VQ Oil Analysis and Info
#541
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2005 350Z UOA on Mobil 1 0w-40
Will,
Here it the other 350Z, 2005 Non RevUp MT with background history as follows:
Oil: Mobil 1 0w-40
Oil filter: Mobil 1 M110
This is the first oil change interval (OCI) using M1 0w-40. Ran Castrol GTX 5w-30 from day 1 until 33k mile, then two oil change intervals with RP 10w-30.
The BlackStone UOA for the second OCI with RP can be found here: https://my350z.com/forum/showpost.ph...&postcount=333
Miles on oil change interval: 5121 mi
Mileage on engine: 48,548 mi
Oil added on this interval: Zero
Oil consumption: 7mm (1/4 quart)
Fuel: Shell V Power 91 octane
Fuel additives: None
Air Filter: Oil Type K&N style
Note: The air filter after this oil change was switched over to Amsoil’ PAPER type EaAu air filter replacing the Nismo CAI cotton oiled type of air filter.
Mods
Nismo Catback exhaust
Nismo CAI
Plenum Spacer (upper) 5/16”
Driving habits: Daily driver, 80% freeway: 20% street. Northern California temps averaging between 35-100 degrees. Not much dust in this area of Calif. No track, nor AutoX.
Thanks in advance
Curtis
Here it the other 350Z, 2005 Non RevUp MT with background history as follows:
Oil: Mobil 1 0w-40
Oil filter: Mobil 1 M110
This is the first oil change interval (OCI) using M1 0w-40. Ran Castrol GTX 5w-30 from day 1 until 33k mile, then two oil change intervals with RP 10w-30.
The BlackStone UOA for the second OCI with RP can be found here: https://my350z.com/forum/showpost.ph...&postcount=333
Miles on oil change interval: 5121 mi
Mileage on engine: 48,548 mi
Oil added on this interval: Zero
Oil consumption: 7mm (1/4 quart)
Fuel: Shell V Power 91 octane
Fuel additives: None
Air Filter: Oil Type K&N style
Note: The air filter after this oil change was switched over to Amsoil’ PAPER type EaAu air filter replacing the Nismo CAI cotton oiled type of air filter.
Mods
Nismo Catback exhaust
Nismo CAI
Plenum Spacer (upper) 5/16”
Driving habits: Daily driver, 80% freeway: 20% street. Northern California temps averaging between 35-100 degrees. Not much dust in this area of Calif. No track, nor AutoX.
Thanks in advance
Curtis
#543
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Originally Posted by QuadCam
The Zddp additive package in Rotella is great for solid lifter engines. MOst engine builders of domestic engines usign a flat tappet cam/lifter recommend oils with ZDDP. there is alot more friction on a flat tappet/ bucket compared to a roller lifter / cam follower...that's where the zddp additive really helps.
#544
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Originally Posted by SteveZ
Thanks for the info, that's really good to know - much appreciated.
http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/e...ech/index.html
for those that don't know pushrod V8s.......a flat tappet cam/lifter combo is very similar is design to our "cam over bucket" setups. in the article, it says
"the OEMs got together with the motor oil makers and decided to reduce the amount ofZDDP in street-legal, gasoline-engine motor oils. After all, they weren't needed with modern roller lifters and overhead-cam followers."
the article isn't talking about our style engines. Ford uses "cam followers" in their OHC and DOHC engines. their design uses a roller rocker arm, of sorts, after the cam to open the valve. The Ford design allows for much more aggressive cam lobes and ramps, while utilizing a roller to reduce friction.
#545
Originally Posted by QuadCam
"the OEMs got together with the motor oil makers and decided to reduce the amount ofZDDP in street-legal, gasoline-engine motor oils."
Will
#546
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High ZDDP
Funny thing is there is another paper in BITOG posted by a fan/possible finanaicial contributer to Bio Ester that indicates ZDDP essentially turns to soap when confronted with high fuel. However, I think we will find this out quick as I have it my Speed6 with its direct injection via the Rotella.
Nice read, thank you!
Nice read, thank you!
#547
Originally Posted by ZeeForce
Will,
Here is the 2nd UOA on the freshly built 06 RevUp. Your commentaries on the first one were very much appreciated.
Data from both UOA’s are combined on this data sheet. Both were using Castrol GTX 5w-30.
Some background data:
2006 MT RevUp VQ35 replaced with freshly built engine.
Total miles on new engine: 7603 mi
Oil change interval: 3223
Oil: Castrol GTX 5w-30
Oil Filter: Nissan OEM
Air Filter: Cotton oil based K&N style. The air filter was replaced at 1259 miles into this OCI with Amsoil’s PAPER EaA type filter. The intake system is a Nismo CAI.
Fuel: Shell V-Power 91 octane
Oil added: Zero
Oil consumption: 4-5 mm (1/8 - < 1/4)
Mods:
Nismo catback exhaust
Nismo CAI
Driving habits: Daily driving, no track or autoX., 40/ 60 freeway/street, no revs over 4000 rpm.
Location geography: Northern California average temperatures 35-100 degrees. Dry, not very dusty.
Thanks in advance
Curtis
Attachment 197395
Here is the 2nd UOA on the freshly built 06 RevUp. Your commentaries on the first one were very much appreciated.
Data from both UOA’s are combined on this data sheet. Both were using Castrol GTX 5w-30.
Some background data:
2006 MT RevUp VQ35 replaced with freshly built engine.
Total miles on new engine: 7603 mi
Oil change interval: 3223
Oil: Castrol GTX 5w-30
Oil Filter: Nissan OEM
Air Filter: Cotton oil based K&N style. The air filter was replaced at 1259 miles into this OCI with Amsoil’s PAPER EaA type filter. The intake system is a Nismo CAI.
Fuel: Shell V-Power 91 octane
Oil added: Zero
Oil consumption: 4-5 mm (1/8 - < 1/4)
Mods:
Nismo catback exhaust
Nismo CAI
Driving habits: Daily driving, no track or autoX., 40/ 60 freeway/street, no revs over 4000 rpm.
Location geography: Northern California average temperatures 35-100 degrees. Dry, not very dusty.
Thanks in advance
Curtis
Attachment 197395
I know it's frustrating to have this new V2 with a fuel dilution problem, but oil consumption is low and there is almost no moisture in the engine. I would say it's just taking longer than the original VQ35 (non rev-ups) to break in.
I'm also using PP 5W-30 right now. So, between yours and mine, we could have an interesting comparison between the two UOA's. How much we could gain from it is debatable, but it could be interesting nonetheless. Plus, it would be good to finally get some PP 5W-30 UOA's in the comparison chart with their new formula.
Will
#548
Originally Posted by ZeeForce
Will,
Here it the other 350Z, 2005 Non RevUp MT with background history as follows:
Oil: Mobil 1 0w-40
Oil filter: Mobil 1 M110
This is the first oil change interval (OCI) using M1 0w-40. Ran Castrol GTX 5w-30 from day 1 until 33k mile, then two oil change intervals with RP 10w-30.
Miles on oil change interval: 5121 mi
Mileage on engine: 48,548 mi
Oil added on this interval: Zero
Oil consumption: 7mm (1/4 quart)
Fuel: Shell V Power 91 octane
Fuel additives: None
Air Filter: Oil Type K&N style
Note: The air filter after this oil change was switched over to Amsoil’ PAPER type EaAu air filter replacing the Nismo CAI cotton oiled type of air filter.
Mods
Nismo Catback exhaust
Nismo CAI
Plenum Spacer (upper) 5/16”
Driving habits: Daily driver, 80% freeway: 20% street. Northern California temps averaging between 35-100 degrees. Not much dust in this area of Calif. No track, nor AutoX.
Thanks in advance
Curtis
Attachment 197396
Here it the other 350Z, 2005 Non RevUp MT with background history as follows:
Oil: Mobil 1 0w-40
Oil filter: Mobil 1 M110
This is the first oil change interval (OCI) using M1 0w-40. Ran Castrol GTX 5w-30 from day 1 until 33k mile, then two oil change intervals with RP 10w-30.
Miles on oil change interval: 5121 mi
Mileage on engine: 48,548 mi
Oil added on this interval: Zero
Oil consumption: 7mm (1/4 quart)
Fuel: Shell V Power 91 octane
Fuel additives: None
Air Filter: Oil Type K&N style
Note: The air filter after this oil change was switched over to Amsoil’ PAPER type EaAu air filter replacing the Nismo CAI cotton oiled type of air filter.
Mods
Nismo Catback exhaust
Nismo CAI
Plenum Spacer (upper) 5/16”
Driving habits: Daily driver, 80% freeway: 20% street. Northern California temps averaging between 35-100 degrees. Not much dust in this area of Calif. No track, nor AutoX.
Thanks in advance
Curtis
Attachment 197396
Wear is pretty good. Chromium is a bit high, as I said on the first page, I don't like anything higher than 1ppm for Chromium. But 2ppm isn't anything to really worry about. Iron is always high with M1 blends. Copper could also be a bit better for the mileage, but all in all, it's wear looks good. Boron is listed under contaminates in terry's report, but the boron isn't a contaminant in this case. M1 uses a borate ester in this blend, and the level is normal. Compare the sodium from this engine to your new V2- what a difference. The M1 sheared down to a 30 weight. This is also normal. It was already a very thin 40 weight, and the VQ is hard on oils. Fuel was alright, and nitrates were in check, so the shearing is from mechanical shearing, not fuel dilution like the V2. Oxidation is high, which backs up the mechanical shearing of the oil and some thermal break-down. There are those who speculate the M1 0W-40 is designed to shear down and become shear-stable as a thick 30 weight. Maybe, who knows but XOM. The TAN was pretty high, but there is enough base to justify a longer oil change interval. The M1 0W-40 is pretty robust in this regard, with a high TBN. I'd say that since you are not tracking the car, a heavier oil weight isn't doing anything for you, and would use a good 30 weight oil. I'm not sure what you've already switched to, but if you wanted to go for longer drains Amsoil might be worth your attention.
Will
#549
On another note, I was in Illinois last month and had a chance to discuss filtering efficiencies with some engineers for Donaldson. It was an educational experience in filtering beyond analyzing flow and Beta ratios, and I have to say, they gave a good argument for their synthetic filtering media. Donaldson currently makes Amsoil's EaO filters, and is well known in industrial applications. They have a few air filters for performance cars, such as the Corvettte, and might have some more air filter applications coming to market. I would highly recommend them for trying out if they do make a 350Z application, and would also say that their oil filters are worth the money for anyone doing extended drains. In fact, their oil filters are the only ones I think capable of offering good flow with a filtering efficiency down to an amazing 5 microns. That's enough to effect UOA results.
Will
Will
#550
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Will,
Thanks for the commentary on the 2006 freshly built Rev-Up. Hopefully with the changes that were made during the OCI or at oil change will improve the numbers.
Changed the Air filter from the K&N oil based cotton air filter to Amsoil PAPER. btw: the Amsoil part # is EaAU3050, which is an exact dimension fit for NISMO CAI filter, which uses a K&N style filter.
You metioned above that Doanldson/Amsoil has a few performance air filters. Are these newer than the EaAUxxxx series?
Also changed to Amsoil oil filter part # EAO12
Changed oil to PP 5w-30
I also hope we can have a good comparison between you PP and mine. It is frustrating, although I was almost sure this engine would take longer to seat and seal completely, say up to 15-18k mi.
For the 2005 Non Rev commentary. I am very happy and will consider Amsoil oil on the next OCI. Currently running Mobil1 0w-40 and changed the oil filter to Amsoil. Also changed out the NISMO CAI air filter to paper Amsoil. This one is running with a upper plenum spacer 5/16".
Did you see any traces in the data that could be a tarnished like schlack build up on the rings?
Overall the 2005 Non Rev-Up looks good.
Thanks again Will
Cheers
Curtis
Thanks for the commentary on the 2006 freshly built Rev-Up. Hopefully with the changes that were made during the OCI or at oil change will improve the numbers.
Changed the Air filter from the K&N oil based cotton air filter to Amsoil PAPER. btw: the Amsoil part # is EaAU3050, which is an exact dimension fit for NISMO CAI filter, which uses a K&N style filter.
You metioned above that Doanldson/Amsoil has a few performance air filters. Are these newer than the EaAUxxxx series?
Also changed to Amsoil oil filter part # EAO12
Changed oil to PP 5w-30
I also hope we can have a good comparison between you PP and mine. It is frustrating, although I was almost sure this engine would take longer to seat and seal completely, say up to 15-18k mi.
For the 2005 Non Rev commentary. I am very happy and will consider Amsoil oil on the next OCI. Currently running Mobil1 0w-40 and changed the oil filter to Amsoil. Also changed out the NISMO CAI air filter to paper Amsoil. This one is running with a upper plenum spacer 5/16".
Did you see any traces in the data that could be a tarnished like schlack build up on the rings?
Overall the 2005 Non Rev-Up looks good.
Thanks again Will
Cheers
Curtis
#551
I am not sure how what I saw compares with what air filters Amsoil currently sells. I was in Illinois at the Caterpillar facility for a SAE event, where I met these guys from Donaldson talking about their industrial filters for CAT diesels. I just brought up their oil filters being sold by Amsoil, and if Donaldson had any intention to market them directly, and it turned out they had all kinds of stuff with them about their synthetic air filters. There wasn't a display or marketing guys or any official info about the future of this line, just some good data to be seen and the one example they had. the filtering media was high quality with EXCELLENT fiber consistency, and looked promising. The Corvette filter that they sell is marketed by Donaldson, and not through Amsoil, so it could be different. They were hesitant to discuss what Donaldson contracts to Amsoil, I would guess because of confidentiality agreements or the fact that they really weren't sure which products were contracted with Amsoil.
Will
Will
Last edited by Resolute; 07-09-2008 at 09:34 PM.
#553
I put a question in the Q&A on the first page about additive products. Generally, I don't like them, but I have seen some good results with a few products. I would be very cautious about using too much of this stuff. For example, Volvoline SynPower Oil Treatment has a lot of ZDDP in it, along with moly and antimonyTDC. Using one oz of the stuff per quart of oil is a lot less than what the instructions on the bottle advise, but produces good results that way. Whatever the dose of this stuff is that you have, I would not use very much of it to supplement the loss of ZDDP in newer oil formations. There is more chemistry involved than just simply adding additives. There has to be a balance to prohibit corrosive reactions, and overwhelming the stock properties of the oil with too much ZDDP is a possibility. Hence, why the VSOT works best with a limited addition of the product rather than dumping the whole bottle in the crankcase. I suspect the same would hold true with this ZDDP product.
Will
Will
#555
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Originally Posted by Resolute
...As the SAE paper illustrates, ZDDP is effective and cheap to meet OEM demands for proper engine protection, but eventually even diesel/heavy duty engine oils will see the elimination of it as an additive.
Will
Will
Thanks
#556
I have seen a few dealers push "cleaning" products on their customers. It's not required in the owner's manual, and it's not required for warranty. I had a dealership try and tell my wife that we had to pay for their additive to keep the warranty, of course they could not show where this was stated in the factory service manual, and we kept our warranty active despite not paying the dealer's premium. There are several brands out there that I have seen dealers try and push, all of them similar to the over-the-counter products people use, and I have never paid for any of them. Use a good oil, change it out when need be, use the right octane gasoline, and keep the filters clean- then no special additives should be needed.
Will
Will
#558
Originally Posted by Nexx
anyone who has done a UOA on Eneos notice any burn off?
Will