parts for pre-assembly.

The VQ motor can have 400+ engine hp but it needs major changes.

-Pistons
-Rods
-Oil pump
-Heads
-Cams
-Valves
-Valve springs
-Intake manifold
-Exhaust manifold
-Flywheel
-Clutch

All that will cost a pretty penny, that is why you don't see a lot of people taking that route. All those parts will be in excess of 10k whereas you can find a nice TT kit or ST kit for much less installed and make much more power. The only difference is n/a engine is a bit more reliable and you have bragging rights in the VQ community.

Arin

 

^ what he said. I'd like the idea of a 350rwhp NA car...but the Z weighs too much. If the Z weighed somewhere like 2800lbs, then the 350rwhp from NA would be far more appealing.

 

I wasn't trying to step on your toes or be an @ss about anything, it just kind of struck me as odd. If you have a question that is "hardcore" na, dealing with such issues that you listed, it should be placed in the main Engine section. Reasoning: the main subject with minor NA mods is usually intake/exhaust related. Hence, we have that subforum so the main forum isn't flooded with those types of threads.. To me it doesn't seem like a waste of time and and server space to devise another forum just for NA pistons, cams, heads, etc when the main engine forum is designated as the place for this. My remark was meant to be taken with a grain of salt.

-Acree