View Poll Results: Detailing: Machine Buff or Hand Buff?
Machine Buff
24
29.63%
Hand Buff
57
70.37%
Voters: 81. You may not vote on this poll
Detailing: machine or hand buff?
09-26-2002, 07:42 AM
#1
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Detailing: machine or hand buff?
Just wondering what you guys perfer? Hand buffing which takes more time and more elbow grease. Or machine buffing, which cuts time and energy.
09-26-2002, 03:05 PM
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I got a 10" buffer and it works wonders!
Nothing high powered because I don't need that power, just something to get in good and do a good job, not some high powered melt my clearcoat buffer.
Nothing high powered because I don't need that power, just something to get in good and do a good job, not some high powered melt my clearcoat buffer.
09-26-2002, 03:20 PM
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I was thinking of buying an eliptical buffer. It supposed to move in an elipse so it doesnt burn and leave swirls or something, but anyways I am probably going to get one to save myself time and energy. 
09-30-2002, 01:48 PM
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Machine buffers are the devil! I'de rather have a scratch than the affect machin bffers have on car. If you want your paint to look deep/new, hand "buff" it. I never really buff it, I barley apply presure, just enough to get Zaino/wax off of the car. At any point when buffin your car, you are affecting the finish, almost like very light sand pappering. You people with tese new cars should not be machine buffing, you'll see it in the long run and be sorry you did. Take your time and do it right.
09-30-2002, 02:43 PM
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Originally posted by SandMan
I was thinking of buying an eliptical buffer. It supposed to move in an elipse so it doesnt burn and leave swirls or something, but anyways I am probably going to get one to save myself time and energy.
I was thinking of buying an eliptical buffer. It supposed to move in an elipse so it doesnt burn and leave swirls or something, but anyways I am probably going to get one to save myself time and energy.
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09-30-2002, 04:32 PM
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Well, you were wrong the sense that machines are not the making of the devil. They are very helpfull, and in some cased, required to get the job done. Now your WERE right that a rotary buffer, one that spins like a wheel, can be diasterous to a finish in the wrong hands. But, in the right hands, a rotary buffer can work pure magic on neglected finishes.
Technically speaking:a buffer or the act of buffing refers to removing larger amounts of paint though heat (such as using a rotary) So removing a wax with a towel technically isn't buffing, but everyone says it (including me).
Polishing just a less sever form of buffing. Both do remove paint, thats not a bad thing, as to remove swirl marks for instance, you need to level the paint, microscopically grinding away at the edge of the blemish until it becomes so smooth that you can't see it anymore.
In other words, if you plan on using apolish correctly to enhance the shine or removea blemish, it needs heat for the abrasives to work, and a machine creates heat much better than your hand. But htis is a double edge sword. You never want to polish more than you have to.
Technically speaking:a buffer or the act of buffing refers to removing larger amounts of paint though heat (such as using a rotary) So removing a wax with a towel technically isn't buffing, but everyone says it (including me).
Polishing just a less sever form of buffing. Both do remove paint, thats not a bad thing, as to remove swirl marks for instance, you need to level the paint, microscopically grinding away at the edge of the blemish until it becomes so smooth that you can't see it anymore.
In other words, if you plan on using apolish correctly to enhance the shine or removea blemish, it needs heat for the abrasives to work, and a machine creates heat much better than your hand. But htis is a double edge sword. You never want to polish more than you have to.
09-30-2002, 04:37 PM
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Originally posted by Brad4rdHay
Well, you were wrong the sense that machines are not the making of the devil. They are very helpfull, and in some cased, required to get the job done. Now your WERE right that a rotary buffer, one that spins like a wheel, can be diasterous to a finish in the wrong hands. But, in the right hands, a rotary buffer can work pure magic on neglected finishes.
Technically speaking:a buffer or the act of buffing refers to removing larger amounts of paint though heat (such as using a rotary) So removing a wax with a towel technically isn't buffing, but everyone says it (including me).
Polishing just a less sever form of buffing. Both do remove paint, thats not a bad thing, as to remove swirl marks for instance, you need to level the paint, microscopically grinding away at the edge of the blemish until it becomes so smooth that you can't see it anymore.
In other words, if you plan on using apolish correctly to enhance the shine or removea blemish, it needs heat for the abrasives to work, and a machine creates heat much better than your hand. But htis is a double edge sword. You never want to polish more than you have to.
Well, you were wrong the sense that machines are not the making of the devil. They are very helpfull, and in some cased, required to get the job done. Now your WERE right that a rotary buffer, one that spins like a wheel, can be diasterous to a finish in the wrong hands. But, in the right hands, a rotary buffer can work pure magic on neglected finishes.
Technically speaking:a buffer or the act of buffing refers to removing larger amounts of paint though heat (such as using a rotary) So removing a wax with a towel technically isn't buffing, but everyone says it (including me).
Polishing just a less sever form of buffing. Both do remove paint, thats not a bad thing, as to remove swirl marks for instance, you need to level the paint, microscopically grinding away at the edge of the blemish until it becomes so smooth that you can't see it anymore.
In other words, if you plan on using apolish correctly to enhance the shine or removea blemish, it needs heat for the abrasives to work, and a machine creates heat much better than your hand. But htis is a double edge sword. You never want to polish more than you have to.
09-30-2002, 04:57 PM
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Ah, theres your only problem there. An orbital polisher, especially the low powered Waxmaster ones are harmlessto the finish, unless you stupid and use a dirty pad. They spin, and oscilate so they never hit that smae place twice in a row. Unfortunately, theeme machines are nothing more than elbow-grease savers.
A variable powered orbital, such as the Porter Cable I recomend, is stil very safe yet has enough power to work out mild swirls and such.
A rotary is where you want to avoid, unless you have LOTS of experience. These bad boys souldn't be used unless the finish is negleced (like you said) but if you see someone who nows how to use one, its something to behold.
A variable powered orbital, such as the Porter Cable I recomend, is stil very safe yet has enough power to work out mild swirls and such.
A rotary is where you want to avoid, unless you have LOTS of experience. These bad boys souldn't be used unless the finish is negleced (like you said) but if you see someone who nows how to use one, its something to behold.
09-30-2002, 05:24 PM
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When you use orbital polisher what do you recommend to polish with? Right now i am using mothers, is that cool? Or is there something better that you would recommend?
Thanks.
Oh BTW Brad, I archived your detailing info into my harddriver, if you don't mind.
Thanks.
Oh BTW Brad, I archived your detailing info into my harddriver, if you don't mind.
10-02-2002, 11:31 AM
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Archive away. Well, a low powered orbital usually doesnt generate enough heat to use a true machine polish which was designed for high heat rotary buffers. (you can get away with using them on the Porter Cable) So use a qulity hand polish. Id stay away from Meguiars polish as they mostly just sell oil filller polishes. Mothers Pre-Wax cleaner is prety good, 3M Swirls Mark Removeer For Dark Cars is also very good.
10-21-2002, 06:36 PM
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I have an orbital polisher/buffer from Sears (from a previous lifetime).. similar to this one goto www.sears.com and put in 00910626000 into the search.
Now all I've ever had is terry cloth bonnets for it. I'm new to 'professional' car care.. so tell me if I'm wrong here, or how I should use this..
Wash
Dry
Apply Polish w/machine (is terry cloth fine? or should it be foam?)
Buff/Remove Polish w/machine (same material question)
Apply Wax by hand in straight lines
Buff/Remove Wax w/machine (terry cloth)
I did notice using this machine before that the cloth 'beads' up with wax during use during removal.. making what looks like really small peas in the material. Is that asking for sratches?
The inter material for the oribital machine is foam.. but I don't think I've ever seen a foam applicator for it.. only terry bonnets.
Guidance is much appreciated on if this machine is worth anything to me
Now all I've ever had is terry cloth bonnets for it. I'm new to 'professional' car care.. so tell me if I'm wrong here, or how I should use this..
Wash
Dry
Apply Polish w/machine (is terry cloth fine? or should it be foam?)
Buff/Remove Polish w/machine (same material question)
Apply Wax by hand in straight lines
Buff/Remove Wax w/machine (terry cloth)
I did notice using this machine before that the cloth 'beads' up with wax during use during removal.. making what looks like really small peas in the material. Is that asking for sratches?
The inter material for the oribital machine is foam.. but I don't think I've ever seen a foam applicator for it.. only terry bonnets.
Guidance is much appreciated on if this machine is worth anything to me
10-21-2002, 07:13 PM
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Id use foam aplicators for the machine, they sell them at Pep Boys and such. DON"T use the foam backing on the machine. After really working in the polish with the machine (take your time), just wipe it clean witha terry cloth.
Other than that, yes, your correct.
Other than that, yes, your correct.
10-31-2002, 06:17 AM
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Brad4rdHay, I like what you've said so far, but here are a few tips I've learned.
Always use the orbital on a low speed. I use a Porter Cable that goes from 1000 to 6000 RPM, on the dial 1 - 6. I don't go over 3.5 on the dial.
Clearcoat will damage at 220 degrees F. The PC at the above speed only gets to 110F. I use a white pad for applying polish, gray for applying wax/protectant. Hook & loop backing makes it easy to change pads
To remove the products, I use the PC, but put on a dry pad (no matter the type) and use microfiber towels. Put the towel on the paint surface, the PC with the dry pad on top of the towel, and go for it. This way, you can flip and fold the towel as it gets used. I don't use the bonnets because they cake up and will start re-applying the product if not kept clean.
My $.02...
Always use the orbital on a low speed. I use a Porter Cable that goes from 1000 to 6000 RPM, on the dial 1 - 6. I don't go over 3.5 on the dial.
Clearcoat will damage at 220 degrees F. The PC at the above speed only gets to 110F. I use a white pad for applying polish, gray for applying wax/protectant. Hook & loop backing makes it easy to change pads
To remove the products, I use the PC, but put on a dry pad (no matter the type) and use microfiber towels. Put the towel on the paint surface, the PC with the dry pad on top of the towel, and go for it. This way, you can flip and fold the towel as it gets used. I don't use the bonnets because they cake up and will start re-applying the product if not kept clean.
My $.02...
11-26-2002, 07:28 PM
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In my opinion, detailed, fine finishes don't go hand in hand with machine buffing. Plus I don't think that they save that much time once you get good at hand buffing.
11-30-2002, 08:04 AM
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once you get good at machine buffing theres no way you can keep up by hand.
worked at ziebart and w/ our 10" buffers, people would be able to put on and take off a coat of wax in approx 15-20 min
heres a tip : go around w/ wax on a bonnet in your hand and apply wax to all areas you wont bea ble to get with buffer, ie: around windshield washer nozzles, around emblems, and mirrors and such all the tight corners and stuff. work the wax out a few inches away from them. then go back w/ the machine and overlap the waxed areas to keep a consistant shine w/out having to get close to nozzles and such where you'd have to do wax removal by hand (like w/ a toothbrush or somethign).
start on hood. work your way around the car .
switch bonnets do wax removal with buffer take extra care on hood and trunk and other horizontal areas sometimes i'd apply 2 coats to these areas as thier usually subject to harsher conditions (ya it depends on the type of wax if you can layer it)
go back through with another bonnet in your hand and remove everything you missed. take car out side and do visual inspection with bonnet in hand catch all missed areas. and your done
after doing this a few times, it shouldnt take you more than 30 minutes to compeltely apply and remove wax from a sedan sized car (like a camry)
worked at ziebart and w/ our 10" buffers, people would be able to put on and take off a coat of wax in approx 15-20 min
heres a tip : go around w/ wax on a bonnet in your hand and apply wax to all areas you wont bea ble to get with buffer, ie: around windshield washer nozzles, around emblems, and mirrors and such all the tight corners and stuff. work the wax out a few inches away from them. then go back w/ the machine and overlap the waxed areas to keep a consistant shine w/out having to get close to nozzles and such where you'd have to do wax removal by hand (like w/ a toothbrush or somethign).
start on hood. work your way around the car .
switch bonnets do wax removal with buffer take extra care on hood and trunk and other horizontal areas sometimes i'd apply 2 coats to these areas as thier usually subject to harsher conditions (ya it depends on the type of wax if you can layer it)
go back through with another bonnet in your hand and remove everything you missed. take car out side and do visual inspection with bonnet in hand catch all missed areas. and your done
after doing this a few times, it shouldnt take you more than 30 minutes to compeltely apply and remove wax from a sedan sized car (like a camry)
11-30-2002, 04:23 PM
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Most car nuts are not too consirned about time though. It's easy to hand buff, it just takes a little longer. Also, I do not recomend removing wax with a toothbrush.
12-01-2002, 06:02 AM
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you dont know that trick?
if you get wax stuck in creavices or on any ruber / plastic material that is porous. your gonna have a hard time removing wax without something either abrasive or bristle like... like on edges of emblems if you get some wax on them you can use a soft old worn out toothbrush to work the wax off that you cant reach with a towel or bonnet.
if you get wax on a bumper that is like a black plastic and has a texture... your going to need a brush of some sort to work the wax out of the pores of the plastic
i'm not talkin about buffin a hood off with a toothbrush
if you get wax stuck in creavices or on any ruber / plastic material that is porous. your gonna have a hard time removing wax without something either abrasive or bristle like... like on edges of emblems if you get some wax on them you can use a soft old worn out toothbrush to work the wax off that you cant reach with a towel or bonnet.
if you get wax on a bumper that is like a black plastic and has a texture... your going to need a brush of some sort to work the wax out of the pores of the plastic
i'm not talkin about buffin a hood off with a toothbrush