I'm just curious where the money is in the Z (other than profit). I'm just curious. I love the car, love the way it looks, drives, etc. However, I just bought a new '05 Acura TL last night (kept the Z, dont' worry) and I gotta tell ya, the quality on the Z isn't even close. My impressions below in comparison:

Acura ($32,000) - Leather everywhere, power seats, dual zone climate control, sunroof, XM sattelite, 8 speaker, DVD audio, AT (boo, hiss), 17" rims.

Nissan ($30,400) - Cloth, manual seats, single zone, no sunroof, no sattelite, 4 speakers (garbage at that), CD, Manual, 18" rims.

Now they are 2 different cars in personality, but given all the luxury appointments and refinements in the Acura, all that stuff costs money. Now the Z has a beautiful engine (arguably better than the Acura's), a carbon fiber driveshaft, and bigger rims,

Not dissapointed in any way with the Z, just suprised at how inexpensive the Acura is.

Your thoughts/comments welcome....

 

theres more to a development budget than simply features

in fact crap like dual zone climate, satelite radio and paper cone speakers are the cheapest parts of building a car

where did the money go......think 3.5L V6, think all aluminuim suspension, chassis bracing, etc

also a little thing called economies of scale. Id imagine Nissan dont sell half as many cars as Honda do worldwide, so for each one of those cars the profit must be greater to recoup their development costs. That TL is running on a fwd Civic chassis, and i can say sales of Civics alone would be more than the total number of Nissan's sold. Get Honda to build a TL on a rwd chassis and undergo new chassis and suspension development rather than carrying over all the parts from a Civic and see what the bottom line figure is

 

+1-R and D, tons of engineering into the design and performance of the Z. If you compare it to a Mustang GT or something which is similar in price you get a really good all around car with the Z. When you read comparos everywhere the Z outperforms them all (overall, maybe not in straight line acceleration). For the price you get a lot of performance with the Z. It may not seem apparent from the interior but when you drive it you know, .

 

Also, after owning the "Z" for two years, looking at it still gives me a "WOODY".

Regards....

 

Overall? Uh http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....&page_number=1

 

I dont think its far to compare Acura with Nissan, Acura Vs Infinity would be fair if you want to compare seats, interior materials, climate controls, speaker system, realiability.

On top of that you are comparing a sedan vs sports car. So the appointments oriented towards luxury or comfort will almost always be better on a sedan.

As far as engineering goes:
The all aluminum suspension on the Z , this new suspension setup is so unique that Nissan has already been awarded 14 patents for design and execution. If you know something about filing patents and getting them approved, you know what I mean. No wonder people have had feathering issues. But I appreciate the effort in designing something unique and new.

The weight distribution on a front engine car with a sizable V6 is going to be front wheel heavy, but they still managed to get it to 53/47. Compare it Honda S2000 or Mazda Rx8, both have very light or smaller engines, so achieving near 50/50 distribution is much easier.
The same goes for Z weighed at about 3200 lbs for a sizable V6 engine and shared platform that Z uses is remarkable. Al hood, carbon fiber driveshaft etc contribute to that.

The Cd, Coeff of drag 0.29/0.3 is quite efficient or aerodynamic.

And all other little things that matter on top of basic car engineering, like xenons, Auto dimming mirrors, Homelink transmitter, heated mirrors, automatic climate control, TPMS etc.

So overall, being an engineer myself, I can appreciate the detailed engineering gone into the design of the Z and love my Z for that and great performance numbers for the price it can achieve.

 

They didn't spend any money on the frame. It came from their truck line of frames. So, no cost on that. They should have came up with a racing type chassis that is lightweight and saved us several hundred pounds.

 

deleted.

 

These are platforms used by Nissan. Z is not based on truck platform, but FM platform. It uses monocoque construction, not body on frame like conventional trucks.

B: Includes small models that aren't—yet—available in North America. The models are: Cube, Cube Cubic, March, Micra (and future Renault models. Renault owns 44.4% of Nissan, which gives it control over the company. While there is sharing of products, plants and technologies between the two companies, the stated goal is to maintain two distinctive—at least from the point of view of the customers—organizations. Just as customers aren't generally aware of underlying vehicle platforms, the Renault-Nissan sharing is something that is out of view.). (The B platform vehicle that is to make its way to North America is the next-generation Cube; the current generation, the second, was launched in 2002; it is primarily a Japan domestic market vehicle.)

FF-L: The acronym signifies "Front-engine, Front-drive, Large." The vehicles it encompasses are Altima, Maxima, Murano, Quest Presage, and Teana. (The Presage most resembles a Quest minivan; the Teana is similar to the Maxima sedan.)

F-Alpha: Arguably the most "American" of the platforms, as it is the truck platform, used for the Armada, Titan, Infiniti QX56, and '05 models of the Frontier, Pathfinder, and Xterra.

C: As with the B, co-developed with Renault. Presently, the C is used for the Renault Megane; no Nissan models yet.

FR-L/FM: This is Front-engine, Rear-drive, Large and Front Mid-ship. It accounts for an array of products, including the Infiniti FX 45/35, M45 Concept, G35 coupe and sedan, Nissan 350Z, Stagea (Japan market wagon), Skyline (Japan market G35), and Fairlady Z (Japan market 350Z). One thing worth thinking about is that the FX is a five-passenger SUV and the 350Z is a two-passenger sports car, yet they fall within the same platform grouping.

 

Don't you agree we should have a "Sport Car" only frame just for the Z, maxima, altima and made lighter to save weight? If not for those vehicles at least for the Z?

 

No, because then the car would be too expensive.

Besides, what makes you think there is significant weight to be shed? What cars are we comparing the Z to that makes it seem heavy? A porsche carrera weighs almost as much for double the price. An RX8 with an engine half the displacement of our Z is a mere 150 lbs. lighter.

 

did you even look at the article? the only car less expensive on the list is the s2000. the other car's prices range from 44k to 91k. i have no problem with my car finishing near the bottom of heap when compared to cars that cost 50 to 150% more.

 

I figured I'd get a number of responses on that. Thanks for all the input. I can see the significant cost coming from the Al engine, suspension, carbon fiber driveshaft, and all that jazz. As a contributor to several patents I do know the research and effort that goes into them. (TL is based on Accord, not Civic I believe). I would certainly also believe the economies of scale.

Didn't mean this to be a bash on the Z. I own it and love it, still smile on my drive to work in the morning. I was just suprised at how many more features were on the TL for about the same price.

 

they should of made a z specific frame, honda did for the s2k and its still competively priced, on top of that they have a model specific engine as well, opposed to the z's multipurpose engine. I agree with the orginal poster, there isn't really much that is ultra unique on the car that warrents a 32k price tag. Now if they had a 4.0L engine or something a tad different then it would be worth it.

 

There's no doubt that the Acura has a lot more equipment. Consider, though, that it's based on the FWD Honda Accord..a cheap(er) car. The Z OTOH shares its platform with more expensive cars. The Z has its share of stuff too...I don't think the Acura has an aluminum hood, special driver's seat, shift light, etc. The Z is also much more exclusive (although it too is fairly common) Put the Z through a corner and you'll wonder where the money went in the Acura. :-) Also for $33k (the sticker of the acura), you can get a touring Z which has leather, powere heated seats, etc.

 

A chassis and engine designed soley around the Z would be great, but sharing parts and platforms with different models makes it profitable for nissan. That's just how it is.

 

Umm, thank you. And I was also comparing the Z to a mustang. Ok, it doesn't seem as refined compared to a Z4, a corvette, a lotus elise, a Mercedes, a viper, a porsche boxster, a porsche carrera and an S2000 which is still more expensive than most Z's and has a 4 cylinder 240 BHP engine. Compared to most cars that compare monetarily it is a very refined and good performing vehicle. I would hope that if I spent $50K on a Z4 that it would outperform a Z and for the difference in price I would rather have the Z and mod the **** out of it. Just my 2 cents.

 

The TL is lots of car for the money, but I don't think we should be comparing the driving dynamics of a front wheel drive sedan to a sports coupe. For those making the point that the Z handles better....well it damn better.

As for the interior, the Z is spartan by nature, and I'm pretty sure everyone wouldn't mind an improvement on this. The TLs interior and features trump that of the Z, but for it's market and competitors, it simply competes.

 

Note that out of the big 3 Japanese automobile manufacturers, Nissan is globally #2 and Honda is #3. Given that the VQ35 is used across much of the Nissan and Infiniti line as well as the FM platform, I think it is a good question where the money went.

 

If you can't find $30,000 in the Z DON'T YOU DARE look to where Porsche put $65,000 into the Boxster or Chevy did the same with the Corvette.