alpine

Turbo Shoot-Out Magazine Event (looking for support)

Ok people, my car just got officially accepted into a "turbo shoot out" with a well known sports car magazine. I don't want to get into the name right now, but trust me, it's real and will be disclosed when necessary.

I am seriously looking for sponsors, and of course any logos/decals/necessary agreements will be considered, of course Shout-Outs!

The only problem here is that we have a very short notice to perform.

I've know about this for about 2 weeks now however we just got the "approval" yesterday from the editor.

As some of you know, I have the APS twin turbo kit on my '03 Track Edition Daytona Blue and we'll be providing a 100 octane map for the shoot out, and expect to provide serious/useable numbers from a streetable car.

We are honestly not likely to kill the competition; however the car will make an impressive mark and lasting impression.

I only say this because I'm sure someone will provide a 600HP+ car, which may do great on the Dyno, but they will not performance equally on the track and vice-versa. My car is/will be exceptionally well tuned & balanced for the task at hand, plus the future usage/promotional of my car.

They are scoring Dyno, drivability, track time, slalom, skid pad, etc..etc..

I currently track my car, and of course will continue to do so.

I currently have support / sponsoring / discounting from Brainstorm Performance Los Angeles as well as some of their vendors (labor/tuning) and Toyo Tires, and N.V.C.A.R (paint/body), TSW and/or Enkei (wheels), Do Luck was interested, but is outside our timeline. Mobile Connection San Fernando (Car Audio Video). Potentially HKS will be on board if product is available. Performance Nissan is supportive as always.
We have less than 2 weeks to get product and complete installation.

I will need additional support in the following areas.

Brakes: Calipers / Pads / Lines / fluids (I currently have brembos).

Body: Kit / Components / Wing

Gagues: Boost / Oil Temp / Pressure / Water Temp / Fuel pressure
I was seeking the DEFI Heads Up Display if anyone can help me there.

Suspension: Coil over / Springs / Sway / YOU NAME IT

Wheels: Looking for a light 19" in order to have more contact, must
accommodate my brembos.

Drivetrain: LSD, I currently have Limited Slip, and it does well, but we could obviously do better.

These are the must haves that I know about, I am not only interested in product, but technical support as well.

Thanks for any and all time/effort taken!

If there is any additional information necessary to approach this seriously, please advise and I will provide it immediately.

Joe

ajk4

a majority of people on here read the magazine your talking about and considering that they just announced that this would be going on it's kinda obvious who your talking about. but dont worry i wont out ya. anyways, as far as brakes are concerned i think the brembos are fine. if you dump 3-5k into a somewhat better kit you'll just get very small gains anyway. if its a performance test a body kit shouldnt be necessary but i understand your z to look as good as possible. i cant really help out on the gauges but i have a aem wideband that i want to get rid of. and for suspension i would go with sways and maybe springs, but leave out coilovers. and as far as the shoot-out is concerned, why are they having a handling/braking tests for turbo kits? also shouldnt the groups be seperated by who has built engines and who has stock internals? seems like someone could just come in with a kit that might not be as effective or effecient but if they dump enough money into it and crank up the boost could easily win.

Brandon@Forged

Are you looking for products you should get?

I suggest:

Stoptech upgrade for Brembo-equipped Z's.

LSD...not sure, i'd recommend Quaife, but I don't think you could get one from them yet. (even though that would be a good oppurtunity for them to get the product out there for the 350Z)

Body kit...i'd go with something simplistic...the cleaner the more people that will like it, consider Wald or Junction Produce or GReddy.

Gauges, yeah, go with Defi LINK series.

Handling...Eibach sways, and Tein FLEX coilovers with Tein EDFC.

19" wheels...i'd consider SSR GT3's or Volk Racing TE37's or G-Games 77 Wolfe wheels...all of those are lightweight and relatively simple design-wise.

alpine

yea I want a Quaife but no, there is no news as to availability.

The stoptechs 2 piece upgrade is something I am looking into, and we are talking with Volk as of last night.

My tuner shop isn't really thrilled about Tein's and favors HKS, I like the EDFC concept but I wouldn't want necessarily want that for performance....

Body, yes I'm with you on "keeping it simple", those that no me reacognize that in me that I don't like obnoxious crap. That's why to date I haven't worked on the exterior but for the magazine event, I'd need to do "something".

Thanks for the input, keep it coming.

Joe

dank311

iTrader: (8)

If you want good, instant locking power, than I wouldn't go with quaife...I would go with a clutch type LSD...Nismo, Cusco, ATS, Kaaz etc...I just installed my nismo 1.5 way LSD last weekend, and I must say that it is the best mod I have done to any of my cars! Trust me, you shouldnt be doing any of those big power mods without one. The stock VLSD wont be up to task to handle the power of a TT Z. This should prob be the first thing done to any Z car. It greatly improves all aspects of performance...acceleration, braking, turning, launches, drifts, throttle inputs, etc...

Jon

sbcbaseball

iTrader: (4)

WHATS UP ALPINE,

Just bought stoptech brembo upgrde 2 piece rotors with ss lines they are very nice.Should have them within next two weeks.Good luck with the sponsors bud.


Al

alpine

Thanks for not "outing me" it's not a huge secret or anything.

All of the magazines are going to be doing this type of thing, it's just a matter of who/what shows up, and how it all comes together.

As far as gains, not looking for huge gains on anything, just a little nicer response under "professional track conditions".

I've said this before, and I know there are people out there that will have a conniption, the 350z does pretty damn well as it is.

Someone will defintely bring in built engines, and pump up the boost, and do whatever it takes to make numbers... But at the same time, not everyone can go around dumping over 20K into their cars so it will be refresshing to many to have a car do VERY well in a matchup.

Let me know about the AEM wideband.

thanks

alpine

Heya! Yea that's something I am leaning towards, get them installed sooner than later so I can check them out!

See

alpine

I'm with you on the need of an LSD, but I have been spending some time and speaking with people that do this type of a thing as a living, and I am getting various input (as always) as to what an LSD will do, how it will do it, and which technological/mechanical approach works best. Gears Vs. Clutches sounds better to me anyday, however I'm not an expert.

Thus far the VLSD is doing very well, I know it won't hold up, and I do want an LSD for high speed corning improvement, and clearly it will help in launching, but it won't necessarily solve the wheel sping problem I have due to high HP.

Drifting is not much of an interest to me, but it something I have done, and will most likely do again, just not consistently.

I had been leaning towards the Nismo diff, however between the various pieces of advise, I have considering the Kaaz and the Quaife.

Joe

Brandon@Forged

The Quaife should be the best, they have a lifetime warranty that covers it with everything, no matter where you were, what you were doing, and what mods you have, if you break it, they'll replace it. And it will be the most quiet LSD for street and track use.

Just curious dank311, how's that Nismo LSD as far as noise?

alpine

I'm 100% pro quaife on their design, and concept.

I haven't heard "all good things" about them as a company, but I doubt any of them are "perfect" in everyones eyes.

The problem here is availability.

As far as noise from clutch based diffs, from what I've been told, the biggest thing about them is to be broken in properly and maintained.

With this in mind, and in practive, noise is virtually eliminated as a non issue.

Brandon@Forged

alpine, have you tried to get in touch with Quaife? Even though they haven't released them, they are working on them, you may want to tell them your story and your car and mods and see if they can offer you a prototype to try.

alpine

I have not spoken to them directly lately, I have been kept informed by others, you make a good point though. I'll do that.

thanks again

bwzabodyn

iTrader: (2)

I know exactly what's going on and I know that a well-balanced car that is going to be able to actually "complete" the tests is the one that will be successful - Handling and stopping should be your #1/2 priorities... here's what I suggest:

1) Nismo LSD - an exceptional upgrade over stock LSD (maybe Performance Nissan can help out with this)
2) HKS Hypermax II coilovers are great if you can't source a higher-end setup (ie Moton's, etc) on short notice
3) See if you can get with 350EVO to source out some misc. suspension parts, such as Swaybars, Camber/Toe Kits, Adjustable A-Arms, etc - they are also another source for the LSD
4) I think the Stoptech 2-piece slotted rotors, paired with a good set of racing pads (various ones out there will do the trick), stainless steel lines, and Motul fluid will be a great setup for the track - many people underestimate the power of the stock setup, but when paired with the right rotors and some good fluid, it's as good as anything else out there...
5) Wheels and Tires - If you are set on 19's (which there isn't anything wrong with that - except limited tire choices in R-compounds), you really only have two choices - Volk TE37's or CE28N's (Titanium silver CE's on a DB Z would look sick) - I would go with 9.5's all the way around (less aggressive offset in front - high 20's, low 30's - and more aggressive in the rear - low 20's) with Michelin Pilot Sport Cup R-compund tires in 245/40 fronts and 275/35 rears...
6) For the Body kit, I would go with something subtle as you mentioned before - the Greddy Kit is one of my favorites and looks great on DB Z's (like the Greddy company car)

alpine

Thanks for the info and confirmations. I'm personally not a greddy fan, although I must admit I do like some of their body parts.

dank311

iTrader: (8)

I have a few things to say...
About LSD's:
The nismo is a great unit and it used in many professional race cars, as is cusco, ATS, Kaaz, etc... Gear LSD's are preffered by some, but from the research I have done shows that clutch LSDs are ultimate for performance in mind. Noise issues is subjective. Yes, the Nismo LSD does make a few noises (95% of the noises only occur during slower sharp turn....but, if you disengage the clutch, it doesn't make them, but the wheel will skip alittle also.) To me this noise is nothing compared to the performance you are getting. It is nothing that will get on your nerves *IMO*. But like I said, noise is subjective to how much you can handle. Each person has their own perception of what is too loud or not. The break in, fluids used, install, etc can also have an influence of how loud the noise will be. To me, you arent driving a real sports car unless you have a good LSD. If you havent ever had one, on your car...get one, and you will clearly see why I say this. If you wanna put up a real fight against those other cars in this "shoot-out" for the magazine, you definately need a good LSD. But, I would also address everything else in the suspension genre. (coilovers, control arms, sways, whees/tires, etc..) I would really like to see your car get above 1G on the skidpad! It would really surprise alot of the Z haters out there! and yes, it most definately can be done. (IIRC, sports compact car did an article on their project Z which got a 1G on the skidpad with jsut Kaaz LSD, Hotchkis sways, and 275's all around..I also believe that they had some kind of springs or something, but I dont remember...But, I believe that was it, but i could be wrong..double check for me) But, with some quality coilovers, professionally corner wieghted and tuned, with the other mods should be quite impressive! I'm looking forward to the results!

Second of all about coilovers/suspension:
I did a huge writeup/FAQ in the suspension section of this forum...read it and then you will be able to narrow down your choices...another thing is, HKS is great and all, but there coilovers arent anywhere near the best. Yes, they are very nice...heck, Im considering them for my daily driver, but one thing that really makes me not want to get them is the fact that they dont have a seperate shock perch to adjust height from. This way you can use the shock perch, instead of the spring perch(which should be used for adjusting preload) to lower the car w/o effecting travel. This is very important for a car which I assume you will be lowering. Again, read that FAQ I posted...it contain just about all the information you could possible get about suspension/wheels/tires/alignment, etc....well, there are tons of technical things not in there, but most of the big points are covered. As for coilovers, my picks would be Zeal(first, always and forever), Cusco, Silk Road, and Kei office. Just please dont get JIC, or Tein...get something qualit! If you want any help choosing coilover, I have done ALOT of research on them in the past 4 months, and I am getting ready to choose a set for myself...just PM if you want any further help. I would love to see how some of the top name coilovers, along with the rest of the suspension setup, will handle the tests of the shoot out!

Jon

alpine

Thanks for the info, I will be heading over to your writeup after this.

Noise, I'm with you on that 100%, I don't like "noise" but there is particular sounds/volumes I can appreciate or tolerate. Grinding, clickity-clack sounds at every slow turn is not something I can appreciate, but as you said that is me and everyone is different.

I've driven many cars with LSD, I haven't owned one, I've wanted one for a while now, but first I wanted the Turbos and now with the Shoot Out coming up, it's been re-prioritized as a need vs want. I'm sure you know how that goes.

Now about Gear Vs Clutch, and clutch being for the ultimate in performance, I'm not sure that should be qualified. My un-expert thinking is that gears are not going to wear out and do not require the same maintenance/replacement that clutches do, and in the case of the Quaife, we are talking about 50/50 power split 100% of the time which is "perfect" right?

I don't have first hand experience here either, but I also haven't found anything substantial (yet) to indicate how well a LSD is going to hold up under these higher horsepower/driving conditions.

So at least from my current point of view, with the information I have found, gear performance is greater, and over the life of the car/drivetrain, costs should be less.

thanks again! (going to your write up)

Brandon@Forged

dank, i'm not concerned if race cars use the LSD, they don't have to worry about sound...although that does show that they hold up on the track. Quaife is not made for that, it has a dual purpose, which IMO, makes it tougher to make to work properly. And you just can not beat the warranty...you break it, no matter what, they'll replace it.

With that said, what kind of sounds does the NISMO make? Does it sounds like gears turning loudly? (kind of like a machine gun sound)

I'm curious as to why Tein FLEX or some of those coilovers aren't good quality? (i'm not being sarcastic, just trying to learn more about handling, as I do not know much about it)

dank311

iTrader: (8)

Yea, the noises of the nismo LSD really aren't bad at all. If you are really worried, or anyone for that matter, you can quiet the noise down with different fluid(regular oil), or you could get something like the Cusco RS which uses spring loaded plates to reduce friction and noises, as well as making it last longer. I also think ATS makes a carbon loaded LSD, but im not sure if they have them for the Z33 yet. For the Gear Vs. Clutch, I'm not positive b/c I haven't had first hand experience with both clutch-type and gear-type LSD's. But, from what I have heard, helical LSD's have differenct lock characteristics than clutch-type LSD's do. But, I'm pretty sure that the Quaife wont lock up as quick and as hard as a clutch type would. But, once again, this is all in drivers preference. Same thing as choosing 1, 1.5, or 2 way for a clutch type. The good thing about nismo is that is adjustble from 1.5 and 2 way. You can also adjust the intial torque with the LSD on the car from 60%/80%/100%. So you can always set it on the lowest setting if you perfer that for daily driving, and then bump it up if you would like to on certain days or for track events. It only takes about 30 mins to do, its very easy! Also, during slow tight turns, if you press the clutch in, it wont make those noises. I mean, every time I go somewhere in my car I might hear it 2-3 times..and if I press the clutch in, I usually wont here it at all. Also, there is no grinding noises whatsoever in my LSD. If you have the stereo up at regular volumes (vol 10-15 on stock CD player) you cant even hear it..and I assume if you had an exhaust and two turbos singing under the hood, that will also decrease your chances of hearing anything. But, its all in your preference. If possible, drive/ride in someone who has a clutchtype in the Z. Its not as loud as other cars since the Z has decent sound deadening interior.

nis350ztt-
The noise the LSD makes is kind of a popping or clunking type of noise. Its not too noticeble. But, since I still have the stock exhaust, it expect it to be less noticable when I do get an exhaust. I mean, when I drove it for the first time with the LSD on, I was like, wow, this isnt bad at all. I only hear the noise once the very first time on the test drive, then we went to a parking lot and did figure eights and then just started drifting it to break it in. That is when I heard the pops the most doing figure eights. Its really only on tight turns that are in 1st or second gear...doing most regular driving and anything bigger than a 90 degree turn, you really wont hear much. But, After breaking it in, I thought it really wasnt that bad, I was even expecting it to be alot louder, but it was really quiet IMO. But, I do come from a 240sx that was semi-gutted...
the warranty on the Quaife(I wasnt even aware of this) is cool and definately worth it, but I would wait until I saw someone actually get theirs replaced under warranty first. Would this cover just regular wear from driving though. I mean, when it needs to be replaced after a years worth of use, they will just give you a free one, with no costs? I kinda find that hard to believe..but maybe Im wrong.(I havent done much research on the Quaife in a while) Plus, I have dealt with alot of companies before, and some dont acknowledge what they advertise. But, again, I do not have any first hand experience with Quaife and they might be a company who has great customer service. But, IMO, if you are already spending soo much money on the car a clutch type LSD is definately worth it IMO. I was blown away with the nismo on the Z. It made it feel like a REAL sports car! And most clutch type LSDs now days will last a pretty good while, especially if you arent abusing it too much if your car is a daily driver. I would say at least a year before it needs to be overhauled. Just think of it as a clutch..hehe.
As for the Tein FLEX's. Those are really more for a street setup with highl spring rates to mask their poorly valved dampers. I have had experience with Tein's on my S14, and they are known to have poor valving. I mean, these are good, but for the price(not saying that its a horrible price), there can coilovers had for just $100-300 more that are much better IMO. Another reasons why I dont like tein is that they have a twin tube design, which is why they are somewhat cheap. Silk roads have the same specs of Zeal(inverted monotube, 10/8 spring rates, double height adjustability, solid pillowball upper mounts, etc..) but for $1600. They are also made from the same company as Kei office, and GP sports. The only good thing Tein has going for them; rather than a decent entry level coilover for a ok price; is that they can rebuild in the US. But Zeal also has that, and Zeal also comes with a warranty! I could point out a few other smaller detailed things in teins design that I dont like, but the above are the real points that matter...the rest is more subjective. I have been through alot of coilovers in the past, and have known alot of friends who have done the same, and I the best ones I have had experience with is Zeal and Cusco. But, I really eager to try some Silk Roads or Kei office coilovers. They might be my next mod, but well see

Jon