8000rpm VQ35 Engine Built - Photos
8000rpm VQ35 Engine Built - Photos
Got around to uploading some images which I took throughout the engine build process, link at the bottom. Currently the turbos are not installed yet this build has been done with FI in mind.
Thanks:
A big thanks goes to Peter from Sports Car International for his hard work and for allowing me help out through out the process. Thanks allot mate.
I would highly recommend Peter for any automotive work, especially Zed related.
Also thanks for Sharif @ Forged Performance, Richie (Z350Lover) for beating me to 8000rpm and learning a few things in the process and Performance Motorsport for their insight also.
Goals:
The goals were to build a strong VQ35 for FI and it had to make power towards an 8000rpm rev limit.
The idea being with this increased rpm band I should be able to tune in a more tractable power curve when FI is brought into the picture.
I was also hoping to have a rev happy motor until I got to the FI stage while Im saving.
Parts Involved:
VQ35 Complete Engine - Low KM
Custom Spec Arias Extreme Duty Pistons (High Silicon 10:1)
Eagle Rods + ARP2000 Rod Bolts
L19 ARP Head Studs
Cosworth / Cometic Head Gaskets
Head Strengthening Modification
Rear Cylinder Coolant Modification
Ferra Valve Train (Guides, Locks, Double valve Springs, Valves, Ti Retainers, Stem Seals, Spring Seat Locator Good for 11,500rpm)
Tomei 268 Cams
ZUTEC
Tuner Pro
Bosch 02 Sensor
Map Sensor
Knock Sensor
Map Switch
Megan Headers
UR cats
Hi Tech Exhaust - Initially, since changed to APS TD
K&N Panel Filter
TXS Large MAF Housing
Motordyne Plenum Spacer
RevUp Lower Intake Manifold
Steps Involved:
Strip Down Engine Completely
Clean Every Part
Dynamically Balance Rotating Assembly
Cryo Treat Crank
Clean Rotating Assembly
Hone Cylinders and Clean Block
Measure and Check Clearances
Assemble Bottom End, Oiling Every Bearing and Torquing Everything to Spec with Molly Lube
Heads Assembled with Valve Train
Install and Shim Cams
Bolt Heads on with Head Gaskets
Install Oil Pump, Sump, Sump Cover, VTC Pulleys, Timing Chains (check tension), Tensioners, Front Covers, Rocker Covers, Intake Runners, Intake Manifold, Water Pump, Injectors, Fuel Rails, Piping, Ignition, Headers, VTC Solenoids, Pullies, Knock Sensor, Power Steering, Alternator, etc, etc
Take out existing 49000km VQ35 out the top of engine bay, leaving front bar on
Drop in Forged VQ35
Hook Up Everything and Attach the Gearbox
Fire it Up, Make Sure Everything is Running Correctly
Get Idle Bumped Up
Run the Engine in on a Safe Map
Engine Attempts to Swallow Factory Air Box
Dyno Tune the Car to 8000rpm
Goals Met? / Power:
She pulls all the way towards 8000rpm - Goal Achieved.
She is built strong - So far goal Achieved, Just need two turbos to test out further.
I'm happy with the motor at the moment but its not a setup that you would create just for NA, nor was it designed to be solely for NA. Some of the choices ive made to move power up and increase flow have cost in areas, some not as bad as one would think and others more than one would think. Power wise its only making about 10rkw more than before, but the power curve is changed and peak power is moved up the rpm band.
I have requested a dyno chart over rpm from the dyno operators, still waiting. It will only help see the shape of the curve not actual figures.
Sound:
Idle sounds fantastic with either Hi-Tech or APS exhausts.
Both sound completely different under load, one sounds more Hi-Tech like a motorbike and the other more like a FI car with big exhaust, similar to a Porsche at lower rpm. High rpm the engine made more noise than the Hi-Tech, with the APS it is definately louder than the motor. Im getting an exhaust leak fixed tomorrow so the jury is still out on the overall sound of the APS.
Click here for the photos!!
Last edited by mchapman; Aug 8, 2006 at 05:31 PM.
Thanks guys.
I just got an email back from the dyno, they didnt setup the dyno for rpm while we were running my car. I have a kph dyno chart somewhere in my garage, I will find it and scan it in after work. Power is only a little bit increased at peak with losses below that, but it should help show it pulling towards redline. This motor is setup for turbos which it is currently missing, so power figures are not going to tell you much. If I was building a complete NA motor I would have done a number of things differently.
I just got an email back from the dyno, they didnt setup the dyno for rpm while we were running my car. I have a kph dyno chart somewhere in my garage, I will find it and scan it in after work. Power is only a little bit increased at peak with losses below that, but it should help show it pulling towards redline. This motor is setup for turbos which it is currently missing, so power figures are not going to tell you much. If I was building a complete NA motor I would have done a number of things differently.
Last edited by mchapman; Aug 8, 2006 at 03:56 PM.
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Very cool. Thanks for sharing the progress report. If you can make your NA engine build power to 80000rpm, this thing will be an absolute screamer once FI is thrown into the mix. 
I reckon your Dyno operator is using a dyno dynamics dyno. If so, can he change the setup parameters to measure whp?
I reckon your Dyno operator is using a dyno dynamics dyno. If so, can he change the setup parameters to measure whp?
Compression was only reduced a small amount so as to keep the boost threshold as low as possible giving me more rpms to tune in a tractable power curve. This combined with an 8000rpm limit should give more room to play. My power goals are only around 500rwhp, which can be achieved on 10:1 compression.
APS TT is the kit I will be using.
Initially I will only run 7psi or wastegate setting and increase it 70hp at a time when I get bored of each power level. ie Stage 1 370hp, Stage 2 440hp, Stage 3 500hp. Just so im getting the most time possible enjoying new power. I see this as more return for my money.
APS TT is the kit I will be using.
Initially I will only run 7psi or wastegate setting and increase it 70hp at a time when I get bored of each power level. ie Stage 1 370hp, Stage 2 440hp, Stage 3 500hp. Just so im getting the most time possible enjoying new power. I see this as more return for my money.
Originally Posted by tig488
very nice, BUT, and this is a small but, why do all that, with FI plans, and not at least use darton midsleeves?
edit: posted without seeing your power goals, but still.
edit: posted without seeing your power goals, but still.
Originally Posted by mchapman
Thanks, but yeah as you stated power goals arent high enough, I also need to draw a line somewhere and I knew some were having issues and I didnt want to increase the chance of something going wrong in that area.
Please post a dyno graph when you get one
...-waiting anxiously
I'm somehwat of a lurker in the FI forum but I have more background in boosted cars then most people on here. You guys should really check out supraforums or Honda-tech I guarntee these forums will enlighten you on how to make power at higher rpms. Alright enough with my blabble..
I've had my Z thinking about if I want to make it another project car or not..I would only do it if I was going for 800whp++ and this is what I would do based on the current 03-06 motor, who knows what the new gen 07 will be like.
Block
-sleeve or or don't sleeve it, either way. I've pushed 2ltr Honda sleeves to 700whp without any problems as long as it is built right. If your going to sleeve it bore it out to 100mm or so, go big. Larger bore, small quench area in combustion chamber of the head makes for a better burn and less detonation on the weak part of the pistons (outside near the valve reliefs). This will focus the burn primarily on the center of the piston and allow more aggressive tuning with the maps. Throw some cheap eagle rodsas I don't see the H-beam design failing at the goal of lessn then 150whp per cylinder, ARP bolts anywhere possible would be nice too. Pistons (anything aftermarket as per your prefence, I like CP and JE) 9:1 or even 8.5:1, again by you lowering the compression you are sacrificing very little response and power compared to how much more boost the lower pistons will take and timing you can run to achieve REAL HP. I'm willing to bet a 9:1 compared to a 10:1 motor running NA will have a very slight advantage but will be able to hold more boost relevant to its compression ratio, it far outweights the benefits when boosting. Some kind of extended oil pans that they make which seem nice. ACL replacement bearings since there cheaper then OEM ones most of the time. I would even consider plugging the oil squitters if it was a race car (crank will have less windage and high oil psi even though it doesn't need it) but for the time being leave them since everyone here is a street racer anyhow.
Head
-All ferrea or REV parts, the usual tit retainers and ss valves, dual springs, stock guides are fine. Throw in some kind of cams with heavy duration and lift 272 maybe with 11-12mm of lift, were going big and the savengening effect works good on big boosted higher rpm motors. Head design I would leave to the pros but ask them not to open up the quench area so I can run loads more timing with the 100mm pistons since they are quite a bit less likely to detonate. I dont' have a clue about the little heads mods that are specific to the vq35 as I haven't worked one yet but most people seem to think they get something from porting something out in there, coolant passage?
Intake
-Throw out the dam restrictive flow box with call a lower and upper intake manifold. Build a large simple plenum with large equal length runners that connect directly to the head-someone already makes one but I forget who. Yes it moves the RPM band up but will optimize things in the big picture. On the valve cover I would run 2 separate catch cans with fittings welded on to the valve cover for large breathers. Maybe a drain back into the block somehow by opening up one of the ports on the short block that connect to an oil gallery. I swear on Honda motors this would relieve so much windage pressure from the crank spinning at high rpms and would allow for a much more reliable motor with out burning oil or pushing oil out of the valve cover breathers.
Exhaust
-Can anyone tell me why no company make just a plain old turbo manifold such as the greddy one for sale? Like maybe a simple tubular one with a short nice burns style collector? Ideally I would like a long tube equal length with a 3-1 for each bank of cylinders but since no once has done that yet I would settle for a simple greddy style mani. I would run dual gt35r turbos or maybe 2 gt30r's depending on the 25-35psi goal. Either way I don't see a problem with hitting the 800whp goal with those twin turbo's. Run a 3-4in dp as quickly as possible once pass the firewall. Run open dump pipe right there on both turbo's, it won't be that loud since it is turbo or do this with a exhaust valve and continue back with a normal dual exhaust, I'm a little more radical you could say. I like as little exhaust as possible for best spool and output.
Intercooler
-I have looked and looked at big HP setups and have not concluded the best way yet but I do like the idea of APS twin intercooler where the charge pipes are short and direct to the IC and then to the manifold. I would like a 30x12x5in core size though for the kind of boost and temp drops. Maybe even one of the cheap ebay specials for $200 with custom endtanks since were expermenting. Engine bay is a restriction without a doubt or cut the radiator support and use a direct port from the cold side of the IC to the intake manifold with a large 100mm throttle body running a GM 5 bar map sensor instead of out drive by wire system.
Fuel
-seems to be easy enough, someone just did a nice kit with a separate fuel reservior tank with a inline pump and an intank pump. Or my favorite would be dual intank walbro's with a separate return line. Some 1000cc's or 1600cc's should idle fine with decent ECU. AEM where you at? UTEC=I'm nto familar enough with it to talk of it's capability's.
Ok so there you have it my opinion of on the subject of how to make big HP with high rpm band, I just hope I didn't come off like someone that thinks they know it all because I don't. But I do have experience with 700-1000whp Honda's and have been in the game since a cold air intake was the best mod on a B18c GSR motor. I just wanted to share my outlook of making HP that comes from different cars I have worked on and relating it to the VQ35 motor.
I've had my Z thinking about if I want to make it another project car or not..I would only do it if I was going for 800whp++ and this is what I would do based on the current 03-06 motor, who knows what the new gen 07 will be like.
Block
-sleeve or or don't sleeve it, either way. I've pushed 2ltr Honda sleeves to 700whp without any problems as long as it is built right. If your going to sleeve it bore it out to 100mm or so, go big. Larger bore, small quench area in combustion chamber of the head makes for a better burn and less detonation on the weak part of the pistons (outside near the valve reliefs). This will focus the burn primarily on the center of the piston and allow more aggressive tuning with the maps. Throw some cheap eagle rodsas I don't see the H-beam design failing at the goal of lessn then 150whp per cylinder, ARP bolts anywhere possible would be nice too. Pistons (anything aftermarket as per your prefence, I like CP and JE) 9:1 or even 8.5:1, again by you lowering the compression you are sacrificing very little response and power compared to how much more boost the lower pistons will take and timing you can run to achieve REAL HP. I'm willing to bet a 9:1 compared to a 10:1 motor running NA will have a very slight advantage but will be able to hold more boost relevant to its compression ratio, it far outweights the benefits when boosting. Some kind of extended oil pans that they make which seem nice. ACL replacement bearings since there cheaper then OEM ones most of the time. I would even consider plugging the oil squitters if it was a race car (crank will have less windage and high oil psi even though it doesn't need it) but for the time being leave them since everyone here is a street racer anyhow.
Head
-All ferrea or REV parts, the usual tit retainers and ss valves, dual springs, stock guides are fine. Throw in some kind of cams with heavy duration and lift 272 maybe with 11-12mm of lift, were going big and the savengening effect works good on big boosted higher rpm motors. Head design I would leave to the pros but ask them not to open up the quench area so I can run loads more timing with the 100mm pistons since they are quite a bit less likely to detonate. I dont' have a clue about the little heads mods that are specific to the vq35 as I haven't worked one yet but most people seem to think they get something from porting something out in there, coolant passage?
Intake
-Throw out the dam restrictive flow box with call a lower and upper intake manifold. Build a large simple plenum with large equal length runners that connect directly to the head-someone already makes one but I forget who. Yes it moves the RPM band up but will optimize things in the big picture. On the valve cover I would run 2 separate catch cans with fittings welded on to the valve cover for large breathers. Maybe a drain back into the block somehow by opening up one of the ports on the short block that connect to an oil gallery. I swear on Honda motors this would relieve so much windage pressure from the crank spinning at high rpms and would allow for a much more reliable motor with out burning oil or pushing oil out of the valve cover breathers.
Exhaust
-Can anyone tell me why no company make just a plain old turbo manifold such as the greddy one for sale? Like maybe a simple tubular one with a short nice burns style collector? Ideally I would like a long tube equal length with a 3-1 for each bank of cylinders but since no once has done that yet I would settle for a simple greddy style mani. I would run dual gt35r turbos or maybe 2 gt30r's depending on the 25-35psi goal. Either way I don't see a problem with hitting the 800whp goal with those twin turbo's. Run a 3-4in dp as quickly as possible once pass the firewall. Run open dump pipe right there on both turbo's, it won't be that loud since it is turbo or do this with a exhaust valve and continue back with a normal dual exhaust, I'm a little more radical you could say. I like as little exhaust as possible for best spool and output.
Intercooler
-I have looked and looked at big HP setups and have not concluded the best way yet but I do like the idea of APS twin intercooler where the charge pipes are short and direct to the IC and then to the manifold. I would like a 30x12x5in core size though for the kind of boost and temp drops. Maybe even one of the cheap ebay specials for $200 with custom endtanks since were expermenting. Engine bay is a restriction without a doubt or cut the radiator support and use a direct port from the cold side of the IC to the intake manifold with a large 100mm throttle body running a GM 5 bar map sensor instead of out drive by wire system.
Fuel
-seems to be easy enough, someone just did a nice kit with a separate fuel reservior tank with a inline pump and an intank pump. Or my favorite would be dual intank walbro's with a separate return line. Some 1000cc's or 1600cc's should idle fine with decent ECU. AEM where you at? UTEC=I'm nto familar enough with it to talk of it's capability's.
Ok so there you have it my opinion of on the subject of how to make big HP with high rpm band, I just hope I didn't come off like someone that thinks they know it all because I don't. But I do have experience with 700-1000whp Honda's and have been in the game since a cold air intake was the best mod on a B18c GSR motor. I just wanted to share my outlook of making HP that comes from different cars I have worked on and relating it to the VQ35 motor.
Last edited by Soundeffects; Aug 8, 2006 at 09:30 PM.
Originally Posted by Soundeffects
Exhaust
-Can anyone tell me why no company make just a plain old turbo manifold such as the greddy one for sale? Like maybe a simple tubular one with a short nice burns style collector? Ideally I would like a long tube equal length with a 3-1 for each bank of cylinders but since no once has done that yet I would settle for a simple greddy style mani. I would run dual gt35r turbos or maybe 2 gt30r's depending on the 25-35psi goal. Either way I don't see a problem with hitting the 800whp goal with those twin turbo's. Run a 3-4in dp as quickly as possible once pass the firewall. Run open dump pipe right there on both turbo's, it won't be that loud since it is turbo or do this with a exhaust valve and continue back with a normal dual exhaust, I'm a little more radical you could say. I like as little exhaust as possible for best spool and output.
Intercooler
-I have looked and looked at big HP setups and have not concluded the best way yet but I do like the idea of APS twin intercooler where the charge pipes are short and direct to the IC and then to the manifold. I would like a 30x12x5in core size though for the kind of boost and temp drops. Maybe even one of the cheap ebay specials for $200 with custom endtanks since were expermenting. Engine bay is a restriction without a doubt or cut the radiator support and use a direct port from the cold side of the IC to the intake manifold with a large 100mm throttle body running a GM 5 bar map sensor instead of out drive by wire system.
-Can anyone tell me why no company make just a plain old turbo manifold such as the greddy one for sale? Like maybe a simple tubular one with a short nice burns style collector? Ideally I would like a long tube equal length with a 3-1 for each bank of cylinders but since no once has done that yet I would settle for a simple greddy style mani. I would run dual gt35r turbos or maybe 2 gt30r's depending on the 25-35psi goal. Either way I don't see a problem with hitting the 800whp goal with those twin turbo's. Run a 3-4in dp as quickly as possible once pass the firewall. Run open dump pipe right there on both turbo's, it won't be that loud since it is turbo or do this with a exhaust valve and continue back with a normal dual exhaust, I'm a little more radical you could say. I like as little exhaust as possible for best spool and output.
Intercooler
-I have looked and looked at big HP setups and have not concluded the best way yet but I do like the idea of APS twin intercooler where the charge pipes are short and direct to the IC and then to the manifold. I would like a 30x12x5in core size though for the kind of boost and temp drops. Maybe even one of the cheap ebay specials for $200 with custom endtanks since were expermenting. Engine bay is a restriction without a doubt or cut the radiator support and use a direct port from the cold side of the IC to the intake manifold with a large 100mm throttle body running a GM 5 bar map sensor instead of out drive by wire system.
http://www.speedforceracing.com/prod...35turbokit.php
Last edited by NoLimit; Aug 8, 2006 at 11:04 PM.
Originally Posted by NoLimit
Sounds like you want the Speed Force Racing TT kit for your Z.
http://www.speedforceracing.com/prod...35turbokit.php
http://www.speedforceracing.com/prod...35turbokit.php