Folks... the exhaust chemical mixture upon exiting the engine will not cause rust as it has not entered a phase yet to do so.

I'm not a fan of false information, so disregard what Cody is delivering you.

If it was SOOO important... rest assured the NASCAR and F1 guys would have stainless as well. Guess what? They don't.

If you want to further debate me... keep it in PM.

 

haha, they change header setups and lengths at every track. they don't leave headers on the car forever like a street car! Headers are more susceptible to wear than the exhaust system and that is the bottom line, whatever you believe causes it. It is a fact based on experience you obviously don't have. How long have you personally observed headers and the effects time has on them? You are so argumentative this website isn't even fun anymore. You are guessing in this situation and I don't expect you to admit it, that's fine. I'm not guessing. Say what you will to prove me wrong, I don't care anymore. Do you take all the fun out of other people's daily lives, too?

by the way, i never said anything about a chemical mixture affecting the headers.

 

Just wanted to give an update. . .

Peptidbond & I will be doing the install on 3/6, not sure at this time if we will be in my garage or using a lift elsewhere. The plan is to install Crawford Headers, Crawford Hi-Flow Cats & my Borla True Dual all together. Figured it would be easier to change everything at once rather than play around with it multiple times. We are planning on taking pics & making detailed observations while we do this, since we get to do it again 1 month later on his DB Track.

I appreciate all the feed back that you have given, so please keep it comming!!!

 

With my experience and colleagues who do this everyday I can bring to the table almost five decades of experience.

Enough is enough Cody - you're wrong. Drop it. Like I said, you have a personal issue... KEEP IT IN PM.

 

Thanks for question little_rod:

The major difference is cost and materials. As the name implies, the Stainless Steel are exactly what they are. The Mild Steel are a softer steel with Ceramic Coating for great looks and protection against the elements. The cost for the Ceramic Coated Versions are $811 and the Stainless Steel $998. That represents a $187 price difference.

Hope this helps.

AC

 

Road Warrior - You bring up a very good point.

No headers for the 350Z/G35 are smog or street legal in states that enforce emissions testing unless they have passed the equivalent of a C.A.R.B. certification program. This is regardless of the manufacturer giving any indication. Those that are legal will have an exemption order that excludes their headers from any testing.

Because the headers have an O2 sensor on them - just the fact that you are changing the equipment out makes them "not street legal." By law, the movement, replacement, or manipulation of any smog, oxygen or other sensor related to the monitoring of the vehicle's emissions is not legal. So, even though the O2 sensor may still be in the new aftermarket header(s) thereby not affecting the emissions and still effectively monitoring - it has been moved and/or the piece that it was attached to is different. This constitutes "changing the equipment related to or attached to an emissions sensor."

So, whether you go with Crawford's, Stillen's, or any other headers... you are now armed with the correct info.

Cheers!

 

Stillen headers are installed from underneath the vehicle. On the top side, you will still have to remove the intake tube on the driver side to access a few of the bolts - but the factory heatshields and headers themselves are removed from under the car and the new stillen headers are installed the same way.

AC

 

Honestly, I cannot have a personal issue with someone I do not know. I hope you feel the same. Once again, we will agree to disagree. By the way, you should not be so opposed to people with differing views. That is what makes progress happen. In business, when two men always agree, one is not needed.

 

Both of you are "fountains of misinformation". The facts are that exhaust gases are somewhat corrosive, and as the gases go through the catalytic converters, they are changed into carbon dioxide and water, which forms carbonic acid, which is highly corrosive. Therefore it is important to have an anti-corrosive steel past the cats, such as stainless, to hold up better against the carbonic acid. In front of the cats it is not as important, so a good thick mild steel will hold up just as long or longer as thin wall stainless as long as it is coated.

 

I agree that a coated steel will hold up. I do not disagree with that. However, that was not the discussion. I said it is important to have headers that will hold up to the heating and cooling the headers go through. Obviously, our race cars do not run cats so I am not and traditionally have never been, concerned with how they affect the steel used in the exhaust. Either way, headers/manifolds are subject to much higher temps than the rest of the exhaust and cool to just as cool temps. A non-protected metal will show signs of oxidation sooner and it will be worse and that is all my point is. I could literally take the headers off and have rusty metal powder fall out of the headers on the old race car. The new SS headers we use are pristine after several seasons.

 

Hmm, guess I started this, lol. Really, I was just talking about the ceramic coated mild steel type versus the stainless steel type, which was better and recommended. Since it does sound like the ceramic coating is very important for the mild steel to last for a long time, anyone ever had a problem with the coating coming off the header over time??

In your circumstance, flybyz, without cats, I have to wonder where the gases turn into carbon dioxide and water, and if the gases turn into this mixture at all when using test or race pipes. Would stainless be needed more with test pipes???

 

Yes, coating can and often does flake off the headers over time. This is another reason I recommend SS. Just to let you know, water and carbon dioxide are both natural byproducts of combustion. They come directly out of the motor and into the headers. Cats are hot enough to burn the water and they also change carbon dioxide into more environmentally friendly gasses. That is why some water (condensation aside) comes out of your exhaust tips when you freshly start and go and the cats have not yet lit up to operating temp. This water can collect in the header/manifold and rust it if you don't drive very often as well. Without cats, I would be more concerned with having a SS exhaust as well as headers and with cats I would be more concerned with having SS headers and not as concerned with the rest of the system.

 

thanks for the info....my main concern would be passing the sniffer test for obvious reasons.

 

OK, I can see where the coating can flake on the outside of the headers, but the more interesting part would be on the inside of the headers, where I believe it could stick around easier. I don't know, is SS worth $200 more with the same type of headers??

 

IMO, it's worth the difference. For me, it's, if nothing else, peace of mind. My headers will outlast my car which means as long as I have my car, headers are one less thing I have to worry about having a problem with.

 

Just seems like most on this board just talk about what they want, with money not in the equation. I don't know, I just don't live like that, no matter how much money I got. $200 still gets you pulleys, test pipes, or money towards other stuff.

I don't spend extra, unless I have too. Doesn't seem like, at least from what I see, that this is a circumstance that would warrant that extra money, but it might be just me. If Doug says that mild steel is fine, I have a tendency to believe him.

 

Cool! The point is to enjoy your car! Asking people's opinions or experiences will always net different results. Just ask anyone!

 

I have a used set of test pipes on my car and where the blue coating has come off they are rusty. Personal experience, nothing more.

 

I had an '84 Nissan hardbody pickup with cast steel headers (stock). After 12 years, they were rusty, but still very solid. I don't know what kind of coating they had, if any.

The question comes down to how long you want the headers to last. Mild steel ones will still outlast most of the rest of the car, but, if you want that extra peace of mind, then maybe stainless is best for you.

-D'oh!

 

Ahh, not saying anything bad about what anyone thinks. That is why I am here, I want to find out what others think. I notice that a lot of people say that any coating they had on their headers wore off, are we talking about on the outside where it has to put up with the outside environment, or are we talking about on the inside where the exhaust flow is?? I believe the inside is alot more important.