Yes i know there are risk to having a SC, but it is safer because it is always running and not a dramatic power increase that goes on/off. But this is all argueable, but anyway, ya iam still unsure of which i want.

 

well put GQ.

In regards to the Greddy IC (though oversize) it perform quite well on a test I did a while back.

With a Techtom CMX100 and 100+ degree day we where able to see how well the intake temp were with the Greddy IC. When cruising the intake temp was kept at 109 degrees and when on idle parked at a red light it creep up to 114 degrees. Once moving again it went back to 109 degrees. We did this stop and go trying to see if we can get the IC heatsoak but never did and gave up.

On a similar test with a PE and ATI IC the temp were maintained at 130 degrees and took longer to come down.

So knowing the Greddy IC is oversized, it does it's job quite well.

 

Actually I would prefer a bigger lookin IC. Not like the SRT4's with some puny ones. It looks much meaner with a bigger IC IMO. So I prefer bigger.

 

Yep, without a doubt. The emanage will make the ECU advance timing because it's modifying the MAF signal. The ECU thinks the engine is getting less air so it sends less duty to the injectors (compensated by having larger injectors) and firing the plugs sooner because it THINKS the motor has less air to burn. This can cause a lot of pinging, I can't believe greddy did not address this before they sent the kits out. The Z has very agressive timing advance stock.

 

Hey 350now...when I measured the intake temp with my OBDII scanner with my laptop, it showed my intake charge was about 85degrees when cruising on the freeway in 90 degree whether. when I boosted a couple of times...it went up just a bit. The temp reading I was getting was directly from the MAF sensor hotwire, so it should be exceptionally accurate. How come your reading was much higher?

 

gq: I think that either the sensor or the scanner is giving out a bogus reading. I dont think the intake air could be that cool.

 

Not sure I thought it was good. It was 100 degrees outside and the intake charge is 9 degrees above ambient. 14 degrees above on idle. The Techtom CMX100 also read from teh OBDII so I presume it's coming from the same source. I wonder if your scanner could be off?

 

Proper IC design utilizes more short channels in parallel, as opposed to fewer, longer channels. Compare the APS design in terms of the air inlet and exit into and out of the IC, verses the Greddy design. For a given intercooler size the one with better cooling and less power loss will be the one with more short channels in parallel. With a better design, maybe Greddy could have gotten way with a smaller unit; one that would fit without removing the front bumper.

 

Speedracer, I dont think its that simple...short channels vs. long channels. Other areas are end tank design, core thickness, core design...etc. The important thing is to size the intercooler to the specific application. Despite the large intercooler size and thickness, those that have driven a Greddy TT at low boost levels, know there is very little power loss or lag, when compared to the PE kit, which has a better sized intercooler. I am just not seeing huge performance improvements by going with a smaller, better matched intercooler.

That said, the APS intercooler is the bomb...no question there. It is a bar and plate design, and I love the end tank design. So logical and creative at the same time.

 

How does the Stillen Supercharger fit into this discussion. The roots offers you power at a different point in the powerband. It appears to also be a very reliable. The hood replacement aside the biggest knock appears to be that it produces less peak power. I'm looking for something that is reliable as a daily streetable package, that also gives me a decent increase in power. I don't need to have specific numbers on paper (i.e at least 400hp)...if it feels faster and goes faster thats what I'm after.

Thoughts?

 

If you aren't really really set on the Greddy TT setup, you REALLY should consider the APS kit, it is more complete out of the box.

 

GQ..ok now I know you ahve been listening to me over the past few months Good posts!

The Greddy is a great kit for those that want to play with it and tweak. Out of the box, my mandatory mods would be the ignition harness and the fuel pump. The stock pump is woefully inadequate for forced induction.

The GReddy IC is not the worst design I have seen, but far from the best. However, you have to understand that Greddy uses the same IC cores in all their kits...only the endtake and piping changes. Thats why the kit is set up the way it is...there really is no other way for them to do it.

As for bar and plate vs tube and fin....it's honestly 6 of one half dozen of another for what most of us use our cars for. There are plusses and minusses to each, and lots of very reputable tuners have successfully run either in their cars.

gq - if ambient temp is 90, you cannot have an air inlet temp of 85

 

hehe...then either my outside temp guage is off, or the OBDII scanner is off. Or maybe I just read it wrong....I have too many guages and thing going on in that car. I'll retest when I get my car back. No, its not back yet.

Hey Z1...don't give yourself too much credit...hehe...I panicked when I saw all the TT's dropping like flys. Nobody really knows the limits until things start breaking.

 

Z1 , do you conceed that the APS FMIC design "seems" more effective than that of Greddy? It's cross sectional area presented to the boosted flow is wider and the "drag" distance is shorter. So it appears that it would offer a lower psi drop and at least an as effective heat transfer capablity. And it also allows the bumper beam to remain intact....

 

Interesting trend, I have noticed that you said something about rings blowing with an SC, but that is a little better than a bent rod. I am still undecided myself, but I am going more and more away from a TT only cause of the abuse the stock engine takes with all that torque from a TT.

 

I agree that all other things equal the shorter larger flow pattern is better, however like every thing we do to our cars there is a trade off.

In order to used that design the air is forced through two 90 degree bends (one on bottom to turn air upwards and one on top to return the air to a horizontal flow) APS does a nice job to smooth these turns out but they still happen.

The only way to judge these kits is on the same engine setup (stock vs stock) with the kits at the same boost. The only numbers we have on APS is what they give us 432@9psi with full exhuast (test pipe and true dual). Those are roughly the same numbers that the greddy kits have been putting down at that psi. So it looks like though each has pros and cons they equal out by the time it hits the ground.
Gary

 

Hi guys, I am new to your forum and I am enjoying reading your posts.

I think that speedracer has a VERY good point. What is the objective? My last "nice" car was an R33 GTR, 480BHP - possibly the best 4x4 system ever? Maybe, but I ended up driving around at 0.8bar most of the time. Why - anyone who has driven a skyline GTR will no that although they are 4x4, they are only two wheel drive until you need it. Put your foot even slightly half way down in a corner and the back end comes out - yes you can control it - but you try driving like that for 100miles. You'll be knackered.

Nice linear power from a SC sounds good to me but at the end of the day - i drove a Mini cooper S-Works the other day - don't laugh 200Bhp in a mini! and although you could feel it was fast it didn't keep up with my friend Renault 5 turbo (don't know if you have them in the states - 1.4T Hatch back) - The extra power in the midrange is what will get you past that car in front before the corner - you don't really need to be up at 6000rpm much. I haven't seen a torque graph yet but I bet that the torque on a TT 350 peaks at 4000-4500 and then begins to tail off?

If you want the best of both worlds - my jesture of advice would be do the TT, keep the boost low if your not gonna do engine mods, but also get an in-car boost controller. I had a GReddy one that had:

1) Standard GTR boost (7psi ish) - sluggish
2) I set my Normal boost 11psi -ish
3) "overtake" boost to (18psi)

You have a fast-easy to drive car for most of the time but when you have your favourate music playing and someone takes your fancy - one press of a button and you have an animal.

I am concerned though, even my Skyline had to have some top-end engine mods to be safe, how many FI conversions do you guys know about that are running with standard compression?

I blew up a rover 620Turbo here in the uk just by adding 4psi - and that was a Turbo engine to begin with - and the ECU feul mapping was dynamic - anyway one melted piston and £3k later...

I cheap trick we used to do with Vauxhall Calibra Turbo's was to simply put two head gaskets in - this allowed you to run the stock car at 11psi (7psi standard) with out any problems. Isn't there a simple "metal" head gasket mod available that just lowers the compression slightly?

Thanks for reading my drivle!

I do have a question though, is there anyone in the UK who can fit a TT kit to my car? I absolutely LOVE the work that has been put into the APS kit but I can't find any mention of it over here.

Even my Skyline tuner doesn't do much with the 350z :-(

Point me to a website - give me an e-mail address please!!!!

 

Have you tried this forum:
http://www.350zuk.com/forums/index.php

 

No, but I have now!

Thank you.


Dead

 

G3Po - I supposed it comes down to what you plan to do with the kit. At the modest boost levels we are talking about these kits running out of the box, I'd venture to say it would not matter at all what brand IC the car has.

However, I do like that it leaves the bumper beam intact. We'll have to see how the numbers stack up once the kit is sold here