slay2k

I'm curious if you guys have ever spun your rear end out (fishtailed) while turning..

I decided to take VDC off tonight (perf model). Needless to say that in the middle of a left turn, either at the top of 1st (4-5k rpm) or beginning of 2nd, while the turn wasn't yet complete, my rear end spun out to the right... and I almost skid into oncoming traffic. Luckily I was able to correct it and stop before doing any serious damage.

Not a pleasant feeling, I assure you. But the reason I ask if you guys would have a similar result if you attempted to apply some gas in a turn is because I'd like to know if its the design of my car, or if all sports RWD cars have this property.

I feel insecure driving without VDC on.. it's almost like any turn that I may push too hard into might spin the tail out. It feels like the engine has too much power, and the wheels don't have enough grip. Now I do realize I have some real shitty factory tires (Potenza RE040) ... do you think replacing them with some Toyo Proxies or other good tires would help give more traction and minimize this problem ?

I almost get the feeling that the car is too light in the back, so that if there was another 100-200lbs in the back, tires wouldn't break traction during a turn with more gas... perhaps this is flawed.. what do you think ?

PS - it was about 48 degrees out, and the tires were around 35psi... so I don't think much would change if I warmed them up another 3-4 PSI prior to attempting the turn.

Any input would be helpful!

-slay

350z4steve

iTrader: (1)

Interesting comment..but I would say no to point about the car necessarily (since being rear wheel drive) has to much power in order to break the wheels loose alot of variables ( too numerous to list ex: slippery or slick road, driving over painted road surface, angle of car relative to horizon, poor traction on tires, limit slip not working as it should, popping the clutch near maximum torque, etc..) having the VDC is i am sure a great feature or maybe a protection of sorts or maybe to intrusive depending how you look at it. But I have gassed it around turns to without much problems.. I have no VDC in my Z and if you want to induce wheel spin indeed you can if you force the issue ..the main thing is have fun but be careful with it off.

D'oh

Pretty much any rear wheel drive car can oversteer if you are not careful with the throttle.

I had a spinout at Laguna Seca coming out of a turn and did a 720 or so before flying off the track into the gravel. Luckily I stopped 5-10 feet before the wall. I've fishtailed at autocrosses many times but have always been able to recover, even in the rain (have yet to hit a cone, so maybe I'm not pushing hard enough, hehe). I definitely need more practice controlling in a drift though. I always over correct and snap back, but at Laguna I snapped back and forth a couple times before finally compeletely spinning. Pretty freaky!!

-D'oh!

350xcloud

I own an enthusiast, and I don't have VDC. And I should have done more research before buying the damn car, didn't think VDC would make much difference.
Well I was going about 30-40 mph in the second gear, made a sharp left turn, then my rear wheel spun out, I did a 720 and then some. almost hit a damn wall, only a feet or two away. this was a week after I picked up the car.
So do you guys think that VDC does make a big difference? When it's on atleast. Because I like to do crazy turns sometimes.

Rob Nance

Naturally it's going to make a big difference, if you're driving at the limits and are not acclimated to that kind of driving (ie not familar with the feedback you need to interpret to keep the car tracking straight, etc).

Speaking of GT3, any other racing game fanatics? I'm 100% in GT1, GT2, GT3, Metropolis Street Racer, Project Gotham Racer, Rallisport Challenge, and just about any other true racing game that's come out in the past 15 years (including all the fast/future racers like all the Wipeout series, F-zero series, etc)

ttheisen93

I've got a base model, and have driven on snow without a problem with the original tires, so I've been wondering if VDC does something that makes the car LESS stable. Or maybe I'm just more aware of the limitations since I always drive manually, and therefore I'm not surprised by exceeding the limits of a system I don't have.

ares

iTrader: (2)

4-5k in 1st has enough power to break traction on a dry road in a straight line, no suprise it would drift the tail end.

all rwd cars drift there rear end, think of it this way, you have all your weight on one tire, and you have LSD, your also forcing the tire to hold you from sliding, now you want 287hp pushing the car foward on that tire. its gonna give. I had a 7000lbs pickup, it slid too, when I wanted it to.

get familiar with the car, dont give it full throttle, but it is possible to give it a fair amount of gas to accelerate, to the point where you can just barely feel the tail "floating" any more and itd be sliding. its easier to do in 2nd, less touchy, but it can be done in 1st too.

djkern

to ask the same question as was posted origonally.....do the Potenza S-03 Pole Position's make a hell of a difference when it comes to traction in dry weather? i hear everyone buying these tires...and i'm wondering if they do it for show or if they do it cause they are so great.

thanks,
djk

slay2k

Thanks for the replies.

Yeah VDC does make a huge difference... as soon as your rear end starts drifting it will apply the correct amount of braking to each wheel to stop it.

However, this is sorta cheating. While I do enjoy the safety this provides during day-to-day driving, I *should* be able to drive the car aggressively without VDC. This way, I will know the true limits and boundaries of my car, and enjoy it more without interruption from a computer.

Besides, launching the car with VDC on is impossible.

all_bark

iTrader: (5)

It has also happened to me.

It is kind of fun if you WANT to do it and are expecting it but if you are not it can be kind of scary.

I LOVE the power though!

Have fun, drive safe!

DmitryZ

I understand exactly what you mean. Besides the Z I have a 240sx. It is rwd, has summer tires, no abs and it is a lot lighter in the back than the Z. I also live in NJ so I was driving in that freezing rain/hail this morning. Guess which car I took to work – 240. What I am saying is that you will learn how to drive without VDC if you want to: you just have to start slow. When I first got my 240 I did the same exact thing you are talking about – wound up going sideways into oncoming traffic. Since then I have learned a lot more about my limit and the limits of my car. It doesn’t slide unless I want it to slide – whether it is for my amusement or to scare the living crap out of my passengers. The VDC is awesome but I am so comfortable with my old car that I did not take my Z to work despite VDC and weather. You have to remember to take it easy and not to get freaked out, any new car takes time to get used to.
Don't get me wrong -I will use VDC on day to day bases but I will still drive the car without it occasionaly - that *cheating* thing is bugging me as well.

Dmitry

digerydingo

It's funny to read this thread because 5 years ago when I first got my 240SX I used to be freaked out about sliding the tail, which it could still do in stock form at the top of the rev range in 1st and to a certain degree in 2nd. I'd seen drift videos and always beleived that the only way to properly control a drift was to tune these heavily modified machines built only for the purpose of drifting.

Now after 4 years of Karting and racing sliding the tail becomes second nature. In fact I find it's become more difficult to limit my sliding about, and not just power slide mind you but full on four wheel drift. It's funny, even after driving a Kart (actual competition 100-125cc Kart, not 4hp lawnmower) for just a few sessions, your ability to sense traction is off the scale. After a few wheeks behind the wheel of a Kart, a sports car feels like a truck and the breakaway feels like it takes years to happen.

I highly recomend Karting sessions or a Performance Driving School that teaches with a traction circle. Trust me you'll have 10 times the driving fun with VDC off and proper car controll, even in the rain!

sicktypes

can someone could make a video of their Z taking a sharp turn at a certain speed, once wit the VDC on, then wit it off...???....

zland

I must have the slowest 350Z on the planet. I wish I could get it to lose control. the thing stay together even in a sharp corner and me flooring it.

Jeff

Vlad

Formula-1 from EA. I drive best cars in the world after dinner. Top speeds over 300mph, and all driving phisics are true to the tiny bit. All assistants are off, just traction control which was allowed last year. Makes you drive REALLY SMOOTH. After I got into F1, I pretty much lost interest to any other racing games. Took me about four month to be able to finish USGP in Indy first. Since that was at 85% art.drivers intellect, I still have space for improvement

Jspec350z

iTrader: (3)

VDC takes the fun out of driving a rear wheel drive car. When you push it to hard in a corner the back end slides out!! Fish tailing or drifting whatever you want to call it!! FUN AS HELL!! Just know how to control it! VDC is great but it sure takes the fun out of beating the hell out of your car!!

WashUJon

You also have much bigger Toyo T1 tires. I'm sure that makes a HUGE difference over the smaller stock RE040s.

alex30327

I can spin my back end out easily with the VDC off. I always drive with it on though. In fact, I can even pull my back end out with the VDC on, the car then corrects itself quite nicely.

slay2k

At the recommendation of the friendly folks at bimmerforums.com, I just got 2 books - "Speed Secrets", "Secrets of Solo Racing", and I also have "Going Faster" on order from Amazon.

Can't wait to absorb all that info