Reflashing stock ecu or tuning with a plug and play
04-07-2011, 09:05 AM
#22
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well Its not going to be worth it to me to gain maybe 15hp. Ill just maximize grip and brake and weight.
04-07-2011, 09:07 AM
#23
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
well the most I would pay for 10-20 hp for a NA tune is about $300 so unless anyone is making offers I wouldn't consider it. I know there is probably several people out there with a base map for a stock Z that it would take 10 mins to upload it
04-07-2011, 09:30 AM
#24
But if I can sell ya on it for a quick min, the gains may seem minimal on the tune, number wise, but when driving the car it makes a huge difference. Throttle in and out is smother and more responsive and low end torque feels amazing. Also raising idle and rev limits is nice as well. I get people all the time calling me a week after there tune telling me it feels way more the just a 12-14 hp gain and its the best mod they have done.
Also lastly, if you plan on tracking this car, and you have done breather mods...I.E. intake, spacer, test pipes, exhaust, or a combination of three of them. Chances are you are running dangerously lean, your gonna run hot on the track and burn through some oil as well. Longevity wise you would be helping yourself.
04-07-2011, 09:59 AM
#26
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We typically charge 595.00 tuned out the door for a N/A 350Z tune, that price includes the License and tuning time. Sometimes we offer a promo price of 525.00 tuned out the door. I believe in the beginning you were asking about the Tuner software specifically. When we sell Osiris Standard ($500 License and Cable) we offer free e-tuning with that as well. If you are comparing strictly gains from Evo's and 350z's it will look not even comparable due to being able to raise the boost levels on the Evo's.
But if I can sell ya on it for a quick min, the gains may seem minimal on the tune, number wise, but when driving the car it makes a huge difference. Throttle in and out is smother and more responsive and low end torque feels amazing. Also raising idle and rev limits is nice as well. I get people all the time calling me a week after there tune telling me it feels way more the just a 12-14 hp gain and its the best mod they have done.
Also lastly, if you plan on tracking this car, and you have done breather mods...I.E. intake, spacer, test pipes, exhaust, or a combination of three of them. Chances are you are running dangerously lean, your gonna run hot on the track and burn through some oil as well. Longevity wise you would be helping yourself.
But if I can sell ya on it for a quick min, the gains may seem minimal on the tune, number wise, but when driving the car it makes a huge difference. Throttle in and out is smother and more responsive and low end torque feels amazing. Also raising idle and rev limits is nice as well. I get people all the time calling me a week after there tune telling me it feels way more the just a 12-14 hp gain and its the best mod they have done.
Also lastly, if you plan on tracking this car, and you have done breather mods...I.E. intake, spacer, test pipes, exhaust, or a combination of three of them. Chances are you are running dangerously lean, your gonna run hot on the track and burn through some oil as well. Longevity wise you would be helping yourself.
Can someone clearly explain where the added cost comes in besides customer support and R&D?
How are the ECU far more sophisticated?
Let me go into further depth.
2003 track edition Z 6spd
Bone stock not one upgrade not even a car freshener hanging from the mirror
The car will run on
Hoosier R6
245/35/18
275/35/18
PFC 05 compound pads up front on their 2 piece rotors
PFC 01 compounds pads in the rear on stock rotors
Castrol SRF fluid
Royal Purple 10W30 Oil
100-110 octane just cuz it smells good and its damn near the cost of 93 so why not.
Last edited by Alexl08; 04-07-2011 at 10:09 AM.
04-07-2011, 10:20 AM
#27
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Montreal Canada
Posts: 78
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Alex I am not trying to flame you but you come into this forum asking questions that we (well most of us) try to answer for you but you battle
with the answers.
Yes is is not cheap to tune the VQ ecm but there are so many parameters
that can be effected with a tune and this is group of people wish to help steer you for the best way not for you to dump money needlessly.
We all would enjoy free tunes but still you need experience like Vince has I had my FI tuned by a so called expert and after RT Tuning Vince worked it there was a huge night and day difference.
You will far ahead with a up-rev tune against a non tuned Z Just step back and look at what everyone else has to say. Most of us have built up our rides
with out shops but I know of only a few who tune their own and they too use up-rev or cobb.
No matter what good luck and if you find a better way post it up..
with the answers.
Yes is is not cheap to tune the VQ ecm but there are so many parameters
that can be effected with a tune and this is group of people wish to help steer you for the best way not for you to dump money needlessly.
We all would enjoy free tunes but still you need experience like Vince has I had my FI tuned by a so called expert and after RT Tuning Vince worked it there was a huge night and day difference.
You will far ahead with a up-rev tune against a non tuned Z Just step back and look at what everyone else has to say. Most of us have built up our rides
with out shops but I know of only a few who tune their own and they too use up-rev or cobb.
No matter what good luck and if you find a better way post it up..
04-07-2011, 10:30 AM
#28
I agree, if its bone stock, still running stock cats especially... you wont have much gains. Maybe the throttle ramping and a slightly higher rev limiter will be beneficial but prob not at the cost perspective.
As far as cost associated, there are alot of things that go into account. Like I said the way Nissan does there ECU's with muliple ROMS for one specific make and model, it takes alot to stay on top of. Look at Cobb, they clearly cracked the code on the ECU and was able to tune them, but there biggest issue was staying on top of the continually changing ECU designs and ROMs that nissan comes out with every year. the 370z is a GEN4 ECU. That means from 2003 to present the have changed the ECU configuration 4 Times, I feel that alone would be a constant work load of R&D
As far as the complication, I'm sure Jared could speak specifics, but these ECUs have multiple Fuel maps, throttle maps, ignition maps, and alot of security protocols that don't allow you to switch ROM files from one ECU to another, and like I said Nissan comes out with hundreds of different ROMS a year.
I guess at the end of the day you can look at how many people are cracking the code and making software for end user tune ability... I only know of one...
So it means it either takes alot of money to get it started and do it or its very hard....which in my mind is the same thing....
As far as cost associated, there are alot of things that go into account. Like I said the way Nissan does there ECU's with muliple ROMS for one specific make and model, it takes alot to stay on top of. Look at Cobb, they clearly cracked the code on the ECU and was able to tune them, but there biggest issue was staying on top of the continually changing ECU designs and ROMs that nissan comes out with every year. the 370z is a GEN4 ECU. That means from 2003 to present the have changed the ECU configuration 4 Times, I feel that alone would be a constant work load of R&D
As far as the complication, I'm sure Jared could speak specifics, but these ECUs have multiple Fuel maps, throttle maps, ignition maps, and alot of security protocols that don't allow you to switch ROM files from one ECU to another, and like I said Nissan comes out with hundreds of different ROMS a year.
I guess at the end of the day you can look at how many people are cracking the code and making software for end user tune ability... I only know of one...
So it means it either takes alot of money to get it started and do it or its very hard....which in my mind is the same thing....
04-07-2011, 10:49 AM
#30
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Alex I am not trying to flame you but you come into this forum asking questions that we (well most of us) try to answer for you but you battle
with the answers.
Yes is is not cheap to tune the VQ ecm but there are so many parameters
that can be effected with a tune and this is group of people wish to help steer you for the best way not for you to dump money needlessly.
We all would enjoy free tunes but still you need experience like Vince has I had my FI tuned by a so called expert and after RT Tuning Vince worked it there was a huge night and day difference.
You will far ahead with a up-rev tune against a non tuned Z Just step back and look at what everyone else has to say. Most of us have built up our rides
with out shops but I know of only a few who tune their own and they too use up-rev or cobb.
No matter what good luck and if you find a better way post it up..
with the answers.
Yes is is not cheap to tune the VQ ecm but there are so many parameters
that can be effected with a tune and this is group of people wish to help steer you for the best way not for you to dump money needlessly.
We all would enjoy free tunes but still you need experience like Vince has I had my FI tuned by a so called expert and after RT Tuning Vince worked it there was a huge night and day difference.
You will far ahead with a up-rev tune against a non tuned Z Just step back and look at what everyone else has to say. Most of us have built up our rides
with out shops but I know of only a few who tune their own and they too use up-rev or cobb.
No matter what good luck and if you find a better way post it up..
Im not battle Im just trying to see the differences and try to justify the cost.
I agree, if its bone stock, still running stock cats especially... you wont have much gains. Maybe the throttle ramping and a slightly higher rev limiter will be beneficial but prob not at the cost perspective.
As far as cost associated, there are alot of things that go into account. Like I said the way Nissan does there ECU's with muliple ROMS for one specific make and model, it takes alot to stay on top of. Look at Cobb, they clearly cracked the code on the ECU and was able to tune them, but there biggest issue was staying on top of the continually changing ECU designs and ROMs that nissan comes out with every year. the 370z is a GEN4 ECU. That means from 2003 to present the have changed the ECU configuration 4 Times, I feel that alone would be a constant work load of R&D
As far as the complication, I'm sure Jared could speak specifics, but these ECUs have multiple Fuel maps, throttle maps, ignition maps, and alot of security protocols that don't allow you to switch ROM files from one ECU to another, and like I said Nissan comes out with hundreds of different ROMS a year.
I guess at the end of the day you can look at how many people are cracking the code and making software for end user tune ability... I only know of one... So it means it either takes alot of money to get it started and do it or its very hard....which in my mind is the same thing....
As far as cost associated, there are alot of things that go into account. Like I said the way Nissan does there ECU's with muliple ROMS for one specific make and model, it takes alot to stay on top of. Look at Cobb, they clearly cracked the code on the ECU and was able to tune them, but there biggest issue was staying on top of the continually changing ECU designs and ROMs that nissan comes out with every year. the 370z is a GEN4 ECU. That means from 2003 to present the have changed the ECU configuration 4 Times, I feel that alone would be a constant work load of R&D
As far as the complication, I'm sure Jared could speak specifics, but these ECUs have multiple Fuel maps, throttle maps, ignition maps, and alot of security protocols that don't allow you to switch ROM files from one ECU to another, and like I said Nissan comes out with hundreds of different ROMS a year.
I guess at the end of the day you can look at how many people are cracking the code and making software for end user tune ability... I only know of one...
So it means it either takes alot of money to get it started and do it or its very hard....which in my mind is the same thing....Yes all understand able and thank your for your input.
----------------------------------------------------
And for everyone else Im not on here to show my A$$ or down the Z and try to make the Evo out to be some god. I wouldnt of bought the Z if I was that die hard. I dont want to get started off on the wrong foot here. But the both cars have there advantages and disadvantages.
04-07-2011, 03:27 PM
#31
Even on a BONE STOCK Z (yes, even with the stock airbox and filter which is great IMO), an Uprev dyno tune is by far the most HP per dollar spent. If you count area under the curve which is what really matters and what you feel, it's even more significant.
04-07-2011, 03:40 PM
#32
the answer is simple. there is no open source tuning for our car. there is only 1 rom reflasher. they want to make as much money as possible and pay their reverse engineering programmers a good bit of money.
so you pay alot of money for a NA tune.
Like you said, dont waste your money. Have someone bump your timing 2* with a cipher cable and go race. Sell the car and buy something with an open source tuner.
so you pay alot of money for a NA tune.
Like you said, dont waste your money. Have someone bump your timing 2* with a cipher cable and go race. Sell the car and buy something with an open source tuner.
04-07-2011, 08:20 PM
#33
Living in 350Z
iTrader: (30)
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Spartanburg(SparkleCity), SC
Posts: 4,293
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Choose only 2 from this list: Fast, Reliable, Cheap
Cheap Solution:
Better Solution:
Best Solution:
It comes down to how much benefit do you want for your money? Especially in a class where you can't make other mods, do you want to have an advantage, or do you want to save money. I'm not giving you a hard time about the cost, it's a fair question.
I'm not building my car to be competitive, I'm building it to have fun, so I'm not looking to pay for advantage. However, it sounds like you want to be competitive, but don't want to pay for an advantage in this case that is legal for your class. If a competitor pays for this advantage, are you going to be competitive against him without it? Are you ok with that?
Cheap Solution:
Originally Posted by ImportPartsPro
Actually for $300 you could just send UpRev your ECU for a one time flash.
Originally Posted by djamps
Even on a BONE STOCK Z (yes, even with the stock airbox and filter which is great IMO), an Uprev dyno tune is by far the most HP per dollar spent. If you count area under the curve which is what really matters and what you feel, it's even more significant.
I'm not building my car to be competitive, I'm building it to have fun, so I'm not looking to pay for advantage. However, it sounds like you want to be competitive, but don't want to pay for an advantage in this case that is legal for your class. If a competitor pays for this advantage, are you going to be competitive against him without it? Are you ok with that?
04-08-2011, 04:48 AM
#35
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It comes down to how much benefit do you want for your money? Especially in a class where you can't make other mods, do you want to have an advantage, or do you want to save money. I'm not giving you a hard time about the cost, it's a fair question.
I'm not building my car to be competitive, I'm building it to have fun, so I'm not looking to pay for advantage. However, it sounds like you want to be competitive, but don't want to pay for an advantage in this case that is legal for your class. If a competitor pays for this advantage, are you going to be competitive against him without it? Are you ok with that?
I do not believe the money spent will make a beneficial increase for the amount. The $300 to send my ecu may be what I want to look at.
I think my brakes and tires will give me enough of an edge as most of the guys in my class do not look at this kind of stuff. They just look at it from a power aspect.
Ive been racing for a while now and a proper tire and suspension setup with out drive just pure HP. Plus I got a nasty JDM driver mod
04-08-2011, 06:18 AM
#37
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thats Kinda what I was thinking. I dont think Im going to bother with the ECU.
Let me ask you guys this what could I sell the VQ and 6spd tran for total drivetrain. 60k miles on it
04-08-2011, 07:53 AM
#39
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Mooresville NC
Posts: 69
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Is that why 6th gear grinds I thought it was quite weird for 6th to grind. I thought maybe it was just me not being use to driving a 6 speed like maybe my motion was wrong cuz it only does it if i skip shift it seams
04-08-2011, 08:03 AM
#40
Registered User
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Alabama
Posts: 497
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yep, all the pre-06 trannys are prone to syncro problems, my 5th and 6th grind. If you had a CD0009 (06 tranny) that combo would be worth up to $2k, thats why i mentioned it.