Does the resale value of these cars make anyone else sick?
08-18-2003, 06:43 PM
#21
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I'm thinking the G35c will probably have a higher resale value. There are fewer off them and they have the "Label". They also have a back seat, and a longer warranty that would make them easier to sell. But you will almost always lose if you try to sell before even a year. It took me 3 years to break even on my 2000 Eclipse GT. I owed 10k and got 10k on the trade in. Now Mitsu did a good job saturating the market with that car. I'm sure with the introduction of the RX-8, Z sales will fall. So don't worry.
08-18-2003, 06:50 PM
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Originally posted by 350zroadster
don't the car lose 10% of it's value the moment you drive it off the lot? That's like $3k.
Also, try finding a 1 year old 2 seater sports car that makes 287hp and 274 lb-ft and looks great for less than $30k. I can't think of any possibilities.
don't the car lose 10% of it's value the moment you drive it off the lot? That's like $3k.
Also, try finding a 1 year old 2 seater sports car that makes 287hp and 274 lb-ft and looks great for less than $30k. I can't think of any possibilities.
i think its more like 30%
08-18-2003, 06:57 PM
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You have to wait untill there is no more sales on the 350. I think the same thing is going to happen like the 300zx. they were around for a couple of years then gone. usually Z's are keepers
08-18-2003, 07:07 PM
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Ok, lets do it. You have to compare percentage decreases though. I'll be the toyota's precent decrease in value is less than the Z's.
Originally posted by Subbacultcha
think about it: just about ALL cars do that. that's why there's such a thing called Gap Insurance.
how about this: you take a 2003 Z and 2003 Toyota Celica. 5 years from now, let's guess which one has held more value? my money would be on the Z.
think about it: just about ALL cars do that. that's why there's such a thing called Gap Insurance.
how about this: you take a 2003 Z and 2003 Toyota Celica. 5 years from now, let's guess which one has held more value? my money would be on the Z.
08-18-2003, 07:30 PM
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A car is not any investment. With all due respect, your expectations are a little warped.
If you went into the deal only expecting to keep the car less than two years, you should have leased. Any car, including “twin turbo supra and twin turbo RX7”, is going to lose value.
You should have bought a used Z.
My advice? Invest in tax-free annuities, not cars.
Drive & enjoy your Z. 95% of the people in this country can’t even afford a Z. You’re a fortunate man to be able to own a Z. I know I’m very thankful to own one.
There are more serious things in life to be upset about.
Peace.
If you went into the deal only expecting to keep the car less than two years, you should have leased. Any car, including “twin turbo supra and twin turbo RX7”, is going to lose value.
You should have bought a used Z.
My advice? Invest in tax-free annuities, not cars.
Drive & enjoy your Z. 95% of the people in this country can’t even afford a Z. You’re a fortunate man to be able to own a Z. I know I’m very thankful to own one.
There are more serious things in life to be upset about.
Peace.
08-18-2003, 07:39 PM
#26
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Originally posted by marhot
A car is not any investment. With all due respect, your expectations are a little warped.
If you went into the deal only expecting to keep the car less than two years, you should have leased. Any car, including “twin turbo supra and twin turbo RX7”, is going to lose value.
You should have bought a used Z.
My advice? Invest in tax-free annuities, not cars.
Drive & enjoy your Z. 95% of the people in this country can’t even afford a Z. You’re a fortunate man to be able to own a Z. I know I’m very thankful to own one.
There are more serious things in life to be upset about.
Peace.
A car is not any investment. With all due respect, your expectations are a little warped.
If you went into the deal only expecting to keep the car less than two years, you should have leased. Any car, including “twin turbo supra and twin turbo RX7”, is going to lose value.
You should have bought a used Z.
My advice? Invest in tax-free annuities, not cars.
Drive & enjoy your Z. 95% of the people in this country can’t even afford a Z. You’re a fortunate man to be able to own a Z. I know I’m very thankful to own one.
There are more serious things in life to be upset about.
Peace.
08-18-2003, 08:11 PM
#28
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This is hardly a phenomenon exclusive to the Z. Do some research on kbb.com or edmunds.com and compare new car prices versus the same models that are a year old. And don't forget to look at the ridiculous difference between the "retail" used car prices and the "trade-in" values. It's disgusting.
The business model of selling cars has changed over the last twenty years. Back then, dealers would make their money selling new cars. This worked out well until the public got smart enough about invoices and holdbacks and whittled down dealer profits so that they weren't making $3000-$4000 on sales of new vehicles. The gravy train has now shifted to used cars. Talk to any salesman who will be honest about it. I have discussed this fact with several guys at different dealerships. They unanimously state that they would rather sell one used car than ten new ones. The dealers have created this artificial gap between the "trade-in" and "retail" values of used cars to boost their profits back up. And this ties in well with the growth of leasing over the last twenty years, as they have a continuously fresh pool of money makers on the lot. Notice how much leases are pushed now versus back then. They want you to lease...not only do they get a tidy little profit from you up front, but then they get the real jackpot in three years when they sell the car at "retail" used value, which happens to be the same $3000-$4000 over what ithe car is worth on the wholesale or trade-in market. I haven't researched it in depth, but I'm positive if I check the "blue books" from twenty years ago, there will not be this huge built-in profit in the used car market. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if twenty years ago there was no such thing as "trade-in' value vs. "retail" value. The car was worth what the car was worth.
I know this doesn't help your situation, and it sucks the spot you're in. You just may have to plan more carefully in the future with regards to your expected length of ownership and lease vs. buy options. You will always be in trouble trying to unload any nearly new car, unless you put down a he11 of a lot of money on it.
As far as some of your other comments about the Z being a pseudo sports car and the fact that they are selling well is ruining the ownership experience for you, I find these statements absurd, and bearing little resemblence to reality. If you bought the car and subsequently decided you don't like it, then fine...that's no justification to trash the car and/or it's owners and spout falsehoods about it losing it's value faster than other cars.
The business model of selling cars has changed over the last twenty years. Back then, dealers would make their money selling new cars. This worked out well until the public got smart enough about invoices and holdbacks and whittled down dealer profits so that they weren't making $3000-$4000 on sales of new vehicles. The gravy train has now shifted to used cars. Talk to any salesman who will be honest about it. I have discussed this fact with several guys at different dealerships. They unanimously state that they would rather sell one used car than ten new ones. The dealers have created this artificial gap between the "trade-in" and "retail" values of used cars to boost their profits back up. And this ties in well with the growth of leasing over the last twenty years, as they have a continuously fresh pool of money makers on the lot. Notice how much leases are pushed now versus back then. They want you to lease...not only do they get a tidy little profit from you up front, but then they get the real jackpot in three years when they sell the car at "retail" used value, which happens to be the same $3000-$4000 over what ithe car is worth on the wholesale or trade-in market. I haven't researched it in depth, but I'm positive if I check the "blue books" from twenty years ago, there will not be this huge built-in profit in the used car market. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if twenty years ago there was no such thing as "trade-in' value vs. "retail" value. The car was worth what the car was worth.
I know this doesn't help your situation, and it sucks the spot you're in. You just may have to plan more carefully in the future with regards to your expected length of ownership and lease vs. buy options. You will always be in trouble trying to unload any nearly new car, unless you put down a he11 of a lot of money on it.
As far as some of your other comments about the Z being a pseudo sports car and the fact that they are selling well is ruining the ownership experience for you, I find these statements absurd, and bearing little resemblence to reality. If you bought the car and subsequently decided you don't like it, then fine...that's no justification to trash the car and/or it's owners and spout falsehoods about it losing it's value faster than other cars.
Last edited by tbcz; 08-18-2003 at 08:24 PM.
08-18-2003, 08:59 PM
#29
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To wit:
From Kelley Blue Book (www.kbb.com)...following are the numbers for four cars I picked at random. The Z has no info yet available on used car prices. First column is MSRP for a brand new 2003 model. Second column is "trade-in" value for an identically equipped 2002 model with 12,000 miles. Third column is "retail" value for the same 2002 model from the second column (with 12,000 miles of course). I found this very enlightening.
..............................'03 MSRP....'02 trade....'02 retail
BMW 325i...............$28,495.....$23,500.....$27,930
Porsche Boxster.....$43,365.....$29,925.....$36,225
Chevy Corvette......$44,435.....$28,650.....$36,140
Toyota Camry.........$22,745.....$14,675.....$16,715
I know there are variables in here that make this approximate (different standard options between model years being one), but I think the trend is pretty clear, especially when comparing the difference between the "trade-in" and "retail" values for the identical 2002 models in the second and third columns.
From Kelley Blue Book (www.kbb.com)...following are the numbers for four cars I picked at random. The Z has no info yet available on used car prices. First column is MSRP for a brand new 2003 model. Second column is "trade-in" value for an identically equipped 2002 model with 12,000 miles. Third column is "retail" value for the same 2002 model from the second column (with 12,000 miles of course). I found this very enlightening.
..............................'03 MSRP....'02 trade....'02 retail
BMW 325i...............$28,495.....$23,500.....$27,930
Porsche Boxster.....$43,365.....$29,925.....$36,225
Chevy Corvette......$44,435.....$28,650.....$36,140
Toyota Camry.........$22,745.....$14,675.....$16,715
I know there are variables in here that make this approximate (different standard options between model years being one), but I think the trend is pretty clear, especially when comparing the difference between the "trade-in" and "retail" values for the identical 2002 models in the second and third columns.
Last edited by tbcz; 08-18-2003 at 09:02 PM.
08-18-2003, 09:19 PM
#30
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The Supra and RX-7 are bad examples to compare with. These are cars that have achieve cult status but was never the mainstream. For the same money, many would prefer to get a Camaro or Mustang. Not many are sold and they are going to be rare, hence the low drop in price.
On the other hand, the Z isn't going to be sold out or rotting on the lot. They sell over 30,000 of these which is a respectable number but not excessive. Dealers still charge above MSRP and trying to tack on markups on the roadster right now. At the same time, you have to remember these are impractical 2 seaters that not many would buy. Which also is why no one is interested in your used Z.
On the plus side, many parts are interchangeable and would save you money in the long run. You would have more trouble looking for a Supra engine than a VQ35DE.
On the other hand, the Z isn't going to be sold out or rotting on the lot. They sell over 30,000 of these which is a respectable number but not excessive. Dealers still charge above MSRP and trying to tack on markups on the roadster right now. At the same time, you have to remember these are impractical 2 seaters that not many would buy. Which also is why no one is interested in your used Z.
On the plus side, many parts are interchangeable and would save you money in the long run. You would have more trouble looking for a Supra engine than a VQ35DE.
08-18-2003, 09:55 PM
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I must say the U.S has too many valiants of the same car and nobody will buy a used Z track with leather if they can get the same car without the leather and brembo brakes for the same price.
At least in Australia Nissan just released the track and touring only. So you just don't get to choose. Either you want the Z or you don't.
I'm still happy to say i rarely see one on the roads
.
In fact when we see each other we tend to flash our lights and honk...lol... sad really!
That helps
At least in Australia Nissan just released the track and touring only. So you just don't get to choose. Either you want the Z or you don't.
I'm still happy to say i rarely see one on the roads
.In fact when we see each other we tend to flash our lights and honk...lol... sad really!
That helps
08-19-2003, 12:37 AM
#33
Originally posted by Montez
I wouldnt go as far as to say 95% cant afford it is a bit on the high side. Most cars I see everyday probably cost more than my z like these Expeditions,Yukons,F350's and F250's and its tons of them.
I wouldnt go as far as to say 95% cant afford it is a bit on the high side. Most cars I see everyday probably cost more than my z like these Expeditions,Yukons,F350's and F250's and its tons of them.
Granted, theres alot of people who like trucks just for their styling... I know folks who need their F350 for work...or they need their Expedition to truck their kids around. Some of these same people paid more for these trucks but many of them wished they had the oppurtunity cost to have some recreation in a vehicle that is almost as practical as a motorcycle.
I'm sure many of us on these forums would love to be on a Yamaha R1...or whatever superbike... most of us have the money for it because they're cheaper than our Z's but given the praticality, dangers, and function of such a recreational vehicle, we can't "afford" it.
08-19-2003, 01:03 AM
#34
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Did you buy your Z with the intention of selling it. Owning is a Z is about style and performance. Of course you could have gotten a M3 or Porsche, but are they really worth 10-20k more.
08-19-2003, 01:12 AM
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If it means anything, Nissan have had 800 or so 350Z's to sell this year when they are released in the UK and they have all been pre-ordered. If I wanted to buy a 350Z in England right now I wouldn't get it till about Christmas time next year I have been told...the residuals over here are supposed to be good on them.
08-19-2003, 05:44 AM
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Sad thing is you are probably exactly right.
Originally posted by bk_r0x
I love their resale value. Means I'll be able to pick up a 2003 in 2006 for $15k! Hahaha
I love their resale value. Means I'll be able to pick up a 2003 in 2006 for $15k! Hahaha
08-19-2003, 07:50 AM
#38
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hmm... I never considered resale value on the Z. I knew this is the car I wanted and have never regretted the purchase. No plans to sell it anytime soon so what do I care what the resale value is!
08-19-2003, 09:18 AM
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Why did you buy the car anyway if you are going to turn around and sell it? I am not even thinking about selling mine, I just have to keep her away from my husband long enough for me to enjoy her.
As far the resale value, my husband is having that trouble with his maxima, he wont get anything near what the car is worth or what he paid for it so its not just the Z its all vehicles.
Melissa
As far the resale value, my husband is having that trouble with his maxima, he wont get anything near what the car is worth or what he paid for it so its not just the Z its all vehicles.
Melissa
08-19-2003, 09:25 AM
#40
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Did you really planned to make money on reselling the car? It doesn't work pretty much with any car... And if you go to the dealer... you better be able to control yourself.
Last time I checked with Mercedes dealer they offered me a good deal of $9000 for 5 y.o. ML320. I'm pretty sure they'd simply double that price selling it as "certified". They just use to having huge margins and stupid customers I guess. Don't sell if you don't like the offer.
Last time I checked with Mercedes dealer they offered me a good deal of $9000 for 5 y.o. ML320. I'm pretty sure they'd simply double that price selling it as "certified". They just use to having huge margins and stupid customers I guess. Don't sell if you don't like the offer.