If I haven't heard any squealing from the tires yet, does that mean I am still not even close to the car's corning limits?

 

Well . . . yes and no. Yes, that is a sure sign of closing in on the limits of a car. But, with modern tires, there is supposedly less warning between the squeal and breakaway than there once was.

I don't think that it's possible to SAFELY reach a modern sports car's cornering limits on public roads.

 

I`ve wondered this myself. I`ve cornered pretty hard a few times and have heard nothing. I`m wondering, "how much farther can she be pushed?" :-)

 

You SHOULD be able to feal the tires slip around corners near the limit. Its hard to realy explain how that feals and be able to feal it, untill you get on a private track and realy feal "the limit" for your self.

 

Don't worry, she'll squak when at the limit. The good news is that the car's quite well balanced and easy to catch if you really over cook it. IMO, the OEM tires are quite good at making their limits audible.

Solo2 is a great place to discover where those limits are.

 

You need to go to a track, learn the limits of your Z in a safe environment. Do not indanger others while driving your car on the street. there is no way you will ever come close to finding the limits your car or your driving limits on the street.

On a track, you will enter the same turn dozens of times and be able to go a little harder each time without fear of hitting something.

Until you have driven your 350z on a track, you have not really learned how well balanced this car really is! The cost of $150 is cheap considering other options.

Good luck!

Jeff

 

The OEM RE040s love to talk back to you, and are a very communicative tire. They make plenty of noise, trust me. So the answer is, yes, you are far from the car's limits. As zland said, take it to the track and explore the limits there as it's the safest environment to do so.

 

I went to my first Autocross school on Saturday with my Z and had a blast. Drove it hard without VDC on and never lost control of it. Tires squealed like crazy. Next time I'll have to push it even harder cause (apparently) I wasn't to the limit.

 

Thanks for the comments guys....

So you guys don't normally hear squealing on the streets as well. I thought I was the only wimp....

I'll try tracking when I find time from my busy schedule....

 

Not to preach or anything, but you really put yourself in a difficult spot if you start finding the limits on the street.

First, the Z's limits are so high that you will be way over any posted speed limit.

Second, you have not allowed any margin for error or avoidance. Therefore if anything unexpected happens you are totally hosed since you really can't do anything about it.

Third, I've had my Z snap quickly into oversteer twice on the track, and the second time I went into a wall. The first time I was going around a corner with VDC off, and the back end came around and I overcorrected and fishtailed a couple times before spinning 540 into the dirt. A better driver maybe could have saved that one, but it was very strange because the Z had never even come close to oversteering before. The second time I hit a wet spot with VDC on and there was nothing I could do to stop that. The things is that the slight understeer can make you want to turn even more (but the front just plow so you don't actually change course) and then if the rear breakes loose the fronts will suddenly grab and you will oversteer quite suddenly. So, if you are on the street near the limits you may not have room to adjust your line and could potentially have big problems.

Now, just because you are near the limits doesn't necessarily mean you will squeal. Since the 350Z understeers a bit, if you go too hot into a corner you will often get a squeal from the front wheels plowing. However, if you go slower into a corner you can get on the gas and power through a corner often without squealing nearly as much.

Anyhow, I've had the Z near the limits on a couple race tracks and at several AutoX's, and it is really quite fun. After only a few events, it I realized that driving like that on the street is a bad idea, just because you have no margin for unexpected situations that always arise.

If you get a chance, I highly recommend an AutoX or track day (but be careful on the track, hehe).

-D'oh!

 

I too also recommend a track day, driving school or AutoX. I went to a Northwest Alfa Club drviving school event and one of the events that was really cool for illustrating understeer is the skid pad. They wet down the track and had you circle a cone. On wet pavement, when you start getting understeer, the whole car vibrates/shakes very loudly. That was very interesting!

The handling oval and non-timed AutoX they had also was a chance to get the tires squealing. They had you do a few other things too like emergency braking/accident avoidance and a slalom.

I did encounter very sudden oversteer (and spin) when making a left turn when it was raining out a few months ago. I was turning left and it was a downhill left turn. I took the turn a little faster than I normally would (would be no prob if dry out) and was still partly on the gas (ok) but suddenly, I started sliding and my 90 degree left turn turned into a 270 degree turn. It scared the hell out of me since I didn't wanna hit waiting cars or the curb. There was no audible warning at all. I'm now a lot more cautious when it's wet out. I hypothesize that I was getting bad rear traction cuz of the rain and downhill (weight shifted to the front). I definitely didn't suddenly jam on the brakes during the turn.

Oh yeah, since I have an auto, there's no VDC.

 

I have the track version and I tend to get quite a lot of understeer with a slight hint of oversteer for quick turns on the street. For me, I feel the limits are quite low, however, it is fun and handling seems predictable. I think the tires a too skinny.

Whereas I have driven my dad's F360 many times and with my greatest efforts I have yet to get any under or over steer.

Baron

 

I have the track version and I tend to get quite a lot of understeer with a slight hint of oversteer for quick turns on the street. For me, I feel the limits are quite low, however, it is fun and handling seems predictable. I think the tires a too skinny.

Whereas I have driven my dad's F360 many times and with my greatest efforts I have yet to get any under or over steer.

Baron

 

Thats weird because samething happened to me this last weekend. My car always has had understeer, however, this last weekend I was getting oversteer. When it would break lose it would do it all of a sudden. I couldn't feel it coming. I couldn't control it because I wasn't expecting it. Later that day the oversteer turned back into understeer. I figured track temp was causing it but I'm not sure.

 

When were you getting oversteero, exiting corner while on throttle, entering corner at speed/trail braking?

 

I got the sudden oversteer once during corner entry. I was already holding the throttle around 50%. It also happened once during mid corner and twice on corner exit all three of those times I was starting to ease the throttle back to 100%.

 

I think you could solve the corner entry with just going in with more speed and less throttle, keeping the rear tires from working as much.
As for apex, where throttle should be applied, and exit I don't know what to say except for just try being smoother with the throttle application.
Have you been taking tire temps? Inside, middle, out?

I've never driven a 350 or G35, but I keep hearing about this 'sudden oversteer'. Does it just let lose without ANY warning?

 

I have been just feeling the tires and I am working the outside edge on the fronts real good. I need to put more negative camber to balance it out since I can't put anymore air in the tire.

The sudden oversteer is the first time I have experienced it in several track events. Its not like the car is loose going in. It actually felt neutral and with the throttle applied the weight should have been near evenly distributed. Then suddenly out of no where my rear end kicks out. Then only things I thought could cause it were, it was marbles and dirt on my tires, I let go of the gas and didn't realize it, or the track temp had something to do with it.