Load Based (Dyno Dynamics) vs. Inertia Based (Most DynoJets)
#141
Turbo Whore
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: West suburbs of Chi-town
Posts: 7,303
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
A load based Dyno makes tuning low rpm load points easy..I can hold the car at 10% load at 2000-2500-3000-or whatever my hear chooses to do so, and make the needed adjustments..
#142
Registered User
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: NoVA
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by DaveFunction2ND
So let me get this right.
Everyone agrees that a load based dyno is a better tuning tool?
Its a yes or no question. The answer obviously being yes.
So I've become quite confused. Jon, Sam, or Jeremy could you please tell me WHY you would like to have a load based dyno?
Everyone agrees that a load based dyno is a better tuning tool?
Its a yes or no question. The answer obviously being yes.
So I've become quite confused. Jon, Sam, or Jeremy could you please tell me WHY you would like to have a load based dyno?
Dave,
I don't think the arguement was over whether or not a load based dyno was the preferred dyno for tuning, but that in saying that a tuner using an inertia based dyno was "guessing." That statement put a lot of people out on the tracks to defend themselves. Also calling out DD vs. DJ probably wasn't a good decision. Too many of the shops on this forum use DJ's (and tune on them). To make a blanket statement about whether or not the time and money invested in that make of dyno was wasted because the tuner was "guessing" just sent the wrong message out and opened you up for a mountain of debate.
It's safe to say that YES, YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT IN SAYING THAT LOAD BASED DYNO'S ARE BETTER TOOLS FOR HELPING THE TUNER DO HIS JOB. But, the way it came off sounded like any tuner using an inertia based dyno wasn't doing the job correctly. Even if you didn't mean it that way, the perception is what set people off.
There are a lot of people on this board that have faith in you as a quatlity shop and tuner, but I think it's important to ensure that while promoting your business, you stay clear of potential mine fields when posting up in the FI section. These are rough waters where reputations are built and broken...
Last edited by TENGAI; 05-04-2007 at 08:27 AM.
#143
Banned
iTrader: (28)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Spotswood NJ
Posts: 5,510
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by BriGuyMax
Thank you captain obvious. As if Dave didn't already state that multiple times in this thread. Why don't you answer Alberto's question?
#144
Turbo Whore
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: West suburbs of Chi-town
Posts: 7,303
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
Because Alberto is on my "ignore list" and does not exist to me any longer..Congradulations, you just joined him as the second person there..Thanks for the 3 years of harrasing comments, but Im done with the drama, save it for someone who has time..
#147
Cranky FI Owner
iTrader: (14)
Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
Because Alberto is on my "ignore list" and does not exist to me any longer..Congradulations, you just joined him as the second person there..Thanks for the 3 years of harrasing comments, but Im done with the drama, save it for someone who has time..
Last edited by Alberto; 05-04-2007 at 10:39 AM.
#149
Registered User
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: NoVA
Posts: 1,528
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Slick 6MT
After seeing how professional MRC acts when handling public matters I'm glad I didn't make it to the dyno day.
#150
Registered User
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Seattle.
Posts: 2,634
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by TENGAI
I'd rather see someone acting like an a$$hole in public as opposed to a thief in the night. Too many times in this business people are all smiles and high fives to your face, but the moment you walk away they're trying to figure out just hard to skull fu(k you "nicely." If the shop can back up the claims, then I don't give a rats a$$ about personallity... After all, I've been called an a$$hole too many times to care
#153
Banned
iTrader: (28)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Spotswood NJ
Posts: 5,510
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Slick 6MT
After seeing how professional MRC acts when handling public matters I'm glad I didn't make it to the dyno day.
To tell you the truth, I have no clue who you are, nor do I care..But I thank you for not tainting my awesome dyno day with your presence..It was tough, but the other 100 people there did somehow seem to enjoy themselves, despite you not gracing us with your presence.
Last edited by Julian@MRC; 05-05-2007 at 01:57 PM.
#154
Registered User
iTrader: (6)
Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
You lost me...you said that you arent pointing fingers...but you are also saying that if one vendor is doing it..then we are all doing it? Did I miss the logic, or are you pointing the finger at all of us.
The most important numbers...are the baseline....and the after tuned numbers....on OUR dyno. That's it. How much they make on a DJ isnt really relevant, and we do it only at the customer's request.
The thing with any dyno, is they all can ready slightly differently. People have talked about lower reading DJ's, and higher reading DD's, and this is why I give the general statement about the difference in power between DD and DJ. Maybe my local DJ guy straps the car down more tightly one day over the next....just as an example.
The most important numbers...are the baseline....and the after tuned numbers....on OUR dyno. That's it. How much they make on a DJ isnt really relevant, and we do it only at the customer's request.
The thing with any dyno, is they all can ready slightly differently. People have talked about lower reading DJ's, and higher reading DD's, and this is why I give the general statement about the difference in power between DD and DJ. Maybe my local DJ guy straps the car down more tightly one day over the next....just as an example.
Sorry I never replied right away . I guess I didnt express my self very well . Im just saying that all of the Vendors and Tuners on this site . At one time or another have adjusted thier dyno numbers to make every one involved look better . By either setting the dyno up to read very low on the base line [ to make the final tune look better ] or added a big correction on the final tune dyno . All it leads to is alot of mistrust between every one . Every one ends up questioning what every ones else is doing and posting .
I know it will never magicly stop and that all vendors and tuners will never post a fudged dyno again . But it would be nice to think it could happen ....lol
#155
Registered User
iTrader: (6)
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Seattle.
Posts: 2,634
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by MRC Motorsports
Im sorry you feel that way..However I am tired of continually getting dragged into this drama, to have people like you who are Vinny's customers, talk trash on my personality, with no merrit to how my work turns out..There are plenty of HACKS out there, and we are not one of them..However, we dont take BS from members of this forum, or from other vendors calling foul on our dyno results.. I dont need to kiss your butt like other shops do, we have plenty of work to pick and choose from to tell you the truth..The customers that we have get something most shops dont give, HONESTY..Even if it means loosing a sale.
To tell you the truth, I have no clue who you are, nor do I care..But I thank you for not tainting my awesome dyno day with your presence..It was tough, but the other 100 people there did somehow seem to enjoy themselves, despite you not gracing us with your presence.
To tell you the truth, I have no clue who you are, nor do I care..But I thank you for not tainting my awesome dyno day with your presence..It was tough, but the other 100 people there did somehow seem to enjoy themselves, despite you not gracing us with your presence.
#156
Banned
iTrader: (28)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Spotswood NJ
Posts: 5,510
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by booger
Sorry I never replied right away . I guess I didnt express my self very well . Im just saying that all of the Vendors and Tuners on this site . At one time or another have adjusted thier dyno numbers to make every one involved look better . By either setting the dyno up to read very low on the base line [ to make the final tune look better ] or added a big correction on the final tune dyno . All it leads to is alot of mistrust between every one . Every one ends up questioning what every ones else is doing and posting .
I know it will never magicly stop and that all vendors and tuners will never post a fudged dyno again . But it would be nice to think it could happen ....lol
I know it will never magicly stop and that all vendors and tuners will never post a fudged dyno again . But it would be nice to think it could happen ....lol
The barometer setting in the dyno is very critical and can greatly affect the HP reading based on atmospheric pressure and corrections.. I would also be useful if everyone posted their "Atmospheric" corrections with their dyno's to avoid any mis conception and confusion.
A simple 2 points on the brometer in either direction can affect the HP reading by 40-70hp believe it or not..
Also on the Dyno Dynamics, if the straps are loose, which is a trick Sharif told me on the phone one time, the HP numbers will read higher.However we make them tighter to avoid any danger of the car jumping off the roller.
#157
Vendor - Former Vendor
iTrader: (12)
Originally Posted by booger
Sorry I never replied right away . I guess I didnt express my self very well . Im just saying that all of the Vendors and Tuners on this site . At one time or another have adjusted thier dyno numbers to make every one involved look better . By either setting the dyno up to read very low on the base line [ to make the final tune look better ] or added a big correction on the final tune dyno . All it leads to is alot of mistrust between every one . Every one ends up questioning what every ones else is doing and posting .
I know it will never magicly stop and that all vendors and tuners will never post a fudged dyno again . But it would be nice to think it could happen ....lol
I know it will never magicly stop and that all vendors and tuners will never post a fudged dyno again . But it would be nice to think it could happen ....lol
-George
GT Motorsports
#158
the burninator
iTrader: (11)
you have to enter the vehicle's weight on a dyno-dynamics too right and that really plays a role in how the numbers are scaled. How do the shops with dyno-dynamics know the weight of each individual car? Even how much gas is in it will change the weight of a stock car
it doesn't matter for the sake of tuning that car though, which is mainly what matters.
it doesn't matter for the sake of tuning that car though, which is mainly what matters.
#159
Sponsor
Forged Performance
Forged Performance
iTrader: (92)
Originally Posted by sentry65
you have to enter the vehicle's weight on a dyno-dynamics too right and that really plays a role in how the numbers are scaled. How do the shops with dyno-dynamics know the weight of each individual car? Even how much gas is in it will change the weight of a stock car
it doesn't matter for the sake of tuning that car though, which is mainly what matters.
it doesn't matter for the sake of tuning that car though, which is mainly what matters.
MRC, you must have misunderstood my comments about strapping. I was saying that unlike a DJ, where the tires sits direction on top of the roller, on the DD, the car needs to rock forward, and try to climb the rollers ever so slightly. This is the DD approved method of operating the dyno. If you overtightened your straps, you will spin the rollers (because you are pulling the car back...instead of allowing it to rock forward slightly). Overtightening the straps also has another drawback: the straps break prematurely. In 1 year, we replaced our straps just one time. At CP Racing, when they tightened the crap out of their straps, they replaced them every month. And no matter the power level, we only need two straps on our dyno.
In regards to correction, I admire your admittion, that your weather station screwed up your numbers, as it is good to post accurate information. Our new dyno automatically populates atmo correction, and we cannot change the numbers at all. My only point of contention with your dyno, is that you add the 13% arbitrary DJ correction. It's your dyno, so you can do as you wish, but unless it clearly spelled out on your dyno sheets, it creates confusion for everyone. Was this a true DD number, or was this DJ corrected number?? We tried doing the DJ correction on our old dyno, the first week we had it, and never used it again, due to the confusion it creates. Be PROUD of your DD numbers...post them unmolested!
Last edited by Sharif@Forged; 05-05-2007 at 03:48 PM.
#160
Banned
iTrader: (28)
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Spotswood NJ
Posts: 5,510
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Sharif@Forged
Be PROUD of your DD numbers...post them unmolested!