XKR Super G... Going for Mach 1
08-18-2009, 05:57 PM
#801
New Member
iTrader: (13)
Then again, its not like fitting a 3.5" DP from a front mount turbo, and your setup gives you more space..... i dunno, i am sure it will be HOT anyways.
08-18-2009, 06:05 PM
#802
Registered User
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Texas, Arizona,Cayman Island
Posts: 5,256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
glad to see the progress though...i must say....i also have 2 coolers, but it was all made to fit the turbo kit.... The bigger you get in piping the the more the challenge, and there for the more expensive.... I know thats not really an issue to you, but i wanna point out that its much easier to relocate, work around the oil cooler setup as the turbo kit take priority. Its like building cage around a sub-woofer box, when it should be the other way around.
Then again, its not like fitting a 3.5" DP from a front mount turbo, and your setup gives you more space..... i dunno, i am sure it will be HOT anyways.
Then again, its not like fitting a 3.5" DP from a front mount turbo, and your setup gives you more space..... i dunno, i am sure it will be HOT anyways.
....Sharif says there is lots of room.Here is a pic of the oil cooler position.....
Here is how the old pipes were positioned.
You have to be up close to see them with bumper on....but I like where they sit because they get clean air.
Last edited by XKR; 08-19-2009 at 08:23 AM.
08-18-2009, 08:30 PM
#803
Registered User
Even coated, for Mike's application you absolutely want the heat shielding. Think about how much heat is there during one hard pull.....now multiply that by 1000 hard pulls (for this application)....can never have too much to help block the heat..
hell the guys doing the standing mile stuff make some serious shielding due to heat (even when coated) and thats for about 24 seconds of accelleration.
tom
hell the guys doing the standing mile stuff make some serious shielding due to heat (even when coated) and thats for about 24 seconds of accelleration.
tom
08-19-2009, 05:34 AM
#806
Registered User
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Texas, Arizona,Cayman Island
Posts: 5,256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks......come to ZdayZ....I will give you a ride in the Beast
For the right price...she can be yours next year 
For the right price...she can be yours next year
Last edited by XKR; 08-19-2009 at 05:37 AM.
08-19-2009, 05:34 AM
#807
Interesting, I just talked to Sharif about the oil return. I wanted him to use these weld on -AN fitting in the upper pan. He said it would be hard to place them by eye bc it might cause a funny angle, and I should just tap the upper pan (not my fav idea bc its thin and i hate NPT!).
But on your build you are just going straight to below oil level pan spacer. Wonder why he he suggested tapping my upper pan when apparently using the pan spacer is perfectly acceptable?
Looks great!
But on your build you are just going straight to below oil level pan spacer. Wonder why he he suggested tapping my upper pan when apparently using the pan spacer is perfectly acceptable?
Looks great!
08-19-2009, 05:43 AM
#808
Registered User
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Texas, Arizona,Cayman Island
Posts: 5,256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Interesting, I just talked to Sharif about the oil return. I wanted him to use these weld on -AN fitting in the upper pan. He said it would be hard to place them by eye bc it might cause a funny angle, and I should just tap the upper pan (not my fav idea bc its thin and i hate NPT!).
But on your build you are just going straight to below oil level pan spacer. Wonder why he he suggested tapping my upper pan when apparently using the pan spacer is perfectly acceptable?
Looks great!
But on your build you are just going straight to below oil level pan spacer. Wonder why he he suggested tapping my upper pan when apparently using the pan spacer is perfectly acceptable?
Looks great!
08-19-2009, 10:14 AM
#809
Mike, I will take you up on the ride at zdays. I will make sure to wear my depends so that I do not stain you seat.
I personally welded in my return fittings to my midpan I wanted it to drain above the oil level so that there would be no resistance on the oil return from the turbos.
I personally welded in my return fittings to my midpan I wanted it to drain above the oil level so that there would be no resistance on the oil return from the turbos.
08-19-2009, 10:33 AM
#810
Registered User
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Texas, Arizona,Cayman Island
Posts: 5,256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mike, I will take you up on the ride at zdays. I will make sure to wear my depends so that I do not stain you seat.
I personally welded in my return fittings to my midpan I wanted it to drain above the oil level so that there would be no resistance on the oil return from the turbos.
I personally welded in my return fittings to my midpan I wanted it to drain above the oil level so that there would be no resistance on the oil return from the turbos.
Dont worry .... After the last time James was in my car...I started storing extras in the glove compartmentSee you ate GdayZ
Last edited by XKR; 08-19-2009 at 10:54 AM.
08-19-2009, 04:28 PM
#815
Registered User
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Southeast
Posts: 663
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mike, I will take you up on the ride at zdays. I will make sure to wear my depends so that I do not stain you seat.
I personally welded in my return fittings to my midpan I wanted it to drain above the oil level so that there would be no resistance on the oil return from the turbos.
I personally welded in my return fittings to my midpan I wanted it to drain above the oil level so that there would be no resistance on the oil return from the turbos.
Mike can drive.
08-24-2009, 09:30 PM
#819
Hey XKR-
i can't believe i've missed this thread, i read through the first 20 or so pages and i decided i should post a reply.
As far as running a top speed sustained run, you will definitely need to think about not just the rear diffuser, but the overall aero shape of your car.
to reduce over drag, i would highly suggest the following:
1. Elongate the nose and tail sections of your car. That is why most of the superGT/ Super taiyku cars have such long fronts and rears is to make it more streamline for drag reduction. Think Cwest long nose/tail, Ings long nose/tail, nismo v3 long nose/tail. Air remains attached to a longer object, longer, this can help or hurt you, depending on where it is attaching to. you can achieve an overall lower drag coefficient with a longer body
2. you probably would want to minimize drag for a high speed run, and your wheels are probably the #1 cause of drag on the car, if the your tire is much wider than where the fenders cover (i.e. aggressive offset in which you can see the tread from the front of the car) you should create a fairing such that the front of the wheel is covered, and sweeps downward, so that air flow from the tire (which goes in the opposite direction of tire rotation) does not disrupt airflow underneath the car flowing in the right direction (i.e. toward the back). To reduce the opposite flow of air causes by wheel drag, you will notice that race cars have louvers/vents behind the wheel to allow the air to escape and flow back, instead of forward.
3. if you do no have a flat underbody, rake the car such that the front end is lower than the rear. to minimize the amount of airflow that will go underneath your car. the smaller front opening will reduce the amount of airflow if both front and rear of car is at same height.
4. Get lower side skirts. this will 'channel' airflow in one direction which is in from the front, and out only toward the rear, and not allow any airflow from the side of the car disrupt what is already heading toward the back.. i dont know if the silver state classic has any rules about extended side skirts, but a classic example is the chaparral race car in the 70s. it had a sliding skirt
5. as for the rear, if you can't move to a longer rear bumper, i would suggest modifying it so that you have vent holes in the back to release any air trapped so that it does not act like a parachute.. Even if you have the top secret rear diffuser there, air will most likely still be trapped there and since its not completely sealed off, vent the air with holes.
here is an example from the audi race car
6. i would suggest making your own sealable rear diffuser from the axel back at a 6 degree incline with strakes.. literally cut into the rear bumper and just have it go from the axle all the way to the rear of the bumper.
again, the audi race car
you'd probaby want to tuck the exhaust piping as high as possible into the frame and then create your flat underpanelling. you can use the alumalite stuff i stated in my front under tray DIY.
if you don't trust me, i highly suggest reading a few books before you start hacking:
these are great fundamentals, i have all these books and i've been studying these for quite sometime. a better help would be to goto your local university and ask if they have a society of automotive engineering group and ask to speak with the formula SAE team. those guys have access to student versions of ProE with CFD analysis tools that might assist you.
Race Car Aerodynamics: Designing for Speed by Joseph Katz
Competition Car Aerodynamics: A Practical Handbook by Simon McBeath
Competition Car Downforce: A Practical Guide by Simon McBeath
Race Car Vehicle Dynamics by William Milliken
good luck!
i can't believe i've missed this thread, i read through the first 20 or so pages and i decided i should post a reply.
As far as running a top speed sustained run, you will definitely need to think about not just the rear diffuser, but the overall aero shape of your car.
to reduce over drag, i would highly suggest the following:
1. Elongate the nose and tail sections of your car. That is why most of the superGT/ Super taiyku cars have such long fronts and rears is to make it more streamline for drag reduction. Think Cwest long nose/tail, Ings long nose/tail, nismo v3 long nose/tail. Air remains attached to a longer object, longer, this can help or hurt you, depending on where it is attaching to. you can achieve an overall lower drag coefficient with a longer body
2. you probably would want to minimize drag for a high speed run, and your wheels are probably the #1 cause of drag on the car, if the your tire is much wider than where the fenders cover (i.e. aggressive offset in which you can see the tread from the front of the car) you should create a fairing such that the front of the wheel is covered, and sweeps downward, so that air flow from the tire (which goes in the opposite direction of tire rotation) does not disrupt airflow underneath the car flowing in the right direction (i.e. toward the back). To reduce the opposite flow of air causes by wheel drag, you will notice that race cars have louvers/vents behind the wheel to allow the air to escape and flow back, instead of forward.
3. if you do no have a flat underbody, rake the car such that the front end is lower than the rear. to minimize the amount of airflow that will go underneath your car. the smaller front opening will reduce the amount of airflow if both front and rear of car is at same height.
4. Get lower side skirts. this will 'channel' airflow in one direction which is in from the front, and out only toward the rear, and not allow any airflow from the side of the car disrupt what is already heading toward the back.. i dont know if the silver state classic has any rules about extended side skirts, but a classic example is the chaparral race car in the 70s. it had a sliding skirt
5. as for the rear, if you can't move to a longer rear bumper, i would suggest modifying it so that you have vent holes in the back to release any air trapped so that it does not act like a parachute.. Even if you have the top secret rear diffuser there, air will most likely still be trapped there and since its not completely sealed off, vent the air with holes.
here is an example from the audi race car
6. i would suggest making your own sealable rear diffuser from the axel back at a 6 degree incline with strakes.. literally cut into the rear bumper and just have it go from the axle all the way to the rear of the bumper.
again, the audi race car
you'd probaby want to tuck the exhaust piping as high as possible into the frame and then create your flat underpanelling. you can use the alumalite stuff i stated in my front under tray DIY.
if you don't trust me, i highly suggest reading a few books before you start hacking:
these are great fundamentals, i have all these books and i've been studying these for quite sometime. a better help would be to goto your local university and ask if they have a society of automotive engineering group and ask to speak with the formula SAE team. those guys have access to student versions of ProE with CFD analysis tools that might assist you.
Race Car Aerodynamics: Designing for Speed by Joseph Katz
Competition Car Aerodynamics: A Practical Handbook by Simon McBeath
Competition Car Downforce: A Practical Guide by Simon McBeath
Race Car Vehicle Dynamics by William Milliken
good luck!
Last edited by Chebosto; 08-24-2009 at 09:32 PM.
