Why does everyone complain about the 350z's weight?
09-12-2006, 05:59 AM
#61
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Originally Posted by Built2shredZ
Somone is smokin crack 
the 350z coupe weight ranges from 3200-3360 depending on which model and equipment that comes with it... The Touring Roadster weighs 3600 lbs..
the 350z coupe weight ranges from 3200-3360 depending on which model and equipment that comes with it... The Touring Roadster weighs 3600 lbs..
09-12-2006, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by feiji
Here's a link to an article in this month's Tuner Performance Reports. It's about weight reduction on a 350z and the benefits. There's a little more info in the mag.
http://www.tprmag.com/issue/16/light_club.shtml
http://www.tprmag.com/issue/16/light_club.shtml
Cool link.
Does anyone have similar math for calculating the benefits of lowering unsprung/rotational weight (e.g. Wheels, flywheels, etc...)
09-12-2006, 10:04 AM
#66
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Originally Posted by Kolia
The Impreza’s white body is pretty stiff too, but I don’t think it’s has stiff as the Z’s. The sedan body is pretty much hollow.
Look at the Z’s white body construction. Integrated rear strut tower mount, a huge center cross member in the rear console plus the box shape around the fuel tank. Plus all the melt sheets (sound deadening), underbody air flow management. The car is relatively small, so chassis components must bit pretty stiff to protect the occupants in case of a crash. Thanks to some hot stamped bit here and there, it’s not that heavy.
Like some already mentioned, consider the cars MSRP of 27k and it’s impact on the design and material selection.
A Corvette Z06 is lighter. But it’s pretty much all aluminum, magnesium and has a balsa floor! The interior garnish have about half the number of mounting clips that other manufacturer uses. Hello rattles down the road (not that ours is impervious to that…).
The car feels heavier than it is in part because if it steering. That steering is heavier than most grocery getters we learned to drive in. But it’s similar to that of a BMW. Drive an NSX on day, and you’ll notice that the steering is even heavier, yet that car is relatively light and pretty nimble with it central engine.
Or drive an Elise one day. Very very light car, with quasi telepathic steering and controls. But a PITA in daily drives!
Look at the Z’s white body construction. Integrated rear strut tower mount, a huge center cross member in the rear console plus the box shape around the fuel tank. Plus all the melt sheets (sound deadening), underbody air flow management. The car is relatively small, so chassis components must bit pretty stiff to protect the occupants in case of a crash. Thanks to some hot stamped bit here and there, it’s not that heavy.
Like some already mentioned, consider the cars MSRP of 27k and it’s impact on the design and material selection.
A Corvette Z06 is lighter. But it’s pretty much all aluminum, magnesium and has a balsa floor! The interior garnish have about half the number of mounting clips that other manufacturer uses. Hello rattles down the road (not that ours is impervious to that…).
The car feels heavier than it is in part because if it steering. That steering is heavier than most grocery getters we learned to drive in. But it’s similar to that of a BMW. Drive an NSX on day, and you’ll notice that the steering is even heavier, yet that car is relatively light and pretty nimble with it central engine.
Or drive an Elise one day. Very very light car, with quasi telepathic steering and controls. But a PITA in daily drives!
I have read that the new Z06's fundamental mode is >25Hz (measure of stiffness or rigidity), stiff for a car, but I dont if its bending or torsion. The 612 Scaglietti body is very stiff at 49.4Hz - all aluminum body. The new Chevy Cobalt has bending stiffness of 27Hz using underbody stiffners. I dont have any comparable measure for Z or other cars.
A sedan with with a rigid roof structure can considerably increase the stiffness, its not hard to make a lightweight rigid roof structure. So I wouldnt be surprised if STi's stiffness is close to the Z. Evo also has a stiffened chassis.
Z has strut bars - front and back, rear bulkhead and underbody stiffners. I know it could be stiffer, but then you are entering into the trade studies how much it would cost for engineering to optimize it and the manufacturing costs.
On heavy steerings, isnt it just the power steering gain that affects the feel or is it the something else in the train?
Last edited by spacemn_spiff; 09-12-2006 at 10:51 AM.
09-12-2006, 10:08 PM
#67
My bad, you guys are right:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curb_weight
Curb (Kerb) weight is the total weight of an automobile with standard equipment, oil, lubricants, coolant, a full tank of fuel and not loaded with either passengers or cargo.
This definition may differ from definitions used by governmental regulatory agencies.
Additionally, organizations may define curb weight with fixed levels of fuel and other variables to equalize the value for the comparison of different vehicles.
It is generally provided as a statistic about automobile weights, along with gross weight, which represents the weight of an automobile when fully loaded. The difference between gross weight and curb weight is the total passenger and cargo weight capacity of the vehicle.
So I guess what that really means is take curb weights with a grain of salt, because they are not held to a specific standard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curb_weight
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
Curb (Kerb) weight is the total weight of an automobile with standard equipment, oil, lubricants, coolant, a full tank of fuel and not loaded with either passengers or cargo.
This definition may differ from definitions used by governmental regulatory agencies.
Additionally, organizations may define curb weight with fixed levels of fuel and other variables to equalize the value for the comparison of different vehicles.
It is generally provided as a statistic about automobile weights, along with gross weight, which represents the weight of an automobile when fully loaded. The difference between gross weight and curb weight is the total passenger and cargo weight capacity of the vehicle.
09-14-2006, 01:44 AM
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Originally Posted by btchnzcar
Has anyone tried scraping out the sound deadening tar under the carpet? I did this in my Supra, and it turned out to be about 45 pounds! I wonder if the Z is at all close to this.
09-15-2006, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by ZLadie2000
Anyone tried opening up the doors and seeing if there is a reasonable way to loose weight there? The doors are sooo heavy...
09-17-2006, 10:32 AM
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Just to provide another data point, the Z4 coupe, another 2-seater w/ a 6-cylinder engine, has a curb weight of 3100 lb., compared to 3350-3400 (depending on the trim) for the 350Z. 250 lb. is quite a big difference.
I suppose people are "complaining" because of these lighter competitions in the same category.
I suppose people are "complaining" because of these lighter competitions in the same category.
09-18-2006, 11:17 PM
#78
Originally Posted by Jspeed
Just to provide another data point, the Z4 coupe, another 2-seater w/ a 6-cylinder engine, has a curb weight of 3100 lb., compared to 3350-3400 (depending on the trim) for the 350Z. 250 lb. is quite a big difference.
I suppose people are "complaining" because of these lighter competitions in the same category.
I suppose people are "complaining" because of these lighter competitions in the same category.
09-19-2006, 04:59 AM
#79
Originally Posted by Armitage
And a base model Z4 starts at over $50k, more than $10k for the priciest-model Z. THATS a big difference.
11-21-2006, 02:11 PM
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z4s cost almost 10 grand less then $50k dude
either way, people say the Z is heavy because most people in the world, dont know what they are talking about, ive weighed my 04 base model in at 3190lbs, with stock exhaust half tank of gas, lsd and no spare tire. my wheels are pretty heavy too, but i dont know the difference between them and the factory 17s.
3200ish lbs is not alot, especially in modern times with all the safet crap, all the people that complain are damn honda kids and rx8 people that think their car weighs under 2500 lbs.
either way, people say the Z is heavy because most people in the world, dont know what they are talking about, ive weighed my 04 base model in at 3190lbs, with stock exhaust half tank of gas, lsd and no spare tire. my wheels are pretty heavy too, but i dont know the difference between them and the factory 17s.
3200ish lbs is not alot, especially in modern times with all the safet crap, all the people that complain are damn honda kids and rx8 people that think their car weighs under 2500 lbs.