paZtoy

Posted this question before only got 1 response

Thanks VQRacer

It looks like Nissan has changed the wheel size for the 18" rims to 8" front and back.

Author: ZISME (---.nissan-usa.com)
Date: Jul 12, 9:21pm

For the Touring 6MT that is correct. This was late info that came after the final spec piece was produced.

My question for those "in the know" is will this effect handeling for better or worse. I think they are still planning on using the same size tires.Does'nt this effect all preformance models as well??

Should I be concerned

droideka

Well, it certainly looks true from nissandriven.com site...

I can understand the benefit for most Touring owners being able to rotate the tires, but I wanted the staggered set-up AND I wanted the 245s in the rear. It'd be nice if they'd allow us to make the decision for ourselves.

EDIT: I took the liberty of creating a new thread that points to this one so that we might get some answers on how this will affect handling if at all.

BrianZ

What's the benefit of a staggered setup?

Boomer

The issue is oversteer/understeer for me with rear wheel drive cars; others may disagree. I owned a 91 MR2Turbo with a staggered setup.

The front wheels were 6"wide w/195/60/14 tires;
and the rear wheels were 7"wide w/205/60/14 tires. The weight distribution of the car was 43/57% f/r.

The wheels and tires in the back were larger to reduce oversteer;ie. you are going too fast into the corner and as the rear wheel car travels through the turn the rear of the car begins to turn too far and it may cause a spin, or as the mark I mr2 owners found a condition dubbed "snap overstreer". Bad, you end up facing the direction you came in with on-coming? traffic heading your way and you are a sitting duck, or you spin completely off the road and hit an object nearby with great force. Example: Early Porsches had a lot of oversteer tendencies; always going off the road backwards or worse.

Most rear wheel drive cars are set up for mild understeer, instead of the rear wheels exiting the road(sliding off) the front wheels begin to slide and the driver can let up on the accelerator and the car will straighten itself and exit the turn safely.

With this in mind, the Track model's staggered setup with larger wheels and tires in the back reduce oversteer and promote mild understeer or"push" as the race dricers say. By going to a non-staggered setup, understeer is decreased and the car will handle more neutrally, without understeer or oversteer.

Why the change to the Touring 6spd? I read 1 or maybe 2 road tests where the car was critisized for having too much understeer and the front wheels were sliding, which can be considered a handling flaw in a sports car. The only problem I have with that is, they were testing Track, not Touring models.

Moderators, you need to find out from Nissan if this is indeed the case. If not, another explanation needs to be posted.

Guys, in reading your posts, I am confused by the furor, and what has actually been done. Has Nissan changed both the wheels and tires on the Touring 6spd? One of the posts said wheels, it did not mention tires. Please clarify that first.

Next, the Touring model on NissanDriven has always, since Feb, listed the Touring 6spd with 225/45/18 tires. I just went back to the preorder page and it is listed exactly the same as before(I have been to the page often to drool over my Touring) , 225/45/18s. If this still holds, then having the same size wheel and tire will reduce understeer and produce a more neutral handling response, nothing to worry about

If you wanted 245/45/18 tires, you should have opted for the Performance or Track model; if you want to drag race, then larger tires on the back makes some sense, normally sports cars are not drag racers unless you wish to de-emphasize the Z's road handling. The bigger tire size you go to on the back, the more the car will understeer. I don't think this is a significant issue. I am getting the Touring Model with AT and staggered wheels and tires. My AT will understeer more than your MT6spd. I don't see any safety issues here unless you drive like a maniac and deliberately try to provoke oversteer that you can't handle.

Boomer--I told you I hated being the voice of reason, er unreason, etc. Give it a shot on clarification and then you can shoot at me. NOT! JmanZ will be back tomorrow. Nite, all.

droideka

Wrong, Boomer. Wrong. Two pieces of printed material will back up my claim that this is NOT the way it has always been.

1. Your pre-order brochure (the one with the paint chips) states that the 6MT Touring gets the 18" wheel package from the Performance model.

2. The pre-order packet and printed cards state that the 6-spoke alloy wheels are 18"x7.5"/18"x8" shod with 225/45/18 and 245/45/18.

When I ordered the 6MT I was under the impression that I was getting the staggered set-up with the larger tires in the rear.


I take it this quote comes from zcar.com. It appears that Nissan JUST CHANGED this spec on the Touring 6MT.

paZtoy

this would indicate to me that the chang effects both the touring andperformance models.Wheels


Wheels
Aluminum Alloy (7-spoke) FR: 17”x7.5” RR: 17”x8
Aluminum Alloy (6-spoke) FR 18”x8” RR: 18”x8”
Super light Aluminum Alloy (6-spoke) FR: 18”x8” RR: 18”x8.5”

only 3 sizes listed.

If you look at the updated doc. it indicates that both are effected not just the Touring model.

Although it does appear thet the tire size will remain the same.
Icant tell if the offset of the rim itself is different or not.

ITZBITZ

The 2001 Spyder has 185/55-15 up front and 205/50-15 in the back. Why you ask? Well, it has a rear weight bias, makes sense to put more rubber in the back, right?

Well, it's mostly to try and force understeer instead of oversteer while keeping tire pressures at reasonable levels. In fact, I'm supposed to run 26 psi front and 32 psi rear. When I do this, the car handles like total crap, oversteering like crazy. What works for me is 28 psi front and 30 psi rear. Why? Hell, I don't know.

Okay, now I'm just babbling. They want larger tires on the rear because all the other cars have them on the rear and it just makes sense, right? The vette, supra, they all have PHAT rear tires and I don't want no skinny rails on my sweet ride!

In theory, it's to account for the lighter rear end and the fact that it supposed to provide traction during hard launches and when cornering.

I say, wait and see how the stock setup works for you, and then make your adjustments based on that information. If it pushes too much, go with same size wheels/tires front and back and then work with air pressures to even it up.

SunsetZ

On another thread on this subject, it says the only change for the Touring 6-speed is 8" width on the front and back and nothing about changing the tires, Nissandriven, build your Z still shows the 245's in the rear, where does it say it is now 225 in the rear of the touring 6-speeds??

nizl

Man, that's weird.

Is it just me or does this change not seem to make any sense considering it's only to the Touring 6MT according to ZISME?

paZtoy

I posted the original question to ZISME in response to an existing thread on ZCAR.com so I was only asking about the change to the touring model. But since the touring 6/mt and the perfornmance have the same packages one would think that that the change aplies to BOTH.

ZISME

The question referred to Touring and it was answered that way. The only change and it is reflected on the correction that was posted for me by JMANZ was to the wheel size in front going from 18" x 7.5" to 18" x 8". This is applicable to both Performance model and Touring 6MT. Has no affect on the tire size that was listed 225/45R18 91W front and 245/45R18 96W rear.

goofyZ

thank you ZISME for clarifing this.
I am so happy. It was bumming me out to have smaller tires then the other models. (I know it didn't make alot of sense to do it that way but.....)

Boomer

Thanks, ZISME, and you other guys/gals for the clarification. I completely misread the preorder site because I couldn't find a reference to 245/45/18" tires with the Touring model.

It still is a question of oversteer/understeer to me. If you increase the diameter of wheels or tires on the front of a rear wheel drive car, you will reduce understeer. Not by a lot, but it doesn't take much.

I think it is a good move by Nissan to provide drivers of the Touring MTs a little more freedom to test their car's limits. I assume the change is in response to some Touring owners grumbling about having a less sporty setup than the ATs. I think they have a good case, and as an AT orderer, I am not bothered at all. I don't know how many of you owners out there would have preferred leather over cloth seats, but I wouldn't buy any model without them. I got used to them with previous cars and the heated seats, etal. sold me on the Touring. I plan to travel, not race.

BY the way, the staggered setup on my 91 MR2T rec'd 29psi in the front and 31psi in the rear. It worked fine until the original Brdg. RE71s wore out and I installed Tokiko 5way/adjustables and
different tires. My best highway setup was 29 lbs & 3 setting on the front shocks and 33 lbs & 4 setting on the rear shocks to preserve my kidneys on long trips(I drove at leasr 12-1500 miles a month for 23 years) on my job. I don't think there will be a Big difference in the handling on 17s, 18s and 18 Rays, but it will be noticeable. Upgrades anyone?

Boomer babble
BR/FR/AT

EnthuZ

iTrader: (2)

My $.02

Widening the rims while keeping the tire siZe the same, effectively stiffens the sidewall. Improved "Turn-In" into corners, and less understeer. Both sound good to me.

Forget the steering wheel, I got a right foot!