thom000001

We didn't skimp on fuel on my setup...and you shouldn't...

Triple walbro's, 1200cc inj, -10 feed, -6 return, Aeromotive FPR, controlled by pro-efi.
1 pump on all the time, pump 2 comes on at a set boost, pump 3 also comes on at another set boost.

Like other's have said, maybe look at bosch pumps, there are some the same size as the wabro 255 that flow more. So could do a twin setup with them.

Tom

binder

iTrader: (8)

the bosch 044 flows over 300. i think 310 or 315 and i would be more confident in it's quality.

if you use a fuel pressure sensor hook it up to a throttle cut or something. I have fuel pressure monitored on mine and as fast as the rpms go up top there was no time between seeing fp drop and being able to let off the gas. Takes too long for the signal to the brain, then foot lift. Plus you have to notice it and i'm sure as hell not looking at the gauges when i'm at 7500 rpms and 507hp at the wheels.

Mine isn't as advanced as thom's but i probably should setup a boost switch so i'm not running them both to death. oh well for now though.

You can keep throwing it around in your head but eventualy you'll see the light like i did after a month of being pissy about the money. I added up the cost of a quality decent setup i would trust for a single walbro then an inline pump on top of that and it wasn't near enough savings for me to justify blowing 10g's of my built engine.

What's hard about the wiring? It took me a little time but it's not hard. I didn't even cut my oem plug off. I just spliced into the lines. You basically use the oem lines for nothing more than a power source to kick on a relay and for your fuel level sensor. that's it. There are 6 wires that come out of the twin pump assembly. 3 of them are GROUND so that's simple, 2 others are just a 12v power for each pump, and the last one is the sending wire for the fuel level sensor. It only takes a while to wire because i soldered all my connections.

also, i wil say no matter what you decide you need a minimum 8an feed line or the cjm hardline. You will definitely have fueling problems if you use the stock 5/16" tiny feed line. That i can say is a 100% truth.

Mr_pharmD

iTrader: (48)

Arite, u guys are worrying me too much. What vender has the best deal on the twin pump? Hey binder, u going to help me out over the phone on the wiring? Lol

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

obviously you wont blow your engine if you dont go with multiple pumps. any tuner, yourself included, can see how AFR are reacting to increases in IPW.

Like Tom said, if you want to do it much less expensively, go with a Bosch 044 (or something similiar like an aeromotive) and a surge tank. That would cost about 1/2 of what the twin pump alone costs.
like this http://www.prospeedracing.com.au/pro...rge-Tanks.html
with this
http://www.jayracing.com/index.php?m...&products_id=1

**or this would be perfect as well for only 90$ http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=120549918745)
would be $380
plumbed like this (nm the carb part in the title)


either solution is better than 1 pump at those HP levels though

binder

iTrader: (8)

sure thing. I have the diagrams on my computer of the wiring along with pics of my wiring. I can pm you my number.

rich is correct, with a PROPER inline setup you will be ok. 044 with large lines and a surge tank is what it would take. So you'll need to get rid of the stock hardpipe and run an 8an line or the cjm hardpipe.

Rich, since he has a return fuel system already all he'll need is an 8an line and that twin pump setup. The 8an line will be required for both setups anyways so we wont factor it's cost.

so basically he'll need: 800$ for the twinpump + 8an line

inline fuel setup: 8an line + 380$ for 044, the cost for additional connectors to hook them all together (i know that' piddly but when you add a number of an connectors at 15$ a piece the price gets up there fast) + surge tank. I'm not sure but i think most surge tanks built properly are around 300$. I'm not sure about you but it appears to be almost equal in cost. I know when i actually wrote down everything i needed from ever vender it was easier and within 100$ cost to go with the twin pump setup. Maybe i got bad prices but i used the cheapest summit braided lines and connectors with the cheapest surge tank i could find.

Pharm, look up all the prices on your own and lay them out. You'll see what i mean.

IIQuickSilverII

iTrader: (13)

gont stress it too much,... a lot depends on yours goals, type of fuel, size injectors....
i think for your goals youa re probably ok... but if you can get a twin pump you will NOT go wrong....and at least youll be ready if you ever push it more.

binder

iTrader: (8)

injector size is independant. As long as your injectors will flow more than the power levels you are going for then they have no part in causing no fuel pressure.

So you really think 600hp on a single pump is safe? I would say 550hp is pushing it to the max and his goals are 550-600.

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

cass went 650DD on meth and single pump.

really he wont know what his fuel pressure does til he actually makes that kinda power. James couldnt make that kinda power on pump with his PL kit, so be interesting to see what PharmD can.

-8an line is only 4.67$ a foot http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=330375704107

and -8 end are only $5.52 each
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=230396294389

Thats the stuff I use.

So you;d be looking at $180 for the Bosch 044pump and the 90$ surge tank from Cxracing, plus maybe $150 in hose and fittings. Essentially this http://www.importpartspro.com/aamcobigpuup.html for about 1/2 the price

I've been running the CJM dual pumps for about a year and its great, but loud. It works great down to almost empty tank, which is nice. Also, essentially drop in and go where as an external pump setup would require a little more planning.

binder

iTrader: (8)

Meth makes a difference though. pharm got just over 30hp out of a mild meth tune with his vortech setup. I'd like to see cass's numbers on pure single pump.

My numbers must have been off. The 8an line is relatively cheap but so was the 1/2" hardpipe from charles. I'm not sure what surge tank you found but it baffles me that it's 1/3 the cost of the cheapest surge tank i've found. Just like aam's 1100$ upgrade which required Randy (i think) to do all that extra work to it to get it to work properly.

If you can get it all setup for cheap then go for it. Judging by the fact that you think the 6 wires for the twin pump setup is difficult i'm sure you probably don't want to try building a surge tank setup. The money difference for me was by far worth the ease of going twin pump as rich said. drop in and go.

It's ultimately your decision since it's your car.

Mr_pharmD

iTrader: (48)

I like the idea of drop in but the noise might be factor now. I was happy with the power of the vortech but the noise was what finally made me switch. Is the twin pump that loud where I'll hear it in the cabin? I seriously can't hear my single n inline pump once started and the car is nice and quiet now at idle. Does the twin make a buzz? What is the surge tank for? Can't I just replace the walbro inline for the bosh one?

Z PHAT Z

iTrader: (46)

This is exactly what Hal@IP told me about my car. It's making 523 WHP with 50/50 methanol mix, CJM stage 2 RFS. It starting to have fuel problem with the single walbro. So I guess to get more out of the 18G greddy kit, then twin pump and 3" exhaust should be my next upgrade.

Mr_pharmD

iTrader: (48)

And u just picked up the twin pump that I wanted to buy from, lol

Z PHAT Z

iTrader: (46)

Yes sir! LOL. I saw and pay the guy right away! Save me couple hundred bux Good luck to you in your search of the twin pump

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

i mentioned meth, since he's already got it and it will extend your fuel system for cheap.

the noise in the start of the video is the dual pumps
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOjPJL-rESQ

techincally you dont need a surge tank, but thats the proper way to plumb. Pretty sure you want one to avoid fuel starve if one of the pumps is too fast.

Nexx

iTrader: (41)

good god that is noisy!!!

binder

iTrader: (8)

rich, something is SERIOUSLY wrong with your twin pump setup. With the rear seat in my car at idle you can't hear it. At low rpm when i first give it gas to spool up you can hear the twin pump a little but once the turbo spools all I hear is turbo.

I gave 2 people rides this weekend and when i asked if they could hear my fuel pump neither said they could.

Pharm, go through charles at CJM. he gave me a great deal and is awsome to work with.

binder

iTrader: (8)

Pharm, have you ever stood outside of a chevy fullsize truck (newer model) while it's idling? you can hear that slight hum from under the truck. that is the most i hear in my car with my rear seat in.

surge tank is to keep fuel on tap for when that big pump starts drawing fuel. You might not need it but there is a chance of getting a lean tip in when you mash the gas without it. I can't say 100% that it will because i chose a twin pump setup, but the reasoning behind running a larger pump after a small pump says that there is a possibility that the big inline will suck more fuel that the small one can provide at quick throttle changes.

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

nope it 100% perfect. rear seat might not have been in though, now that I think about it.

Jeff, take you should take a vid with your backseat in. That would help PharmD as well I'm sure. I dont have an exhaust now so i cant make a good vid with the seat in.

But that is 100% what a dual pump setup sounds like when its hot with no seat covering it.

binder

iTrader: (8)

wow, when i was testing with my seat out it still wasn't near that level. I even uhooked each line and cycled the pump to make sure both pumps were pushing fuel.

i'll take one here in a bit. I'm studying midterms and i need to swap my o2 sensors out so i'd rather do that before starting the car since that exhaust heats up fast.

cruising down the road, anything past 2500 rpms i hear zero fuel pump. lower than that i hear a slight whine but only cause i know it's there. Like i said, my passengers who are both car guys said they didn't notice it. I notice it because it's the sound of pure sex in my gas tank.

binder

iTrader: (8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r90cBWBS6g0


that's the best i can do. My borla is quite so you can barely hear my car idling. I'm inside my garage with the door closed to make it as noisy as possible. The doors on my car are closed with windows up. That faint higher pitched hum you hear is the fuel pump. That's at idle as you can see near the end of the video with the image of the tach. That's the loudest noise it makes in my car.