Should I get OEM rotors?
05-21-2010, 12:28 PM
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Should I get OEM rotors?
I have an 03 non brembo car. I just got some NISMO pads and want to replace my rotors as well. Whats a good aftermarket blank rotor, or should I just get OEM replacements? Whats a good place to buy OEM stuff from if I go that route?
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05-25-2010, 09:14 AM
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Don't buy stoptech, R1concepts 1 piece rotors. All they do is buy Centric Premium rotors for $20-30, and put useless slots / holes in them, and sell them for 400% markup. Stoptech, and R1concept rotors are just Centric Premium blank rotors.
Go to rockauto, or any other parts place that sells Centric rotors, and buy a Premium, Blank Centric rotor for $30-40 each. The part number for the Premium is 120.xxxxx. Don't buy the stardard centric rotors (Part number is 121.xxxxx)
The people with the stoptech or r1concept slotted / drilled rotors just paid an extra $50 PER ROTOR for some useless slots / drilled holes.
Go to rockauto, or any other parts place that sells Centric rotors, and buy a Premium, Blank Centric rotor for $30-40 each. The part number for the Premium is 120.xxxxx. Don't buy the stardard centric rotors (Part number is 121.xxxxx)
The people with the stoptech or r1concept slotted / drilled rotors just paid an extra $50 PER ROTOR for some useless slots / drilled holes.
Last edited by mezer; 05-25-2010 at 09:17 AM.
05-25-2010, 11:47 AM
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Don't buy stoptech, R1concepts 1 piece rotors. All they do is buy Centric Premium rotors for $20-30, and put useless slots / holes in them, and sell them for 400% markup. Stoptech, and R1concept rotors are just Centric Premium blank rotors.
Go to rockauto, or any other parts place that sells Centric rotors, and buy a Premium, Blank Centric rotor for $30-40 each. The part number for the Premium is 120.xxxxx. Don't buy the stardard centric rotors (Part number is 121.xxxxx)
The people with the stoptech or r1concept slotted / drilled rotors just paid an extra $50 PER ROTOR for some useless slots / drilled holes.
Go to rockauto, or any other parts place that sells Centric rotors, and buy a Premium, Blank Centric rotor for $30-40 each. The part number for the Premium is 120.xxxxx. Don't buy the stardard centric rotors (Part number is 121.xxxxx)
The people with the stoptech or r1concept slotted / drilled rotors just paid an extra $50 PER ROTOR for some useless slots / drilled holes.
do you know nothing of heat dissipation??
I guess my drilled and slotted rotors on my BBK are completely worthless and wilwood had no idea what they were doing when they designed them
05-26-2010, 02:50 AM
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Do some research on slotting and drilling from a reputable brake forum. There is some merit towards the theory of slotting the rotors, but definitly not worth $50 extra per rotor for it.
I bet you $1000 that if you took your slotted / drilled rotors off, and replaced them with an equal quality blank rotor, you will NOT notice any difference in your braking power, or brake fade, and you'll pull the same, if not better lap times.
Last edited by mezer; 05-26-2010 at 06:24 AM.
05-26-2010, 06:31 AM
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Call wilwood, you will find out they only offer them in drilled cause people want them. I believe they do the slots only because the pads do not have any type of cooling slot in them lime most modern pads do.
05-27-2010, 10:16 AM
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And, I CAN tell the difference, as can most drivers that are at least somewhat sensitive under braking.
PM me for an address to send the $1k. Your timing is great as I'm about to order up a new set of drilled rotors for one of the cars in the stable!
Chris
05-27-2010, 11:42 AM
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Read SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) Paper No. 1999-01-0142 for laboratory tests performed by GM engineers that prove rotors modifications (such as drilling, slotting, J-hooks, etc.) work to improve bite. There are other tests that go into better detail, but this paper was published and presented at a professional society conference and peer reviewed -- not some "white paper" posted on a web site.
And, I CAN tell the difference, as can most drivers that are at least somewhat sensitive under braking.
PM me for an address to send the $1k. Your timing is great as I'm about to order up a new set of drilled rotors for one of the cars in the stable!
Chris
And, I CAN tell the difference, as can most drivers that are at least somewhat sensitive under braking.
PM me for an address to send the $1k. Your timing is great as I'm about to order up a new set of drilled rotors for one of the cars in the stable!
Chris
thanks for finding the research I knew I had read it before.
05-27-2010, 01:30 PM
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No worries. I don't mean to slam anyone at all, so I hope it isn't taken that way. We do need to get some of the wives tales on the Internet handled, of which this is one that continually comes up. Another one is "cast-in holes", which doesn't happen even though people will swear it does. I've been in enough foundries and worked with brakes long enough to know that they don't exist in production. Don't get me started! 
05-27-2010, 05:28 PM
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LOL. You guys are funny.
Here Barnabas... right from Wilwood FAQ since you trust them so much (http://www.wilwood.com/TechTip/TechFaqs.aspx)
And this (http://www.rx7club.com/showpost.php?...2&postcount=32)
And Look at NASCAR or F1. You would think that if drilling holes in the rotor was the hot ticket, these teams would be doing it
Here Barnabas... right from Wilwood FAQ since you trust them so much (http://www.wilwood.com/TechTip/TechFaqs.aspx)
Q: What's the difference between slotted and drilled/slotted rotors? Which rotor will be best for my application?
A: PSlots or grooves in rotor faces are partly a carryover from the days of asbestos pads. Asbestos and other organic pads were prone to “glazing” and the slots tended to help “scrape or de-glaze” them. Also, cross-drilling and/or slotting the rotor for racing purposes was beneficial by providing a way to expel the gasses created when the bonding agents employed to manufacture the pads began to break down at extreme temperatures. This condition is often referred to as “outgassing.” When it does occur, the driver still has a good firm brake pedal, but a significant reduction in friction. Normally this only happens at temperatures witnessed in racing. However, with today’s race pad technology, “outgassing” is no longer a concern with pads designed for racing.
So in the final analysis, drilling and slotting rotors has become popular in street applications for their pure aesthetic value.
A: PSlots or grooves in rotor faces are partly a carryover from the days of asbestos pads. Asbestos and other organic pads were prone to “glazing” and the slots tended to help “scrape or de-glaze” them. Also, cross-drilling and/or slotting the rotor for racing purposes was beneficial by providing a way to expel the gasses created when the bonding agents employed to manufacture the pads began to break down at extreme temperatures. This condition is often referred to as “outgassing.” When it does occur, the driver still has a good firm brake pedal, but a significant reduction in friction. Normally this only happens at temperatures witnessed in racing. However, with today’s race pad technology, “outgassing” is no longer a concern with pads designed for racing.
So in the final analysis, drilling and slotting rotors has become popular in street applications for their pure aesthetic value.
From Waren Gilliand: (Warren Gilliland is a well-known brake engineer in the racing industry and has more than 32 years experience in custom designing brake systems ...he became the main source for improving the brake systems on a variety of different race vehicles from midgets to Nascar Winston Cup cars.) "If you cross drill one of these vented rotors, you are creating a stress riser that will encourage the rotor to crack right through the hole. Many of the rotors available in the aftermarket are nothing more than inexpensive offshore manufactured stock replacement rotors, cross drilled to appeal to the performance market. They are not performance rotors and will have a corresponding high failure rate"
Grassroots Motorsports: "Crossdrilling your rotors might look neat, but what is it really doing for you? Well, unless your car is using brake pads from the '40s and 50s, not a whole lot. Rotors were first drilled because early brake pad materials gave off gasses when heated to racing temperatures, a process known as "gassing out." ...It was an effective solution, but today's friction materials do not exhibit the some gassing out phenomenon as the early pads. Contrary to popular belief, they don't lower temperatures. (In fact, by removing weight from the rotor, they can actually cause temperatures to increase a little.)
Last edited by mezer; 05-27-2010 at 05:51 PM.
05-27-2010, 06:35 PM
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Besides, comparing NASCAR rotors at 2000°F (heavy car, small brakes in a 15" wheel, downforce and slicks where the rotors get thrown away after every race) to street rotors (heavy car, potentially larger brakes, no downforce and street tires with expectations the rotors must last at least x0,000 miles) that will rarely see 1200°F even with a very experienced driver is pointless. On the street is where drilling really shines. Once over 1200°F, go to slotted or maybe J-hooks if you can stand the increase in noise.
Chris
06-02-2010, 11:07 AM
#20
Uuuhhh, Chris B. That SAE paper you quoted was a research effort into brake squeal and noise, not pad bite.
An Investigative Overview of Automotive Disc Brake Noise
Document Number: 1999-01-0142
Date Published: March 1999
Author(s):
K. Brent Dunlap - Delphi Chassis Systems
Michael A. Riehle - Delphi Chassis Systems
Abstract:
Disc brake noise continues to be a major concern throughout the automotive industry despite efforts to reduce its occurrence. As a major supplier of automotive brake components, Delphi Chassis is continually investigating means to reduce disc brake noise. In this paper, experimental and analytical methods are discussed which reduce the occurrence of automotive disc brake noise. Three general categories of brake noise are discussed. These categories are low frequency noise, low frequency squeal, and high frequency squeal. A general description of all three categories and examples of relevant solutions are presented.
Document Number: 1999-01-0142
Date Published: March 1999
Author(s):
K. Brent Dunlap - Delphi Chassis Systems
Michael A. Riehle - Delphi Chassis Systems
Abstract:
Disc brake noise continues to be a major concern throughout the automotive industry despite efforts to reduce its occurrence. As a major supplier of automotive brake components, Delphi Chassis is continually investigating means to reduce disc brake noise. In this paper, experimental and analytical methods are discussed which reduce the occurrence of automotive disc brake noise. Three general categories of brake noise are discussed. These categories are low frequency noise, low frequency squeal, and high frequency squeal. A general description of all three categories and examples of relevant solutions are presented.