I don't get your thinking. Removing your oem cats and replacing them with HFC, is illegal. Throwing a TT kit on, also kind of makes the car non street legal. If your car is properly tuned, which it should be, if you are spending the money on the kit, you don't have to worry about an overly rich AFR. Why cheap out on another few hundred bucks and not have it tuned? If you run an excessvily rich AFR, the fuel will eat away at the subtrate in the cats, shortening their life. Also, the turbos will muffle the exhaust note plenty. Running test pipes on a TT setup is not like running test pipes on a N/A setup. the gas smell form TP is minimal with a proper tune

I don't know where you get most your info from, but it seems a bit more research couldn't hurt

 

Ziv, first, the TT kit does NOT make the car illegal. What would make you think I'm not trying to be cheap? I have bought the absolute best of everything for my car and I WILL have the it tuned... I just think it is prudent to run a car very rich because I live in an area that had massive temp swings from season to season. I never want to see anything higher than 10.5-11 unless I am at idle. Unless you have cats, that rich a tune is going to smell.

Dude, how come everytime I say something you think it is necessary to insult me?

 

He's probably just getting frustrated with why you want to run cats on a turbo car. Run your cats then try test pipes you'll see. Also I have and EGT guage and my EGT's will get as high as 1400-1600 Degrees so make sure they can withstand that type of heat. The gas smell is overrated but it is there and with the right wind you can smell it. Also people next to you or behind you can smell it. Check into Evo's or something that comes with Turbo from the factory to see what kind of cat they use. The heat from those lil engines with that big turbo might be around the same. And the gains are significant from switching.

 

By placeing a HF metal cat further back (say) in the pre-resonator region, the gas smell could be pretty much eliminated (after an extended warm up period) and I expect no appreciable spool issues would be noticed with the restriction that far downstream. For sub 500rwhp cars this could be an option.

The occasional wif of gas fumes is nasty to say the least.

 

What I am refering to as illegal is the CARB cert. That may not apply to your state, but most judge legal vs illegal by that standard. Last I knew, it is illegal to remove a working cat with an auto that has less than 50K miles on it(which I assume you are under).

*If* I am getting frustrated, it's because, regardless of what is said in this thread, he will run them anyways. I could tell him they explode and it wouldn't matter. So who really cares. Like I said before, run the car and let us know how it feels.

IMO, a 10.5-11 is a bit conservative. You could tune to a low 11's AFR and still have plenty of margin for temp swings.

 

I hate to tell you guys that but some of us care about the environment...having a cat reduces emssions a lot and you can still pass a sniffer test....yes from a law perspective it's not legal BUT from an environment perpestive it is...
Also APS eventually will get the CARB sticker so will JWT so it makes only sense to have a cat to keep that valid.
In addition I compete as part of the True Street Class at IDRC and they require you to have a CAT

 

I just don't understand this comment. I didn't insult anyone

 

Thinking catylitic converters are helping the environment is a bit of wishful thinking IMO. The merely convert one pollutant into another.

Thinking APS or JWT will get CARB cert is also a bit of wishful thinking. I am not saying it isn't possible, just that it will surprise me if it happens any time soon (within the next couple yrs). When they do get the CARB cert, the kits will be sacrficing a lot of performance to do so. In regards to the APS cert, it won't help those that already bought the kit, as the kit currently sold, is not the one submitted for CARB cert testing. To what extent the kit was changed/modified will be known in time.

 

Just curious, how often do you have emissions testing? We have it here every year with a sniffer, and I think going through this process on a yearly basis would get old pretty quick. Does anyone who has yearly emissions go through this?

 

I can swap my test pipes out in about a half hour, not that I need to as we don't have emissions testing here

 

with HFC u seem to have a shat load more trq and hp before spooling (a shat load)

 

What?

 

no you don't . with the impeller in path any cat backpressure helps you nil.
With the TPs you'r up in TQ wise everywhere and much leess sag towards redline. , you just need to accept the smell , slight noise increase and stretched "legality".

 

Cats need not apply

 

huh?

 

this has truly turned into one of the oddest threads ever...

 

I was agreeing with you - He should suck it up and get the test pipes.

Cats need not apply