QdotJ

iTrader: (13)

Forever tunning my system, trying to find that sweet spot. Of course one's ear is the true determinant of what sounds "perfect." Yet, can someone give me an idea of optimum crossover slopes on a four channel amp as well as a graphic EQ? Thanks in advance to everyone for their constructive and positive input.

Oh yeah, I've searched and came up pretty empty...

Current Equipment:

Headunit - Panasonic CQVD6503U

Amp - Alpine PDX 4.150

Front Speakers - Morel Dotech MKII's

Subwoofer Seas Lotus SW250/1 (2007 Version)

sibble

your ears, the environment in which your listening to music, as well as a lot of other things makes an answer to this question unique.

noone can really tell you how to set your equalizer.

if you were working with time correction, and your speakers were all in their factory place, someone could give you an answer easily.


EDIT: there is equipment used to calibrate an equalizer, good luck with that i thought about buying it once upon a time, then i woke up when i saw the price

DVFlyer

iTrader: (18)

Not sure about crossover points/ slopes- there should be a general starting point, but reading some of the pro's writings, speaker set up (gains, phase, position) is far more important than EQ'ing.

JimRHIT

iTrader: (6)

per Morel - 3200 6dB/oct slopes ... on the high side and ~55-60Hz 12dB slopes on the low side would be a nice start. I might try 60Hz up front at 12dB and maybe 75-80Hz on the sub at 6dB to add more kick to it, but that is my preference as a self-admitting bass addict.

QdotJ

iTrader: (13)

Thanks everyone ....

Jim I'm going to give those numbers a shot when I get home....

My midrange are set in the factory location, and the tweeters are custom mounted low in the kick-panels per this photo...


Don't mind the strange looking air freshener in the cig lighter...

Vestax

I assume you're not bi-amping and working with passives? I don't know the type of flexibility you have with that equipment but like they said, doing it by ear would be the best way. No one can tell you how to tune based on your vehicle, listening preference, equipment, and install. Just to reiterate though, the meeting of the low pass and high pass from both the sub and front stage is often a nice way to get a cohesive stage.

JimRHIT

iTrader: (6)

The problem you have with doing it by ear is that you are going to most likely prefer a lower XO ... and in going lower and lower you can blow your tweeter in 1 second flat. Most car tweeters have a fairly high resonance (most none are chambered) and like to be XO'd pretty high ... which leaves the mids with energy past 2k and even 3k ... sucking your stage right back down to the floor. (edit .. nm ... his tweets are on the floor)

just be careful with active ... it can be very rewarding ... or saddening to the beginner

Vestax

It goes hand in hand, if one's a noob, with only 4 channels, I doubt that person is going active with comps and subs, let alone trying to attempt to bi-amp components by ear.

QdotJ

iTrader: (13)

Yes I'm utilizing the passive crossovers right out of the box... thanks for the hpf/lpf info... I've been tunning and tweaking for a few days attempting to find that sweet spot.

Well since you are the expert and I'm obviously a "noob" according to you (assuming that comment was directed towards me...), why not offer me a solution instead of a sideways insult... no need to start a pissing contest than can turn into something childish...

Besides, I considered running the midrange and tweeters directly from my amp and by passing the crossovers all together, but now is not the time. Honestly I'm happy with the power I'm working with; suits my purposes well.

StreetOC192

iTrader: (7)

Actually, I would say that "by ear" is not the best way to tune a system.

Given the high end components in the OP's system, I would take it to a shop and have them use an RTA to adjust EQ and crossover slopes/points, give them $100 or whatever they charge you and call it a day.

I would be willing to bet that the passive crossovers that came with the Morel set have enough R&D in them that they will be more effective than going active unless the installer/tuner was himself an audio R&D technician and knew more than the technicians at Morel. So going active might be a fun hobby, but is far from necessery to have a sweet high-end system.

You "CAN" find RTA software to download for free and hook up a mic to a laptop and try to tune it yourself, but it will be hard to find a mic that is high enough quality without spending a couple hundred buck, so it's still cheaper to take it to a pro shop.

Ideally you want a completely flat response, but beware that most people will think this will not sound good, even though it's the way the recording was meant to be heard.

StreetOC192

iTrader: (7)

Hoping not to hijack this thread, but.....

JimRHIT, I know you're the man about this stuff. I thought it wasn't a good idea to overlap your slopes from sub to mid? I thought it can cause cancellation.

SQ Kuk

I feel people have different ways of tuning a system. What works for you may be different from what works for someone else.

I depend on my ears to fine tune my system. I agree with you to use an RTA the first run, to set up a good base.

Fine tuning by ear afterwards allows me to alter it to my liking. For me, ear is the best way to fine tune my system.

The RTA cannot pick up a low stage, stage drag, L/R dependent, depth, bass transition and sometimes resonance. Fine tuning by ear allows the user to tune in those crucial things.

sibble

It's not, but at the same time, it is....

IMHO I wouldn't give anyone $5 to do that. To adjust the EQ, yea I could see someone paying that rather then actually buying the equipment to tune the EQ.

As for the crossover slopes and points, that I find much easier to setup then an EQ. Read the specs on your speakers to find the points. Then play around with the slopes till you like what you hear.

Tuning an eq and crossover basically has 2 parts, staying within your limits and getting that sound that you want.

One important question most audio installers ask their customers when tuning a system is "What type of music do you listen to?"

SQ Kuk

Vestax is a really nice guy always trying to help someone out.
I highly doubt he was attempting to take a cheapshot at you.

StreetOC192

iTrader: (7)

I completely agree that the final tweaking is by ear, however, so many people try to tune their systems and end up throwing it WAY out of whack trying to compensate for certain things. crossovers are easy to figure out, no doubt. EQ's on the other hand aren't all that simple. Pushing up 3dB at 100 Hz is not ONLY affecting 100 Hz. An amatuer tuner must know the basics of how an EQ works.

And maybe your guys' ears are better than mine, but I personally couldn't find a flat frequency response without an RTA. After 2 months, I'm still trying to get it right. Sibble, can you swing by and set my EQ for me

SQ Kuk

What are you looking to improve? What problems do you have?

QdotJ

iTrader: (13)

It's cool, I'm just here for positive and informative input from my fellow audiophiles, 350z, and sound enthusiasts. Which you all have done a great job in... and I thank everyone for it.

It's not what you say, but how you say things that cause miscommunication and arguments. Calling someone a "noob" simply because they are utilizing passive crossovers that were designed to do their job and not running "Full blown" (which could potentially damage my equipment) was just uncalled for.

Last time I checked the term "noob" was not a compliment. Also, comments like these can potentially deter members, both new and old, from asking questions that could do us all a wealth of good.

Call me a "Kumbaya" singing peace maker, but I think there's a difference between being informative and being an insulting smarta55...

Of course we're all guilty of it in and have fallen victim to it was well....

Thanks again everyone, now back to the actual topic....

sibble

you gota have ears like this

Vestax

Hey guys, new acronym for the day.... QTIP! Yes quit taking it personal, notice I did not call anyone directly a noob? If anything, I'm the noob on this forum?

I was replying to Mr. JimRHIT who gave options to cross drivers on an upper end midrange point between the midbass and tweeter, and he advised against tuning by ear possibly blowing out tweeters..... in which I responded that it goes hand in hand, a person who's not running a dedicated front stage for bi-amping is using passives, wouldn't attempt to tune the tweeters by ear, hence... there are no elaborate processor to do so anyways.

Seriously, please, get laid tonight and forget what I said. I really don't give a **** who you are, let alone insult you? All I know is SQ Kuk is one sexy *** original member of Team (Seas) Lotus. (sorry Eng or RJ) Have you guys picked up a Car Audio Electronics Magazine lately? Probably not.

Onto another topic...

Tuning by ear is not a skill for everyone, unless you're a walking RTA, you can definitely pick up things not detected by any measuring machine.... and you can do things by ear and not go by recommendations over the internet, in books, or by a friend.. because every speaker (dome or cone) reacts different in speaker locations (kicks or not, equal pathlengths), especially whether or not you put them on axis or not (staging, rainbow effect), and ultimately user's preference (midbass horny, or just bright loving peaky tweeters). I'll depend on my ears any day over a device. They don't call us Golden Ear Mafias for nuttin' LMAO

SQ Kuk

Thanks for the compliment, but i'm not at OG as you. Im not apart of the GEM squad...

Are you going to Marv's? I'm currently working on a budget system. My budget is $1k. I know... Im a cheap ***, but im broke