I find it strange that an S2K can get 360 RWHP from comptech with no problem. Yet we are concerned following the same route. Why? They have 11:1, we have what 10.3:1. I don't get it. Is the VQ internal inferior to Hondas 4 banger? Or is it the computer codes? I want power! One last thing, why do G35's make less power with the ATI than a Z? Does the better flowing intercoller really make 28 hp more?

 

Not saying which engine is better...but the S2K redlines at 9k!

 

It's about $$$.......there are way more hondas sold than nissans....companies know they will make more money selling honda products than nissan products, so they don't mind spending the engineering dollars to get it right........since there are other companies that will be selling honda products too, they need to make sure they do their engineering right the first time

 

It may also have to do with the fact that the S2K engine has been overengineered to be able to withstand the the compression/expansion forces on the conrods from slinging a piston around at 9000rpm. For this reasons, its conrods and cranks are significantly stronger, I believe that some exotic material is used (titanium or magnesiums? someone verify this please). A vq35 revs considerably lower and was designed as a versatile engine that could go in a number of vehicles, not one that was built to incredible performance spec. If i can remember correctly off the top of my head, the only car that Nissan produces that does not have the 3.5L VQ as a standard or option engine is the sentra.

For this reason, the VQ is able to take less stress on its connecting rods---a known weak point---and cannot make big power on stock internals.

 

I tend to agree with r34 racer. I am definitely impressed with the ATI kit but I have to wonder, in an age of computer controlled cars with sensors for almost everything, why slider controls for the ATI? This seems to me to make the kit open to bad tuning which could ruin the engine as everyone has seen. I would think that all of this could be controlled by a computer. Oh well, long gone are the days of carb jets and reading sparkplugs...

 

I believe that it took a few years for the Comptech supercharger for the S2K to come out.

I know the VQ has been around forever, but the Z is just one year old. Give people some time, things will develop.

 

give the tuning industry time... its still a new car

 

Just to give you a heads up on Fuel Management Computers. I have had long time business relations with a company called Jim Wolf Technology. The inside scoop is that reprogrammed ECU's will be available sometime at the beginning of 2004. I will keep you guys updated on any developments. Alot of the problems of going with FI are issues related to fuel management. JWT's ECU will be able to solve this problem.

 

Not fair, to say the VQ is not as good because it does not rev as much is like saying the S2K motor is not as good because it lacks torque. Each motor has a design goal. I bet a number of S2K guys will love to trade a couple thousand rpm for our power at lower rpm.

 

Interesting. Are you saying JWT is directly designing an ECU for FI applications? If yes, which one is it being designed to be most compatable with?

I just assumed the ECU was being program to compliment the new set of cams coming out. Are there going to be a bunch of different ECU's for different applications?

Will Nismo being marketing these ECU's?

 

I don't think he was saying the vq is "not as good" as the f20 because it doesn't rev as high. He was merely stating that the f20 has very strong pistons because it has to. Honda can't afford warrantying engines the break apart at 9000rpm, so they over engineer that aspect. Nissan, did not need to because of the design of our fabulous engine =) Of course that doesn't help us with boosted applications!

And btw - if you spend some time over at s2ki.com *most* members are losing sleep and hair over the fact that the 2004 s2k models only rev to 8000k rpm. They'd probably have a heart attack if it only revd to 65!

 

thats cause for that 1000RPMs they didnt gain any extra power

anyway, I dont know enough to have a good reason, what RPM does the comptech peak at? how much hp does it make at 6600RPM? the S2k makes so much HP because by the definition of HP it is dependent on RPM, farther from 5200RPM the power is, the more its multiplied. so the power that might only be 300 at 5000RPM is 360 at 8000RPM(not actual numbers, just an example)

this is how F1 cars have like 3liters of displacment and N/A I think, yet have 800+hp. they rev to 15-18kRPMs. of course a completely forged aluminum block helps them out.

 

The higher the redline, the longer the car can stay in a lower gear and therefor have more torque to the rear wheels. So what if the last 1000 rpms only make ~90% of the peak power.

Honda has always prided themselves on efficient vehicles. They are blessed with some of the best engineers, and thats why their produces are compared to usually much more expensive counterparts. When the NSX came out, it gave Ferrari some compitition it hadnt seen in decades. The S2000 IMO is a superior design as compared to its rivals, the Boxter and Z3. The Accord and Camary practically killed the domestic mid size sedans. The Civic back in the early 90's dominated he world market in its respective categories.

I think most auto makers can learn a few things from Honda, including Nissan. I love this car to death, but when ppl want to compare our engine with the one in the S2000's, its apples to oranges man.

I agree, give the aftermarket another year and we will have alot more choices to power gains.

 

Thank you for clarifying what i wrote.

 

That's not true. The S2000 pulls hard all the way to redline. However, the 2004 gets a bump up to ~2.2L so that it can produce more torque and can still produce 240hp with sane piston velocities.

The S2K pistons are forged steel. Comptech also had their supercharger out soon after the S2000 release. However, Comptech specializes in Honda vehicles because there has always been a huge market for them, Comptech could dump in a lot of R&D. There has not been a need for a Nissan company like this up until now.

So yes, our weak spot is probably the cast rods. Our best bet for FI is to wait for huge companies that can invest significant time and R&D into quality products. Mainly Vortech and Greddy. If I went FI, I'd be tempted to pick up a new block and build it up first.

 

For the record, few fewer S2000s have been produced than the 350Z. Also, the F20C has a piston speed faster than an F1 motor. Truly a great motor! Not to mention, look at all the extra room in the engine bay of an S2000... the entire motor is behind the axis of the front wheels, and there's plenty of room for a snail.

 

It sounds like to me you guys should trade in your 350Z's and buy a s2000. If I felt like you, that is what I would do.

 

there's nothing wrong with respecting another car. too many times people become blinded by their cars and brand loyalty (not saying you)... i for one can absolutely appreciate what the s2k is. it isn't necessarily what i want, the z is... but it's hard to argue with the fact that the s is a wonderfully engineered vehicle.

 

I agree on the rods. One big drawback I think is that Nissan has never used forged internals in any of their cars sold here (Correct me if I'm wrong). I wish they would of. That is one reason why the 2jz is a more desirable motor than the VG30DETT.

S2ks are sweet cars, but if I wanted one I would be in one.

 

just to correct a major error in the first post - Comptech SCs for the S2000 do NOT make 360 RWHP. They make 360 crank HP.. which is more like 300 RWHP max.

Otherwise, most of the comments here are accurate. The F20C's forged connecting rods have a lot to do with the amount of power it can make, as well as the 9000 RPM redline, and the cams which allow the motor to breathe so well up high. That engine is tuned for peak horsepower up high, whereas the VQ35 in the Z is tuned for a broader powerband with some torque down low. There are a lot of factors to consider in the horsepower equation.