makizm69

iTrader: (1)

dealer confirmed this part must not be reused which they did and repair is at no cost, just want to punch that mechanic in the face who replaced my trans..

spent almost 2 weeks troubleshooting, researching and battling to get this resolved

earthvie

I did not won't to start a new thread for this. I see that the clutch issue have bothered lots of folks. Anyway here is my problem. 98,000 miles on a 2005. Needed to replace the clutch. I got a stage 2 clutch kit. Had it installed. When I picked up the car they told me there was an issue, the clutch pedal would not return back to the top. I told them it did before they worked on it. They told me they never broke the seal on the master or the slave while changing clutch. They thought about air in the system and told me that they bleed the system for an hour but it did not help. They said master cylinder must be weak. So fine I went and bought new master and slave for the clutch. I stayed while they installed it and watched. They drained and replaced the parts. Hooked up a pump with fluid at the bottom and pushed it to the top. filling the reserve twice. Pumped the pedal and bleed at the bottom. The pedal would get tight after 5 pushes but it would never pop past that point to push the pedal all the way up. They tried adjusting the pedal, never helped. The clutch is tight, but will not push the pedal all the out. Now with this happen with the replacement of the clutch, could there be something wrong with it? Oh please somebody help.

Duckeee

iTrader: (7)

im having the same issue and have searched tons. do not have time to pull the slave out of the tranny (I have an 07). new master is coming tomorrow. but for the life of me and my co worker we cannot get ANY fluid to bleed out of the nipple. we get little bubbles and air but for two nights and a total of 4 hours, we cannot get any fluid out via power bleeder or manually. i'm going to try to adjust the fork on the pedal to see if that does any justice.

ive read that you can keep all the lines on the master and just pull it out. well, theres a hard line on it so that method is almost impossible. i'd like to bench bleed the master before i install the new one but i do not know how to properly.

earthvie

No problem with mine with the fluid. It will just run out of the bleeder screw if you open it. The slave on 05 is outside trany so easy to change, master is hardline so no way to pump it out of the car. I guess a big question is, if you push on the clutch fork that the slave moves back and forth, should I just be able to press it back in with no resistance, and when i do the clutch pedal pops all the way up and it goes limp until I pump it? Oh this damn clutch.

Duckeee

iTrader: (7)

if its all bled correctly and you have replaced all the components, the only reason i can think of for you is predominantly air bubbles and/or you need to re-adjust the fork/rod on your clutch pedal to the master.

for me though no fluid is coming out of the bleeder screw no matter what we do. at first some black liquid came out, but the reservoir is completely filled with clean clean fluid. im lost..

earthvie

I can't believe there would still be air in my system. Back filled, bleed several times and also bleed with pushing slave all the way in. I have moved the adjustment on pedal from all the way out to center to all the way in, never makes any difference except where the point where the clutch engaged/disengaged at.

ZSpeedPerformance

iTrader: (71)

Is the fork/spring installed correctly? Does the clutch release ok? If the TOB retaining spring is on backwards it can cause the fork to want to push back away from the clutch after it is at rest, Then the pedal has to travel too far to move the slave out to the fork and then push the bearing back to the clutch causing issues. At rest, the fork/Throw out bearing should be sitting right on the clutch fingers and slave should be pushing on the fork slightly. The master can cause it also but if you already replaced it that is probably not it.

Adjustment is another problem and has to be just right for it to return back correctly. Adjustment must be correct before you try and bleed.

You can also try to bleed the master on the car, Loosen the hard line at the master cylinder, push pedal to floor, While on floor tighten the line up, repeat 3-4 times. Air can get trapped up there and won't bleed easily.

Duckeee

iTrader: (7)

just an update to anyone who is running into the problem.

i bled for a good two nights with my co worker with no results before i called it quits and bought a master cylinder to see if that did any good. upon the newly installed master cylinder the first pump of the clutch bled fluid out right away.

to all those who have an 07-08 and believe it's the slave, please replace the master first. its an easy and cheap replacement. if problem still occurs move on from there.

ZSpeedPerformance

iTrader: (71)

And the reason we came up with this, HR Wilwood master cylinder upgrade
We now have this available for cars with VDC also.
Heavy Duty Wilwood Clutch Master Upgrade

track04

iTrader: (3)

anybody know how much the fork should be moving form clutch pedal at rest and at the top to clutch pedal pressed all the way down?

ZSpeedPerformance

iTrader: (71)

With normal OE settings at the master cylinder adjustment, Measuring from the end of the fork facing out of the trans it should move about 5/8" with a full pedal stroke.

bmyles

Sigh...I did braided line swap a couple weeks ago thinking the stock line was bulging and now my M/C is dying. Ordered one through Autozone for $46, hopefully here tomorrow. At least it's fairly minor.

track04

iTrader: (3)

i have pictures showing that amount of movement.

I put in a JWT clutch and flywheel, ss clutch line to replace the rubber portion, new throw out bearing.
Put everything back together, and couldnt disengage the clutch.

I figured master or slave were too weak to handle heavy new pressure plate so i ordered new clutch master and slave from rock auto.

The rock auto master was dead on arrival, so i ordered a wilwood heavy duty master and installed and blead last night.

still same thing. i can get the car started (in gear with the starter) and drive around fine shifting without the clutch, so the clutch and flywheel should be installed correctly.

when i press the clutch pedal though, it wont disengage so i cant shift properly, come to a stock. or idle with the car in gear and clutch pedal all the way pressed

ZSpeedPerformance

iTrader: (71)

If the fork is moving at or more than 5/8" it is working correctly.
May have a install problem, Weak clutch fork (if yours is not the upgraded cast iron fork)

I have seen the release bearing retainer springs installed backwards which causes pressure in the wrong direction on the fork which causes the slave to have to move farther than normal to release the clutch. If you pump the clutch does it start to work better for a sec?

Post up a video of the slave cylinder action while you are pumping the clutch.

track04

iTrader: (3)

thanks for the help.

I put a spacer between the stave and the fork, about 1/8" think to get it to open farther, but still nothing. I have the cast iron fork so that shouldnt be the issue.

I did not try the pumping. Im doing all this alone so the video will be hard. Ill try to get the wife out to help me.

Is there a way to check the retaining spring on the throw out bearing without pulling the trans?
I am not sure if the boot can be removed from the fork without destroying it.

ZSpeedPerformance

iTrader: (71)

If the retainer is in wrong the fork will move away from the slave on its own, Take the spacer out it is doing nothing for you, this will only cause you problems later when the clutch wears.

There should be slight pressure from the fork pushing on the slave rod "AT REST", If the fork backs away from the rod allowing it to extend out (towards rear of car) most likely the spring is installed wrong and will need to have the trans pulled to fix. Normally the fork position at rest is about middle way in the opening of the trans.

With everything at rest, if you push backwards (towards the back of the car) on the fork, you should not have any movement and the fork should immediately be pushing against the clutch.
If these check ok you may need to have someone help you bleed the clutch or adjust the master cylinder rod adjustment.

track04

iTrader: (3)

https://snt110.mail.live.com/att/Get...UvanBlZw_3d_3d
https://snt110.mail.live.com/att/Get...UvanBlZw_3d_3d

The spacer is removed, i just put it in to see if moving the fork a little farther made a difference.

Everything you mention checks out. I have no play when everything is at rest in the fork.

The master cylinder rod however is set to the longest setting figuring it would give me the more amount of travel.

ZSpeedPerformance

iTrader: (71)

Pics dont work. Spacing the slave will not give you any more stroke, Just starts in a different position.

Does it have a firm pedal feel right from the top of the stoke? Or is it mushy feeling? Does the clutch release at all or is it just stuck in gear all the time?

How far is the fork moving with a full pedal stroke?

Did you TQ all the pressure plate bolts in a Cris cross fashion evenly? Are you sure they are all tight?


You can also back the Cruise control switch, or Stopper bolt if you dont have cruise, on the top of the pedal out some to get the pedal up higher giving you even more stroke at the master. You MUST make sure you retain some free play in the clevis, too tight and it will never bleed or work correctly.

track04

iTrader: (3)

Pedal feels pretty good with the Wilwood master cyl. Does not feel mushy, but it has been 3 weeks since i drove the car so i can say for sure.

With the car off, i can shift through the gears. If i start the car in neutral, i cant shift into any gear, so it tells me the clutch is not disengaging from the flywheel.

If i put the car in 1st gear, and just turn the key the starter will get the car running, and moving at the same time. Then i can drive in 1st, i can shift to 2nd, 3rd and 4th, but WITHOUT the clutch, just moving the gear lever.

Pressing the clutch pedal has no effect on the ability to shift.


I did all the bolts, both flywheel and pressure plate in a cris cross fashion, and with a torque wrench in stages, not right to final torque. I am sure they are all tight.
If the pressure plate was not tight, or some of the bolts were stripped off, i would assume the clutch would be slipping when driving. It holds good even on full throttle burts. I have only gotten the car started with the starter twice though. I dont want to keep doing it, just wanted to eliminate some possibilities of problems.

I will try to get the pics working.

track04

iTrader: (3)

Clutch pedal up


Clutch pedal pressed down


I cant get the car into any gear with the engine running.