diminished value on 2003 350z
12-02-2008, 02:27 PM
#1
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diminished value on 2003 350z
Unfortunately I got rear ended on Thanksgiving day. The bumper cover, support as well as the trunk pan, and right rear quarter panel were all damaged. There is a little frame damage that will need to be repaired as well. Here is my question.
1. How is this going to be presented in any future carfax reports if I choose to sell the car?
2. How is this reporting going to decrease the value of my car.
3. What amount do you think is a good amount to ask for diminished value reimbursement?
My car is 2003 350Z Touring with 48k miles. Before this the car was pretty much spotless except for the usual bug, and rock chips in the front bumper and leading edge of the hood.
1. How is this going to be presented in any future carfax reports if I choose to sell the car?
2. How is this reporting going to decrease the value of my car.
3. What amount do you think is a good amount to ask for diminished value reimbursement?
My car is 2003 350Z Touring with 48k miles. Before this the car was pretty much spotless except for the usual bug, and rock chips in the front bumper and leading edge of the hood.
12-02-2008, 02:41 PM
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Texas Supreme Court rules against diminished value.
Reference: http://connection.ebscohost.com/cont...DB27A4E.ehctc1
Reference: http://connection.ebscohost.com/cont...DB27A4E.ehctc1
12-02-2008, 02:46 PM
#4
Original owner? Not bad on mileage for a five year old car. As far as decrease in value, more than likely the shop that performs work on a damaged car will record it and when you carfax it, it will show up that the car was in an accident. If you want to trade it in, dealers will run a carfax and if they see history like that they will give you less value on the car. If it is a private party sale, most times people don't ask for a carfax, so it won't hurt you in that area as much unless they ask. If they do ask, that's when the doors to haggle with pricing is more in the buyers favor.
12-02-2008, 05:55 PM
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I don't know about the CARFAX angle, but several studies done by the insurance industry determined that if the car is repaired properly by a qualified shop.......it has lost no value.
Do body shops routinely file CARFAX reports? It is my understanding that the only thing that shows on a CARFAX report is what is entered on the system. It doesn't know your car has been in a wreck unless someone inputs the info into a database.
Do body shops routinely file CARFAX reports? It is my understanding that the only thing that shows on a CARFAX report is what is entered on the system. It doesn't know your car has been in a wreck unless someone inputs the info into a database.
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12-02-2008, 06:40 PM
#8
Mine got hit in the same spot. Damaged didn't seem bad as I wasn't hit hard, but it turned out to be 7K plus. Its a shame as my car is in better shape at 73K miles than many half as old. I'm in the same boat as you, not sure how it will effect the value.
12-03-2008, 03:20 AM
#9
Carfax is updated with an insurance claim. Your car in good condition in a private sale is worth (per KBB):
Condition Value
Good
$14,750
Fair
$13,700
I don't think any insurance company pays for diminished value....Didn't have time to read David's reference.
Condition Value
Good
$14,750
Fair
$13,700
I don't think any insurance company pays for diminished value....Didn't have time to read David's reference.
12-03-2008, 11:57 AM
#12
Diminished value is a tricky subject. States go back on forth on whether or not it is a legitimate claim. I do not believe it is legitimate and I'll list a few scenarios and explain.
If your car is damaged, either A) it is totaled as the damage is beyond repair and you get paid the full value of the car or B) the vehicle is fixed to the same standard the manufacturer would use and is returned to the same condition it was before the accident. Therefore you have been justly compensated in either case and there is no diminished value claim as the car is the same as it was before or is totaled and out of your hands and you have been paid for its entire value.
Now some will argue "but it's been in an accident and is automatically worth less because there is always some lingering damage". Well then your shop didn't repair it right. A good shop can do most anything to a car and make it perfect. Have you seen restoration jobs on cars that start out as a rusted out shell? Are you telling me those cars aren't perfect and same as factory, or better, when done? Any good body shop can fix bent parts and if the frame really is damaged well then the car is totaled anyway and you don't have to worry about it.
The only way for diminished value to be a valid claim is if your car is damaged and you decide NOT to repair it. In this case you could make a claim for diminished value of the vehicle since it was in perfect shape before, and after it is not. You could take the previous value, minus the value you could presently sell it for, and take the difference as diminished value. This probably isn't the best choice but if your car is old and you don't care anyway and don't mind driving it messed up this could be an OK choice to put a little money in your pocket.
You shouldn't be able to have your car repaired AND receive diminished value, this would be double indemnity. The purpose of insurance is to put you back in the same place you were before, no better and no worse. If you get your car put back in the same state AND receive money on top of that then you have come out ahead on the deal which is against the entire purpose of spreading risk throughout everyone in society.
If your car is damaged, either A) it is totaled as the damage is beyond repair and you get paid the full value of the car or B) the vehicle is fixed to the same standard the manufacturer would use and is returned to the same condition it was before the accident. Therefore you have been justly compensated in either case and there is no diminished value claim as the car is the same as it was before or is totaled and out of your hands and you have been paid for its entire value.
Now some will argue "but it's been in an accident and is automatically worth less because there is always some lingering damage". Well then your shop didn't repair it right. A good shop can do most anything to a car and make it perfect. Have you seen restoration jobs on cars that start out as a rusted out shell? Are you telling me those cars aren't perfect and same as factory, or better, when done? Any good body shop can fix bent parts and if the frame really is damaged well then the car is totaled anyway and you don't have to worry about it.
The only way for diminished value to be a valid claim is if your car is damaged and you decide NOT to repair it. In this case you could make a claim for diminished value of the vehicle since it was in perfect shape before, and after it is not. You could take the previous value, minus the value you could presently sell it for, and take the difference as diminished value. This probably isn't the best choice but if your car is old and you don't care anyway and don't mind driving it messed up this could be an OK choice to put a little money in your pocket.
You shouldn't be able to have your car repaired AND receive diminished value, this would be double indemnity. The purpose of insurance is to put you back in the same place you were before, no better and no worse. If you get your car put back in the same state AND receive money on top of that then you have come out ahead on the deal which is against the entire purpose of spreading risk throughout everyone in society.
12-03-2008, 04:01 PM
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two problems with your argument:
1. you can never make it as good as factory, sure it may look perfect but unless everything that was damages was replaced with new parts it not the same: for example when you pull a dent out it makes the metal more brittle and more likely to bend if you hit it again.
2. even if you do make it so it is as good as from the factory it has less perceived value to at least some buyers so even though it is just as good, some people wont want to risk buying it in case it wasn't repaired perfectly. Fewer people willing to buy means less demand which means lower price.
1. you can never make it as good as factory, sure it may look perfect but unless everything that was damages was replaced with new parts it not the same: for example when you pull a dent out it makes the metal more brittle and more likely to bend if you hit it again.
2. even if you do make it so it is as good as from the factory it has less perceived value to at least some buyers so even though it is just as good, some people wont want to risk buying it in case it wasn't repaired perfectly. Fewer people willing to buy means less demand which means lower price.
12-03-2008, 07:06 PM
#14
Those aren't problems with my argument. From my point of view my argument has no problems, just like from your point of view your argument has no problems. (1) is a problem with a subpar repair job which I clearly stated is unacceptable. A true repair job puts it back in the same condition. And pulling a dent doesn't really make the metal more brittle. (2) is a problem with peoples perceptions. I have never not considered a vehicle simply because at some point it had been in an accident. How many people have minor accidents that show up on carfax, a lot. Just because a fender was replaced doesn't mean the car is junk or worth less.
Once again, the purpose of insurance is to put you in the same position as you were before. So if you have a car repaired to same as new condition AND receive money in your pocket you came out ahead and everyone in society who has insurance just paid to make you better off than you were before and everyones insurance rates increase because you were paid for something outside the scope of the original insuring agreement that you paid for.
Like I said, everyone and every state has their own view on what is right or not. However, only 3 states actually have statute or common law requiring insurance companies pay their insureds diminished value claims (1st party); Kansas, Georgia, and North Carolina. A few others states allow it in some cases on a 3rd party basis but not 1st party.
The attitude that people should get more compensation than their actual damages add up to is part of the reason we pay high insurance premiums. It's good for the economy though since it redistributes money from reasonable, responsible, moral people to those who feel everyone else owes them something for nothing
Once again, the purpose of insurance is to put you in the same position as you were before. So if you have a car repaired to same as new condition AND receive money in your pocket you came out ahead and everyone in society who has insurance just paid to make you better off than you were before and everyones insurance rates increase because you were paid for something outside the scope of the original insuring agreement that you paid for.
Like I said, everyone and every state has their own view on what is right or not. However, only 3 states actually have statute or common law requiring insurance companies pay their insureds diminished value claims (1st party); Kansas, Georgia, and North Carolina. A few others states allow it in some cases on a 3rd party basis but not 1st party.
The attitude that people should get more compensation than their actual damages add up to is part of the reason we pay high insurance premiums. It's good for the economy though since it redistributes money from reasonable, responsible, moral people to those who feel everyone else owes them something for nothing
12-03-2008, 07:14 PM
#16
Attached is a fairly decent article on diminished value that may help the OP or others interested in diminished value.
http://www.insure.com/articles/carin...car-value.html
http://www.insure.com/articles/carin...car-value.html
01-27-2009, 07:51 PM
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I have to say that you are NOT in the same position as you were before. After your car has been in an accident you are left with a vehicle that is worth less than before. It may have been repaired to like new condition but you are left holding a car that has diminished value.
So it kind of sucks, but its not priced into policies currently. I guess what we need is an option on policies to cover diminished value. But I think it should only be paid when you sell the car, that way you don't get money in your pocket every accident...just at the end, when you realize the lost value.
Once again, the purpose of insurance is to put you in the same position as you were before. So if you have a car repaired to same as new condition AND receive money in your pocket you came out ahead and everyone in society who has insurance just paid to make you better off than you were before and everyones insurance rates increase because you were paid for something outside the scope of the original insuring agreement that you paid for.
So it kind of sucks, but its not priced into policies currently. I guess what we need is an option on policies to cover diminished value. But I think it should only be paid when you sell the car, that way you don't get money in your pocket every accident...just at the end, when you realize the lost value.
Once again, the purpose of insurance is to put you in the same position as you were before. So if you have a car repaired to same as new condition AND receive money in your pocket you came out ahead and everyone in society who has insurance just paid to make you better off than you were before and everyones insurance rates increase because you were paid for something outside the scope of the original insuring agreement that you paid for.
01-28-2009, 11:05 AM
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I'm guessing a rear ended accident would affect the resale value by what others have quoted, around 10-15%. It's a good thing your insurance company got your back though. Depending on the condition of the car, I'd recommend asking for an appraisal both before and after the repair work is done, and then asking for the difference between those amounts. At the very least, you'll have some good backup when you ask your insurance company for reimbursement. I wish my company could offer a similar plan like that.
(Although not nearly as drastic, I also have a couple of minor cosmetic dings caused by some vandal bizneeyatch in a mall parking lot the other day: a small 3-inch key mark on my rear bumper, a few small paint chips in the rear quarter panel, and a very small dent in the right front fender. All of the above are not too visible unless closely examined, but considering I'm trying to sell my car, I'm more than a little irked about it as well and am in a similar situation looking to get reimbursed or at least get a good resale appraisal.)
EDIT: Or you could have it totaled if the frame was damaged or if the damage was very extensive. I've heard of a lot of people filing cars as totaled that could still be repaired to original condition, because the effort and time to repair the car simply weren't worth it considering the diminished value and the company never even offered a reimbursement for lower value, only for repair costs. Or maybe they decided the insurance reimbursement for a totaled car would be much higher than any future resale value the diminished car would have later on, not exactly sure. Explore your options, and hope it all works out.
(Although not nearly as drastic, I also have a couple of minor cosmetic dings caused by some vandal bizneeyatch in a mall parking lot the other day: a small 3-inch key mark on my rear bumper, a few small paint chips in the rear quarter panel, and a very small dent in the right front fender. All of the above are not too visible unless closely examined, but considering I'm trying to sell my car, I'm more than a little irked about it as well and am in a similar situation looking to get reimbursed or at least get a good resale appraisal.)
EDIT: Or you could have it totaled if the frame was damaged or if the damage was very extensive. I've heard of a lot of people filing cars as totaled that could still be repaired to original condition, because the effort and time to repair the car simply weren't worth it considering the diminished value and the company never even offered a reimbursement for lower value, only for repair costs. Or maybe they decided the insurance reimbursement for a totaled car would be much higher than any future resale value the diminished car would have later on, not exactly sure. Explore your options, and hope it all works out.
Last edited by BlueZ Brother; 01-28-2009 at 11:13 AM.
