herrschaft

Thats quite the build. Now he needs to find his way onto this forum.

meatbag

iTrader: (9)

With the way most people act on this forum you will never really see any of the fast VQ's on here.

Cam specs are closely guarded when your at that point in racing. Otherwise building a motor like that is not as hard as people think you just have to know what it takes and it basically applies to any motor you build for a car like this.

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

Professional race teams aren't going to waste their time here. It's not beneficial to them in any way.

So are the cams likely a custom grind for that power level instead an off-the-shelf cam? It would be cool though if more of the specs were known for that car. I'm particularly interested to know how high they're revving that motor and some details on their oiling system.

Stock2Autocrozz

iTrader: (6)

I agree fully, however, it does serve to benefit the community when people do share knowledge....unfortunately here, it is not always well received.

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

I'm also curious to know what kind of head studs they're using to hold that kinda power. 1/2" I would imagine.

Resmarted

iTrader: (2)

1/2" or even some custom 5/8" aged arp's wouldn't surprise me. They must have O-ringed that motor too.

Hell inconel 718 studs, ARP 625, or ARP 3.5 (maybe even armet!) would be needed for this engine I'd bet my *** on it. Probably torqued to all hell too.

Unless they went real fancy about it... There's the old "weld the head to the block" addage :P One of the rb26 cars did some kind of 'f1 technique' to attach the heads to the block... Still have no idea what that actually means.

Race shops like that typically don't go on forums from what I see... and when they do they don't post too many useful 'secrets'.... definitely wouldn't post that kind of stuff on here.

350zion

iTrader: (58)

^^ hell Yea that about sums it up...

+1 for this.. Definitely curious to kno specs.. I looked while at work today n couldn't come up with much more than what was previously posted..

Btw fellas, haven't searched on here much but I do have a question... Someone above mentioned sleeved block..

Does anyone kno the exact fail point of stock sleeves?

I would assume on this car they would sleeve it due to higher pressures/ temps but I'm talking VQ's in the 1000 range...

Resmarted

iTrader: (2)

I don't think there is a "fail point" for the sleeves. I'm not entirely sure about the specifics the main issue is that the MID sleeve is actually 'a wet sleeve' and that it has different expansion rates than aluminum so you get sleeves being dropped and pushing the head up as the 'failure'. I'm not sure if the 'wet sleeve' actually contributes to this, I think that it is supposed to reduce the probability of cylinder shifting (via better cooling?) while allowing the sleeve to be replaced, but I honestly don't understand it completely (have heard several things from machinists and honestly don't really get it). Maybe someone who understands the MID setup can clear that up.

I doubt you'll find a better material for cylinders than what darton uses. I've never read about one of those sleeves breaking, but I don't know anyone personally that has run them... I'm sure eddie hal or dustin would be able to answer that.
EDIT:
Derp. thought you were talking about aftermarket sleeves.... didn't read the word STOCK

Oh I see. I wonder if it's an air shifter.

Aluminum internals... rebuild ERRYDAY ALL DAY lol, would not find that fun after every race on a vq. But they probably have a new timing cover setup etc to make that not a pita

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

I don't think a definitive fail point has been determined yet for stock sleeves. Intense made 906whp (as well several mid to high 800 pulls leading up to that point) on stock sleeves with a DJ dyno, but never pushed the motor under load on the track beyond 700whp. I believe XKR and str8dum1 also pushed their stock sleeves beyond 900whp on a DD dyno, but dunno if either of them ever tracked or did WOT pulls on the highway at that power level. I think the limits of the stock sleeves are still relatively uncharted and untested territory.

abushong504

iTrader: (87)

Sick video. Hella fast. I know Hal has stock sleeves and gives that thing hell all of the time at over 800+.

I get to rack up the mileage on my Darton sleeves now.

RudeG_v2.0

iTrader: (1)

If they're using BME rods, they're probably more durable than you think. BME advertises their aluminium rods as streetable and claims longevity that rivals some forged steel rods. Scroll down near the bottom to the section titled "The Only Streetable Aluminum Rod".

http://www.bmeltd.com/rods.htm

jerryd87

iTrader: (4)

everything i have found indicates that the sleeves are made out of ductile iron stock, the same material darton uses, according to what my machinist told me after my machine work was done even with the 96 mm pistons i had a little over .2 inchs thickness left in the cylinders. thats alot since the "safety" level for most engines is considered .125 inchs and ive seen a couple engines hold at .09(although not crazy power numbers). by comparision the darton with the same size bore is about .3 inchs wall thickness.

for my measurements i cant quote that as fact since i dont know how to use a sonic tester to measure such things so its what i was told by my machinist with my specific engine.

Dynosty

iTrader: (27)

Excellent. I'd love to take that for a pass!

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

I am really surprised that the TB48DE wasnt chosen.
1.06 60', fuqq sake!

350zion

iTrader: (58)

I also remember reading that the Dartons and stock sleeves were made out of ductile iron. I thought about sleeving this block but then I searched and found no conclusive reasoning y not to trust the stock cylinder walls. Although my searching wasn't extensive I decided to keep things simple..

If I were to increase the bore then I definitely would of used Dartons ...

I'll be shooting for big power real soon!

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

According to Sound Performance, at high boost, stock sleeves walk and the motor will push water. GTM had a block crack at stock sleeves at a pretty high whp.

On a full blown race car that gets constant rebuilds, like shown I doubt it matters.

meatbag

iTrader: (9)

Yes these motors are sleeved. Anyone really believe and open deck VQ is going to handle 2000+whp

Resmarted

iTrader: (2)

I remember talking to reid about this.... Part of the reason he thought eagles are stronger than the block (hp wise).... Honestly im a bit confused by that notion of pushing water because i haven't read anything about that happening online. I wish we had more information about those failures, its really interesting

str8dum1

iTrader: (11)

for 1100 rotations, sure.

9000 rpms divided by 60 secs = 150 rpms per sec * 7 sec = ~1100 rotations.

Also, adding sleeves does not change the deck type....

350zion

iTrader: (58)

So Wats the advantage to running sleeves then? From wat I've learned, open decks are prone to distorting at tdc and thats where the failure comes into play. If sleeving doesn't change the deck then are they jus stronger at the top?
And wouldn't they still walk?

Sure hate to thread Jack but this car has brought up a few questions....
I agree that once u have reached that level routine tear downs are part of the business.... Imagine doing that with our stock motors... ish would get old real quick!