How to fight improper colored light ticket?
10-07-2003, 07:36 AM
#21
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Originally posted by ares
yup sorry man, no way outa that, I thought maybe you were talking about the parking light which is supposed to be white(tho of course bulbs are yellow white) and you put a white LED.
but that is sposed to be amber, no other color but amber.
sorry, no way outa that unless its a fix it ticket, then you could fix it, and then put it back after they ok it.
but nope now you just gotta pay for it.
yup sorry man, no way outa that, I thought maybe you were talking about the parking light which is supposed to be white(tho of course bulbs are yellow white) and you put a white LED.
but that is sposed to be amber, no other color but amber.
sorry, no way outa that unless its a fix it ticket, then you could fix it, and then put it back after they ok it.
but nope now you just gotta pay for it.
10-07-2003, 07:38 AM
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Here we go with the cop bashing.
The point is simple, HE BROKE THE LAW, end of story. I will admit that certain towns (smaller ones) have nothing better to do than to pull people over for that type of incident.
But those lights could resemble an emergency vehicle, HENCE possibly causing an accident.
If you have a problem with the cops in your town, SPEEDING, CUTTING you off, then do something about it, and make a formal complaint.
I am not here to defend any cops out there, I am just stating the guy broke the law and that that vehicle could possibly cause an accident, hence why THE BLUE LIGHTS ARE ILLEGAL!
Lets not make this a cop bashing forum.
The point is simple, HE BROKE THE LAW, end of story. I will admit that certain towns (smaller ones) have nothing better to do than to pull people over for that type of incident.
But those lights could resemble an emergency vehicle, HENCE possibly causing an accident.
If you have a problem with the cops in your town, SPEEDING, CUTTING you off, then do something about it, and make a formal complaint.
I am not here to defend any cops out there, I am just stating the guy broke the law and that that vehicle could possibly cause an accident, hence why THE BLUE LIGHTS ARE ILLEGAL!
Lets not make this a cop bashing forum.
10-07-2003, 07:40 AM
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I know that the IL Vehicle Code specifically says that any lights, besides brake lights, must be "amber" or "white" in appearance, unless they are factory HIDs. I'm sure that most state's vehicle codes read the same way.
Just pay the ticket. Fighting it will get you nowhere and end up costing more. A judge won't be sympathetic when there is almost no ambiguity here.
Just pay the ticket. Fighting it will get you nowhere and end up costing more. A judge won't be sympathetic when there is almost no ambiguity here.
10-07-2003, 07:44 AM
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Originally posted by zand02max
Here we go with the cop bashing.
The point is simple, HE BROKE THE LAW, end of story. I will admit that certain towns (smaller ones) have nothing better to do than to pull people over for that type of incident.
But those lights could resemble an emergency vehicle, HENCE possibly causing an accident.
If you have a problem with the cops in your town, SPEEDING, CUTTING you off, then do something about it, and make a formal complaint.
I am not here to defend any cops out there, I am just stating the guy broke the law and that that vehicle could possibly cause an accident, hence why THE BLUE LIGHTS ARE ILLEGAL!
Lets not make this a cop bashing forum.
Here we go with the cop bashing.
The point is simple, HE BROKE THE LAW, end of story. I will admit that certain towns (smaller ones) have nothing better to do than to pull people over for that type of incident.
But those lights could resemble an emergency vehicle, HENCE possibly causing an accident.
If you have a problem with the cops in your town, SPEEDING, CUTTING you off, then do something about it, and make a formal complaint.
I am not here to defend any cops out there, I am just stating the guy broke the law and that that vehicle could possibly cause an accident, hence why THE BLUE LIGHTS ARE ILLEGAL!
Lets not make this a cop bashing forum.
Anyway, some people just don't realize that cops are doing a job. They don't write the laws. They're charged with enforcing them, whether they like the law or not.
If the car was bad enough, the guy could have gotten arrested for impersonating a police officer (Class A misdemeanor in IL). To get that bad, though, he'd have to have strobes on. I've personaly seen kids with blue strobes get arrested. Talk about dumb.
I'd pay the ticket and put the amber bulb back in or get a white bulb.
10-07-2003, 08:30 AM
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Originally posted by ares
its a turn signal which I beleive requires amber and nothing other than amber
its a turn signal which I beleive requires amber and nothing other than amber
Here is a shot of what everything looks like from factory. The HID isn't supposed to be green, the camera used didn't pick up the proper temp.
10-07-2003, 08:31 AM
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Interestingly enough, I dont think that side-strip inside the G35-C headlamp is even required by law, guys. Why? Well, the car has a front side-marker which acts as a reflector AND also illuminates, so that takes care of that. The front of the car has the signals which also illuminate as parking lamps, amber in color. He could just turn off that light and he'd by fine.
Afropuff, if I were you I would just go to a sherrif station and show them that the violation was corrected. HOWEVER, because these infractions are SOOOO minor, you can probably just leave the light there.. go in the daytime, and just show them the car. In almost every case I've had, a paper pushing female clerk will walk out and look at the car.. just make something up and say you had a clear sidemarker with blue bulb, and you put the amber side-marker back on. They usually arent too detailed in the citation as to WHAT exactly was modified, its not like the officer took photos at the time of the incident.
There IS a very very slim chance that those lamps could be somewhat legal, I cant remember the law but I do recall a section that DID allow ambient lighting, such as neon under-lighting. Contrary to what most people believe, subtle accents like neon underbody lighting IS (unfortunately) legal to have.. hehe. Of course, the law is very strict and it has to be a certain brightness, that way these lamps dont get mistaken for "enforcement colors."
The ticket is really really minor, I dont see what the big deal of it is.. and I am surprised he actually felt like pulling you over, in an INFINITI.. come on now, there are plenty of null-minded Honda owners that are much easier to cite, why bother someone in a car thats so luxurious.. its not like yours had tons of violations, it was a tiny light -- you must've done something to catch his attention, or else he wouldnt have bothered with something like this.
Calling cops pigs doesnt help, I never understand why people use words like that to describe ALL cops. Just say you stumbled into an a-hole cop, keep it simple.
Words like "pig" are just over-used and will definately aggrivate anyone who works for the enforcement OR has respect for them. These guys have a tough job to do, just stay out of their way and remember, dont be stupid and rude.
- Mike
ps: Interestingly enough, the G35-C headlamps we've been working on are almost done. I'll be posting pics of the finished product within a week or so. Time to upgrade? Hehehe MAYBE!
Afropuff, if I were you I would just go to a sherrif station and show them that the violation was corrected. HOWEVER, because these infractions are SOOOO minor, you can probably just leave the light there.. go in the daytime, and just show them the car. In almost every case I've had, a paper pushing female clerk will walk out and look at the car.. just make something up and say you had a clear sidemarker with blue bulb, and you put the amber side-marker back on. They usually arent too detailed in the citation as to WHAT exactly was modified, its not like the officer took photos at the time of the incident.
There IS a very very slim chance that those lamps could be somewhat legal, I cant remember the law but I do recall a section that DID allow ambient lighting, such as neon under-lighting. Contrary to what most people believe, subtle accents like neon underbody lighting IS (unfortunately) legal to have.. hehe. Of course, the law is very strict and it has to be a certain brightness, that way these lamps dont get mistaken for "enforcement colors."
The ticket is really really minor, I dont see what the big deal of it is.. and I am surprised he actually felt like pulling you over, in an INFINITI.. come on now, there are plenty of null-minded Honda owners that are much easier to cite, why bother someone in a car thats so luxurious.. its not like yours had tons of violations, it was a tiny light -- you must've done something to catch his attention, or else he wouldnt have bothered with something like this.
Calling cops pigs doesnt help, I never understand why people use words like that to describe ALL cops. Just say you stumbled into an a-hole cop, keep it simple.
Words like "pig" are just over-used and will definately aggrivate anyone who works for the enforcement OR has respect for them. These guys have a tough job to do, just stay out of their way and remember, dont be stupid and rude. - Mike
ps: Interestingly enough, the G35-C headlamps we've been working on are almost done. I'll be posting pics of the finished product within a week or so. Time to upgrade? Hehehe MAYBE!
10-07-2003, 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by afr0puff
"It's not a too-mah!" I mean, turn signal. Its just a decorative light. It's not amber either. From the factory it comes with your typical off-white yellowish bulb.
Here is a shot of what everything looks like from factory. The HID isn't supposed to be green, the camera used didn't pick up the proper temp.
"It's not a too-mah!" I mean, turn signal. Its just a decorative light. It's not amber either. From the factory it comes with your typical off-white yellowish bulb.
Here is a shot of what everything looks like from factory. The HID isn't supposed to be green, the camera used didn't pick up the proper temp.
I'll even pull up the IL code and maybe even try to find the NJ code.
10-07-2003, 08:41 AM
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Here's the IL code wording (and it refers to FEDERAL codes):
(b) All other motor vehicles shall exhibit at least 2 lighted head
lamps, with at least one on each side of the front of the vehicle, which
satisfy United States Department of Transportation requirements, showing
white lights, including that emitted by high intensity discharge (HID)
lamps, or lights of a yellow or amber tint, during the period from
sunset to sunrise, at times when rain, snow, fog, or other atmospheric
conditions require the use of windshield wipers, and at any other times
when, due to insufficient light or unfavorable atmospheric conditions,
persons and vehicles on the highway are not clearly discernible at a
distance of 1000 feet. Parking lamps may be used in addition to but not
in lieu of such head lamps. Every motor vehicle, trailer, or
semi-trailer shall also exhibit at least 2 lighted lamps, commonly known
as tail lamps, which shall be mounted on the left rear and right rear of
the vehicle so as to throw a red light visible for at least 500 feet in
the reverse direction, except that a truck tractor or road tractor
manufactured before January 1, 1968 and all motorcycles need be equipped
with only one such tail lamp.
(c) Either a tail lamp or a separate lamp shall be so constructed
and placed as to illuminate with a white light a rear registration plate
when required and render it clearly legible from a distance of 50 feet
to the rear. Any tail lamp or tail lamps, together with any separate
lamp or lamps for illuminating a rear registration plate, shall be so
wired as to be lighted whenever the head lamps or auxiliary driving
lamps are lighted.
(d) A person shall install only head lamps that satisfy United
States Department of Transportation regulations and show white light,
including that emitted by HID lamps, or light of a yellow or amber tint
for use by a motor vehicle.
more...
(625 ILCS 5/12-203)
Sec. 12-203. Lamps on parked vehicles.
(a) During the period from sunset to sunrise every motorcycle or
motor vehicle which is standing on any highway shall display a parking
light on the front and at the rear of the same. However, any city,
village or incorporated town may by ordinance, under rules and
regulations it may prescribe, designate any part or parts of any street,
or other highway under their jurisdiction, as parking places in which
motorcycles and motor vehicles may be parked without having their lamps
lighted, as otherwise required by this Section.
(b) Any lighted driving lamps upon a parked vehicle shall be
depressed or dimmed.
(Source: P.A. 77-37.)
more...
(625 ILCS 5/12-208)
Sec. 12-208. Signal lamps and signal devices.
(a) Every vehicle other than an antique vehicle displaying an antique plate operated in this State shall be equipped with a stop lamp or lamps on the rear of the vehicle which shall display a red or amber light visible from a distance of not less than 500 feet to the rear in normal sunlight and which shall be actuated upon application of the service (foot) brake, and which may but need not be incorporated with other rear lamps. During times when lighted lamps are not required, an antique vehicle may be equipped with a stop lamp or lamps on the rear of such vehicle of the same type originally installed by the manufacturer as original equipment and in working order. However, at all other times, such antique vehicle must be equipped with stop lamps meeting the requirements of Section 12-208 of this Act.
(b) Every motor vehicle other than an antique vehicle displaying an antique plate shall be equipped with an electric turn signal device which shall indicate the intention of the driver to turn to the right or to the left in the form of flashing lights located at and showing to the front and rear of the vehicle on the side of the vehicle toward which the turn is to be made. The lamps showing to the front shall be mounted on the same level and as widely spaced laterally as practicable and, when signaling, shall emit a white or amber light, or any shade of light
between white and amber. The lamps showing to the rear shall be mounted on the same level and as widely spaced laterally as practicable and, when signaling, shall emit a red or amber light. An antique vehicle shall be equipped with a turn signal device of the same type originally installed by the manufacturer as original equipment and in working
order.
http://www.legis.state.il.us/legisla...5act5Sub69.htm
(b) All other motor vehicles shall exhibit at least 2 lighted head
lamps, with at least one on each side of the front of the vehicle, which
satisfy United States Department of Transportation requirements, showing
white lights, including that emitted by high intensity discharge (HID)
lamps, or lights of a yellow or amber tint, during the period from
sunset to sunrise, at times when rain, snow, fog, or other atmospheric
conditions require the use of windshield wipers, and at any other times
when, due to insufficient light or unfavorable atmospheric conditions,
persons and vehicles on the highway are not clearly discernible at a
distance of 1000 feet. Parking lamps may be used in addition to but not
in lieu of such head lamps. Every motor vehicle, trailer, or
semi-trailer shall also exhibit at least 2 lighted lamps, commonly known
as tail lamps, which shall be mounted on the left rear and right rear of
the vehicle so as to throw a red light visible for at least 500 feet in
the reverse direction, except that a truck tractor or road tractor
manufactured before January 1, 1968 and all motorcycles need be equipped
with only one such tail lamp.
(c) Either a tail lamp or a separate lamp shall be so constructed
and placed as to illuminate with a white light a rear registration plate
when required and render it clearly legible from a distance of 50 feet
to the rear. Any tail lamp or tail lamps, together with any separate
lamp or lamps for illuminating a rear registration plate, shall be so
wired as to be lighted whenever the head lamps or auxiliary driving
lamps are lighted.
(d) A person shall install only head lamps that satisfy United
States Department of Transportation regulations and show white light,
including that emitted by HID lamps, or light of a yellow or amber tint
for use by a motor vehicle.
more...
(625 ILCS 5/12-203)
Sec. 12-203. Lamps on parked vehicles.
(a) During the period from sunset to sunrise every motorcycle or
motor vehicle which is standing on any highway shall display a parking
light on the front and at the rear of the same. However, any city,
village or incorporated town may by ordinance, under rules and
regulations it may prescribe, designate any part or parts of any street,
or other highway under their jurisdiction, as parking places in which
motorcycles and motor vehicles may be parked without having their lamps
lighted, as otherwise required by this Section.
(b) Any lighted driving lamps upon a parked vehicle shall be
depressed or dimmed.
(Source: P.A. 77-37.)
more...
(625 ILCS 5/12-208)
Sec. 12-208. Signal lamps and signal devices.
(a) Every vehicle other than an antique vehicle displaying an antique plate operated in this State shall be equipped with a stop lamp or lamps on the rear of the vehicle which shall display a red or amber light visible from a distance of not less than 500 feet to the rear in normal sunlight and which shall be actuated upon application of the service (foot) brake, and which may but need not be incorporated with other rear lamps. During times when lighted lamps are not required, an antique vehicle may be equipped with a stop lamp or lamps on the rear of such vehicle of the same type originally installed by the manufacturer as original equipment and in working order. However, at all other times, such antique vehicle must be equipped with stop lamps meeting the requirements of Section 12-208 of this Act.
(b) Every motor vehicle other than an antique vehicle displaying an antique plate shall be equipped with an electric turn signal device which shall indicate the intention of the driver to turn to the right or to the left in the form of flashing lights located at and showing to the front and rear of the vehicle on the side of the vehicle toward which the turn is to be made. The lamps showing to the front shall be mounted on the same level and as widely spaced laterally as practicable and, when signaling, shall emit a white or amber light, or any shade of light
between white and amber. The lamps showing to the rear shall be mounted on the same level and as widely spaced laterally as practicable and, when signaling, shall emit a red or amber light. An antique vehicle shall be equipped with a turn signal device of the same type originally installed by the manufacturer as original equipment and in working
order.
http://www.legis.state.il.us/legisla...5act5Sub69.htm
Last edited by WashUJon; 10-07-2003 at 08:48 AM.
10-07-2003, 08:44 AM
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Originally posted by WashUJon
The IL code refers to all illumination other than brake lights to be white or amber, this includes "decorative" lights. I'm sure NJ is similar in wording.
I'll even pull up the IL code and maybe even try to find the NJ code.
The IL code refers to all illumination other than brake lights to be white or amber, this includes "decorative" lights. I'm sure NJ is similar in wording.
I'll even pull up the IL code and maybe even try to find the NJ code.
10-07-2003, 08:49 AM
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If its not an HID bulb, it must be white or amber or any color in between. I'll bet my butt that the NJ code is the same, considering this is based off of federal codes...
10-07-2003, 09:00 AM
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Originally posted by old_s13
The ticket is really really minor, I dont see what the big deal of it is.. and I am surprised he actually felt like pulling you over, in an INFINITI.. come on now, there are plenty of null-minded Honda owners that are much easier to cite, why bother someone in a car thats so luxurious.. its not like yours had tons of violations, it was a tiny light -- you must've done something to catch his attention, or else he wouldnt have bothered with something like this.
The ticket is really really minor, I dont see what the big deal of it is.. and I am surprised he actually felt like pulling you over, in an INFINITI.. come on now, there are plenty of null-minded Honda owners that are much easier to cite, why bother someone in a car thats so luxurious.. its not like yours had tons of violations, it was a tiny light -- you must've done something to catch his attention, or else he wouldnt have bothered with something like this.
Originally posted by old_s13
ps: Interestingly enough, the G35-C headlamps we've been working on are almost done. I'll be posting pics of the finished product within a week or so. Time to upgrade? Hehehe MAYBE!
ps: Interestingly enough, the G35-C headlamps we've been working on are almost done. I'll be posting pics of the finished product within a week or so. Time to upgrade? Hehehe MAYBE!
10-07-2003, 09:29 AM
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The IL code refers to all illumination other than brake lights to be white or amber, this includes "decorative" lights. I'm sure NJ is similar in wording.
Something in the rest of the code perhaps?
Just curious... I personally can't stand lighting mods, but I don't like most laws against them either - If someone is going to get into an accident because they caught glimpse of an off color light in their rearview and mistook it for an emergency vehicle, or were distracted - the problem is not with the off color light. That driver has no business behind the wheel of a vehicle. Afterall, there are a lot of real emergency vehicles on the road, and a lot of far worse distractions.
Sirens and flashing lights (any such lights could confuse a driver as to wether or not the vehicle behind them was an emergency vehicle), and lights that are visually irritating or impairing to other drivers should be illegal. Not these little cosmetic things (no matter how silly I think they look).
One more little rant: Emergency sirens used in radio advertisements should be illegal also.
10-07-2003, 09:43 AM
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Originally posted by JackdawFool
Just curious... I personally can't stand lighting mods, but I don't like most laws against them either - If someone is going to get into an accident because they caught glimpse of an off color light in their rearview and mistook it for an emergency vehicle, or were distracted - the problem is not with the off color light. That driver has no business behind the wheel of a vehicle. Afterall, there are a lot of real emergency vehicles on the road, and a lot of far worse distractions.
Just curious... I personally can't stand lighting mods, but I don't like most laws against them either - If someone is going to get into an accident because they caught glimpse of an off color light in their rearview and mistook it for an emergency vehicle, or were distracted - the problem is not with the off color light. That driver has no business behind the wheel of a vehicle. Afterall, there are a lot of real emergency vehicles on the road, and a lot of far worse distractions.
besides, there are plenty of lighting companies that focus on selling lights that look good -- rather than just "selling lights," like many of these other companies do.
10-07-2003, 10:06 AM
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you have to understand that the reason that law exists, is so that other drivers dont get CONFUSED with official vehicles.
I understand your good point about poor visibility conditions and the need to be able to identify emergency vehicles. But in such conditions if a driver has trouble identifying the flashing lights of an ambulance, how would minor lighting modifications such as a small bluish illuminated stripe-thingy (no idea what that is called) within a housing that contains a powerful headlamp ever pose a distraction or cause confusion?
I hope you can see why I still think a licensable driver should not be confused by such a minor lighting change.
10-07-2003, 12:56 PM
#37
It's pretty unfortunate, but yes... you must stick to SAE signal color standards.
That's nothing. I replaced my stock license plate bulbs with a couple cheap white LEDs. I got pulled over for having blue lights. At the time my friend was driving me in my car.
She was making a left out of the neighborhood as a cop passed by. Then she continued driving towards freeway entrance as I noticed from behind the cop busted a U from far away and started coming after us.
Once we got onto the ramp another one of our friends was driving in front. The cop squeezed by next to us and tried to cut us and pull over my friend's car. Then he gave up and moved over and got behind us. His headlights flashed off and on, then he pulled us over. All becuase he says the lights were blue when I argued that they were white. Why would i throw in blue lights on a $30k car? He wasn't very happy with me. I was already too sick to get out of my car to show it to him.
What made things worst was that he asked for her license and went back to his car. He took forever and I was so sick I wanted to get home really bad. I've been driving in and out in that area for over 8months without problems. I thought it was pretty cruel of them to do that.
Another thing was that he was a cop from Bel Aire, but he pulled us over when we were in Wichita.
No tickets...
That's nothing. I replaced my stock license plate bulbs with a couple cheap white LEDs. I got pulled over for having blue lights. At the time my friend was driving me in my car.
She was making a left out of the neighborhood as a cop passed by. Then she continued driving towards freeway entrance as I noticed from behind the cop busted a U from far away and started coming after us.
Once we got onto the ramp another one of our friends was driving in front. The cop squeezed by next to us and tried to cut us and pull over my friend's car. Then he gave up and moved over and got behind us. His headlights flashed off and on, then he pulled us over. All becuase he says the lights were blue when I argued that they were white. Why would i throw in blue lights on a $30k car? He wasn't very happy with me. I was already too sick to get out of my car to show it to him.
What made things worst was that he asked for her license and went back to his car. He took forever and I was so sick I wanted to get home really bad. I've been driving in and out in that area for over 8months without problems. I thought it was pretty cruel of them to do that.
Another thing was that he was a cop from Bel Aire, but he pulled us over when we were in Wichita.
No tickets...
Last edited by DIGItonium; 10-07-2003 at 12:59 PM.
10-07-2003, 01:01 PM
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I'm surprised you didn't get a ticket for arguing. See, it all depends on the officer. Its called officer discretion. Some use it, some don't. You got lucky, my friend.
10-07-2003, 02:19 PM
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None of the above exerpts prohibit anything discussed in this thread. I read through the linked Code and found the "catch all" for lighting violations in IL... The only section from IL's code that applies:
(c) Unless otherwise expressly authorized by this Code, all other
lighting or combination of lighting on any vehicle shall be prohibited.
I imagine other states have similar catch all phrases.
(c) Unless otherwise expressly authorized by this Code, all other
lighting or combination of lighting on any vehicle shall be prohibited.
I imagine other states have similar catch all phrases.
10-07-2003, 03:31 PM
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Do you know the real reason the cop gave you that ticket? It's not because he was a hard *** or **** or anything else like that. He was actually doing the public in general a favor at a minor inconvenience to you. The real reason is this: cops have a quota or a "performance objective" that they are given by their boss, whether they admit it or not. In order to get around writing people tickets that screw their insurance and cost $$$ like speeders they write correctable equipment violations like lights and junk because generally if you are responsible and correct it you don't have to pay and the cop gets his boss off his back. Furthermore I don't know too many cops that object to the term pig so much, in fact i know of a motorcycle club of just cops known as the Wild Pigs, FYI. Just don't call them a pig when you get pulled over that might cost you.