The race section makes this site worth it :D
I got the stage 2 kit but picked the nismo R-tune pads with it and was too cheap to go for the SS lines. (my "stage2" was basically stoptech slotted rotors non-brembo, nismo pads, motul fluid)
I didn't care about "feel", but wanted something safe that holds up for my first track day...
In my personal case I regret that investment (it was safe and fine, but should have gone BBK right away):
After 3 beginner track days my initially brand new rear pads were burnt up down to the metal... (VDC off! NOTE: fronts were still fine, only rears wore like crazy)
I think people do have success with full race pads and it probably does not make much of a difference if run on OEM rotors or other rotors.... and you can get away with that on OEM non-brembo brakes for a while..
But I did not want to get into changing pads for every track day... and I don't need full race pads for stopping power as well...
Also I was worried that with full race pads the balance is lost... while the driver brakes with no worries and no fade, the pads take it, .... suddenly the caliper and rubber stuff or anything else connected overheats...
After I switched to BBK, I have had 6 track days with more advanced driving and being a lot faster than my first 3 times...
rear pads are maybe at 75% and front pads still >55% (NOTE: now the fronts are used up faster which makes sense to me... )
And these are street pads (F.2500) so I didn't have to change them and use them daily driving....
To conclude:
I didn't have the problem of brake failure or fade with my stage2 version...
It just wasn't fun driving with a pedal that felt really soft and needed to be pushed in really deep and for a long time...
The main reason for me to get a BBK was pad life, and it looks like it paid off so far.
If BBK is too expensive and you track often... it might be cheaper to switch out rotors every year and use full race pads on the track only.
Met an instructor with a BMW... she said that she can get rotors really cheap... 50$ or so.. she switches to full race pads every track day... and has to renew rotors once a year.
I didn't care about "feel", but wanted something safe that holds up for my first track day...
In my personal case I regret that investment (it was safe and fine, but should have gone BBK right away):
After 3 beginner track days my initially brand new rear pads were burnt up down to the metal... (VDC off! NOTE: fronts were still fine, only rears wore like crazy)
I think people do have success with full race pads and it probably does not make much of a difference if run on OEM rotors or other rotors.... and you can get away with that on OEM non-brembo brakes for a while..
But I did not want to get into changing pads for every track day... and I don't need full race pads for stopping power as well...
Also I was worried that with full race pads the balance is lost... while the driver brakes with no worries and no fade, the pads take it, .... suddenly the caliper and rubber stuff or anything else connected overheats...
After I switched to BBK, I have had 6 track days with more advanced driving and being a lot faster than my first 3 times...
rear pads are maybe at 75% and front pads still >55% (NOTE: now the fronts are used up faster which makes sense to me... )
And these are street pads (F.2500) so I didn't have to change them and use them daily driving....
To conclude:
I didn't have the problem of brake failure or fade with my stage2 version...
It just wasn't fun driving with a pedal that felt really soft and needed to be pushed in really deep and for a long time...
The main reason for me to get a BBK was pad life, and it looks like it paid off so far.
If BBK is too expensive and you track often... it might be cheaper to switch out rotors every year and use full race pads on the track only.
Met an instructor with a BMW... she said that she can get rotors really cheap... 50$ or so.. she switches to full race pads every track day... and has to renew rotors once a year.
Wow. Good information.
I have to get new rotors right now regardless. Mine are warped and worn down pretty far. I might be able to turn them down though.. I'll check that out.
I think Race pads and fluid would be a good idea then.
I'll go dig through the Pads database
I have to get new rotors right now regardless. Mine are warped and worn down pretty far. I might be able to turn them down though.. I'll check that out.
I think Race pads and fluid would be a good idea then.
I'll go dig through the Pads database
Originally Posted by PBLRacing
Soap Box Moment....
Why must one change anything on their car for a first day at the track? (Other than freshing your rotors, pads and fluids) Most have no idea what their car can do at the track, so why start making changes now? We all (including myself) have a tendancy to throw money at our cars to make them faster and better (ask me about how much I spent on my Trans Am between my 1st and 2nd track event $$$$$$$$$) and all we end up doing is masking our limitations as drivers.
In my humble opinion, other than safety upgrades, unless one can go out and turn 10+ laps in a row within a few tenths of each other then one is not consistent enough as a driver to properly evaluate the impact or need of changes that are being made. When one can be that consistent then changes must be made in measured increments. One at a time. Then one can tell the true impact of each change being made.
Money spent on mods that "have" to be made in order to make the Z better at the track is much better spent on seat time to improve the most important component in the car. The driver.
I believe what one should focus on is not having the fastest car but instead driving your car as fast as it can go.
Off my unsolicited and surely unappreciated soap box.....
Why must one change anything on their car for a first day at the track? (Other than freshing your rotors, pads and fluids) Most have no idea what their car can do at the track, so why start making changes now? We all (including myself) have a tendancy to throw money at our cars to make them faster and better (ask me about how much I spent on my Trans Am between my 1st and 2nd track event $$$$$$$$$) and all we end up doing is masking our limitations as drivers.
In my humble opinion, other than safety upgrades, unless one can go out and turn 10+ laps in a row within a few tenths of each other then one is not consistent enough as a driver to properly evaluate the impact or need of changes that are being made. When one can be that consistent then changes must be made in measured increments. One at a time. Then one can tell the true impact of each change being made.
Money spent on mods that "have" to be made in order to make the Z better at the track is much better spent on seat time to improve the most important component in the car. The driver.
I believe what one should focus on is not having the fastest car but instead driving your car as fast as it can go.
Off my unsolicited and surely unappreciated soap box.....
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 523
Likes: 0
From: CT
That's why you use lap time as a judgement in performance, not equipment.
I know when i push my equipment to the limit, I am usually imporving my lap time. I just don't do it often to save the car
I know when i push my equipment to the limit, I am usually imporving my lap time. I just don't do it often to save the car
Originally Posted by Stack
This bears repeating...
To expound on these thoughts just a bit... just because you run out of brakes or tires at your first or second event, doesn't mean the hardware can't take it. Sure... maybe the Autozone pads aren't up to snuff, or normal DOT3 brake fluid. And yeah, all-season radials will make a lot of noise, and not have a ton of grip, but that doesn't mean you can't learn how to drive on them.
It sure as HELL doesn't mean you've reached your hardware's limits. It means you've over-driven them to the point of submission. It means you're trying too hard to go too fast, which in fact, makes you go slower, and makes you burn through consumables too quickly.
To expound on these thoughts just a bit... just because you run out of brakes or tires at your first or second event, doesn't mean the hardware can't take it. Sure... maybe the Autozone pads aren't up to snuff, or normal DOT3 brake fluid. And yeah, all-season radials will make a lot of noise, and not have a ton of grip, but that doesn't mean you can't learn how to drive on them.
It sure as HELL doesn't mean you've reached your hardware's limits. It means you've over-driven them to the point of submission. It means you're trying too hard to go too fast, which in fact, makes you go slower, and makes you burn through consumables too quickly.
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 523
Likes: 0
From: CT
As a track *****, I can tell you my non brembo <05 Z can go 200-350 miles on both F and R. This is pushing 95% every other lap. I have to cool the car down to avoid any brake issues. Also I lost a brake line due to heat, not fun...
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