this is the part:

13.2 H. Passive restraint systems may not be removed. A horizontal "harness bar" may be used as part of the installation hardware for allowed driver restraint. It may serve no other purpose (e.g., structural enhancement).

 

Wow, that must have been written by a law school drop out!

I'm at a loss as to how to interpret.

 

True enough on the IMO, but my personal observations don't lie.

Adding a harness in my old FD RX-7 and my Zed have instantly made a 1/2 second improvement and likely more in highly transitional courses because you can be that much more supple with the controls AND you get so much more feedback from the chassis (which equals more confidence). All of that is a direct relationship to improved speed.

With my car's setup and my driving capabilities, I literally can't drive my 350z full tilt without a harness. I slide on the leather too much and am using my limbs to brace myself instead of control input. It was actually dangerous to be honest.

I've always recommended a harness to newbies as one of the very first modifications they should do.

 

I don't recall ever seeing a sliding bar (other than bolt in but that would be "rigid") in any car, IMHO it would make it week.

 

Possibly, I was just stating the rules for stock class auto-x. I drive a go-kart I really don't care about seat belts and harness bars at all.

 

yeah, the rules do specifically mention a telescoping bar. However, I think harness bars are currently a gray area, so you'd probabally be ok if you ran one.

 

Right, the gray area comes from the ability to prove or disprove that the bar is actually adding structural ridgitity. Unless of course the maker of the bar states that is does add structural ridgidity in which case there is nothing gray area about it.

 

If it makes you feel any better I would protest you if you did :-P

 

there are people who play absolutely fair to the bone
and there are also people who play grey and get away with it...
as long as its not black and white no one would notice and no one would care...

 

I'd like to make a couple points if I may:

1) Rigid harness bars... if somehow attached to the rear strut towers, then they would be acting as a strut bar... I think this is where the 'adding rigidity' comes into play. Anyone who protests a rigid harness bar attached to the b-pilars or stock seatbelt mounting points should be laughed off the asphalt

2) I still haven't seen in the thread the 'sliding bar' info... any bar that is not solid will immediately give and probably break where it slides - extremely dangerous to the person(s) wearing the harnesses. Thats like using a clothes hanger (you know, the bar some sedans come with that extend across the 'clothes hooks') to mount harnesses to... completely useless

3) I've made my opinions well known on various threads about my discouragement of harnesses w/o roll bars and race seats, type of harnesses, etc. etc. While we as a club that runs track events will not mandate it, we will strongly discourage against newbies using harnesses for HPDE use when starting out. Once people have done enough events to be comfortable with their limits and their car's limits, and know what to do in crisis situations, then we will rest a little easier with them using them without roll-over protection

 

It was bound to happen... a harness bar debate broke out The last time I got snagged into one of these dedates... PedalFaster assisted with this:

I am a member of the SCCA Stock Advisory Committee. In the April SAC conference call, a member letter regarding legality of a solid, non-telescoping harness bar connecting the B-pillar seat belt mounts was discussed. The harness bar clarification published on Page 226 of the 2005 rule book would appear to make such bars legal, but no recommendation was issued to the SEB; instead, the SAC referred the item back to the SEB for further clarification.

So, while your opinion may differ, both the SAC and the SEB currently consider this a gray area. As I mentioned earlier, I expect that we'll publish a clarification shortly.

I haven't looked at the '06 book to see if this has been changed.

BC

 

The rule has not changed.

 

At the 2004 Phoenix National Tour, I saw a HS (L?) Mini driver removing their harness bar under threat of protest. It does happen.

 

Being the designer/manufacturer of the( ) harness bar for 350Z's, I will state that a few owners have told me their car seemed to "creek" a little less over pot-holes. So it does add stiffness to the car. Being an avid reader of magazines, I've noticed many "new" cars brag about the new model being 20%, 40%, or whatever stiffer than their prior model. I'll go out on a limb and state that the BCR Harness bar WILL stiffen the chassis 0.033%! I'll let someone else make claims as to how much JUST the bar improves lap times!

BTW, it wouldn't be too hard to make my main bar 2 different sized tubes, one sliding over the other, but why?

 

ok... kinda playing devil's advocate here... but do you know whether or not the protest was for increased rigidity, or equal restraint for competitors in a given class? I would think a more realistic protest would be not allowing harnesses unless everyone in the class has harnesses... MHO of course

 

Honestly what car would benefit from adding a couple of hundred pounds?

 

david suggests get an s2000
lol

 

Well, if the rules clearly state that a harness is allowed (which they do) then you wouldn't have any ground to stand on. It's like running in BSP with a stock car and protesting that everyone else has modified cars. If the rules state that you can make the modification, it's your own fault if you haven't.

By the way, where is that old harness bar debate thread? I tried to find it, one guy in there said that all of their racing cars were running harnesses off the child seat mount (I believe he referred to it as a harness mount, but it was stock on the car and in the forward trunk, so I think it's the same thing).

 

I'd agree about increased stiffness.

My harness bar must has pulled the two B pillars in a good 1/4" - 1/2". It's a little scary pulling them in like that but there has been no long term effects. The car did feel a little more solid afterwards.

Personally, I wouldn't credit the increased stiffness for improved speed but rather the harnessing effect of the belts thanks to the bar.

 

[QUOTE=FritzMan]I'd agree about increased stiffness.

My harness bar must has pulled the two B pillars in a good 1/4" - 1/2". QUOTE]

May I ask which harness bar did that?