Wicked4u2c

iTrader: (6)

I still dont get the whole, "I CAN TRADE MY CAR IN 3 YEARS" THing. If you negotiate correctly you can trade a "bought" car in 3 years and still make a profit. If you buy the car at a good price before you even hit the 2 year mark (depending on the resale value) you should be out of the upside down. I still think leasing is dumb, YOU ARE GIVING YOUR MONEY AWAY!! You will never rid a car payment you will owe for the rest of your life (specially those who change cars like they do underwear) and your cashflow is tied up in something that is a liability not an investment. FOOLISH! At least I know that in 2007 I will OWE NOTHING on MY Z! it is mine, the Z has a timeless look and im sure even in 10 years it will still be one of the nicest designs ever made. Just like the old NSX, SUPRA, and even RX-7. Which are old cars. And If I do get sick of my Z, I can trade it in at 2007 and have a nice hefty downpayment for my next car. My daily driver is a 2000 HONDA CRV FULLY PAID OFF! And my 350z is my weekend car. But I guess people like to give away money...? And IM not worried about warranty... 5 Years or 100,000 miles... I only have 10k miles 2 years...

dchengmd

Just as you can with a leased car. However, the benefit is that you have a GUARANTEED minimum price/trade-in for the car that's negotiated at the beginning of the lease term. Try negotiating a locked-in 3-year trade-in price of a purchased car on the day you drive it off the lot. Guess what? You can't.

Hypothetical: the residual on the 3-year lease on my Z is a little over $19000 (if my memory serves me correctly). Now, if in 3 years the '04 Z has gotten a lot of bad press and is determined by the market to be a 'lemon', and the bluebook price of my now-3-year-old used Z is $17000, I don't take a $2000 loss on the trade-in - the leasing company handles it. Now, if the Z is actually worth $21000 after 3 years, I can sell it for $21000, pay off the $19000 residual, and pocket the $2000.

First of all, if you think buying a car is an investment, you are the foolish one. There are very few cars out there that actually increase in value, and the other 99%+ depreciate in value. How is that an investment?

Second, I agree with you that you will never rid yourself of payments if you continue to lease a car for the rest of your life. Like I said before, leasing is definitely not for everybody. But I went into my lease KNOWING that I wasn't planning to keep the car for more than 3 years anyway, and I like driving something new every couple of years. Besides, if you lease you shouldn't be considering your monthly payments as payments towards ownership of the car. You are paying to cover depreciation costs of the car while you use it.

Hypothetical #2: Person A finances a $30000 car at 5%, and then decides to sell it after 3 years for $20000. So, his net loss is $10000 plus interest. Person B leases a $30000 car for 3 years at 5%, and his residual is $20000. So his net out-of-pocket expense is $10000 plus interest. Is there any difference between these two people expense-wise? NO. I don't understand your "you are giving money away when you lease" argument - it just isn't true.

Good for you. At least I know in 2007 I will be driving a new model-year 2007 car. And, you will have paid $30000+ for your car. I will have paid $15000+ to use a Z for 3 years. Who's spent more money in 3 years, you or me?

Right. And the amount of money you spent on your Z in depreciation costs will roughly be the same as if you had leased the car and returned it.

For the last time - I don't disagree with everything you say. Leasing isn't for everyone, and obviously it's not for you since you appear to want to keep your cars for a long time. IMO one really needs to consider whether his/her automobile needs fit a lease, and not the other way around - this is the mistake a lot of people make when leasing. They just look at monthly payments.

That being said, your thinking that a lease is a big waste of money only shows that you really don't understand what an auto lease is all about.

Wicked4u2c

iTrader: (6)

I do understand what a lease is all about, and thats why I will never do it, no matter how you explain it, it doesnt benift ME... Thats right ME, could benifit you? Again, I'll see you in 2007 with a new car (if I get tired of the Z)

SKYLINE HERE WE COME

dchengmd

This statement only proves you don't know what you're talking about. Comparing a car lease to renting a home doesn't work - in a lot of cases a home is NOT a depreciable asset. 99.9% of cars ARE. While owning a home may for the most part be better than renting, it isn't necessarily for everyone.

Wrong again. You seem to have some difficulty with reading comprehension.

In 2007, you will have paid off your car and spent around $30000 total. In 2007, I will have returned my Z and spent around $15000 total on the lease. If you decide to sell your Z for $15000 in 2007, you will have spent $15000 NET, correct? ($30k spent - $15k gained.) So your net out-of-pocket and mine are the same. I WILL have that "$15000 to put down on MY NEW 2007 CAR" because I will never have spent that amount on my old Z in the first place. NOW do you get it?

Yes, you will only owe $15000 on your new car. However, you initially spent more than I did, which negates that fact. Duh.

Whatever. You have no idea how a lease could benefit or hurt you because you're still quite clueless with basic mathematics and finance. You don't seem to understand that your so-called 'benefit' when selling off your old car for the down payment on a new one isn't profit, it's just getting some of your equity back. I suggest you read leaseguide.com to get your facts straight, but I doubt you'd understand it.

Also, learn how to use quotes correctly.

Wicked4u2c

iTrader: (6)

See, that's the beauty if I am happy with a car I dont need to sell it and can keep it. When I saw the Z I knew she was a keeper FOR A LOOOOONG TIME! And even if their was a car TODAY that would catch my interest right now say the C6 Corvette (it doesn't but just say) I can sell my 350z and wont lose any money as a matter a fact you have to WAIT because you have a contract which your tied up and even have restricted in miles, HELL I could drive 100,000 miles right now and I HAVE NO PENALTY's... But again their is always something for everyone.

dchengmd

Then try using an example that's relevant to the discussion at hand. It's interesting to see that you completely ignored my point that the total out-of-pocket for both owners and leasers would be the same. Can't ignore mathematics.

Big deal. With any good lease you are free to sell the car at any price the market fetches for it as well. Like I said, if my Z is worth $2000 more than the residual after 3 years, I can sell it and that $2000 goes right into my pocket.

Actually, moron, I do OWN two other cars - a Lexus RX330 and an Acura TL. However, I chose to lease the Z because I KNEW I wouldn't be putting too many miles on it, and I wasn't planning to keep it for longer than 3 years anyway - mainly because my income will be high enough after 3 years for me to afford something much, much nicer, and I'm not interested in maintaining a sports car much past its warranty period.

My point is, the amount of money I spent versus how much you spent is exactly the SAME if we both decide to buy a new car later on down the line. Whether or not you own the car is totally irrelevant to this argument.

Actually, before I leased my Z I didn't have any car payments either. You still don't get it.

I sort of agree with you here. Now, if you had bothered to read my first post in this thread carefully (which you seem to be incapable of doing), you would have seen that I DON'T recommend putting ANY money down on a lease - I didn't. The risk of losing the down payment if the car is totalled is too high.

The ONLY reason you would put money down on a lease is to lower the monthly payments. The TOTAL amount of money you spend on the lease, down payment or not, is the SAME:

Assuming a $30000 car and a $20000 residual, if you put $0 down, you will be paying $10000 over 3 years. If you put $5000 down, you will be paying $5000 over 3 years.

That's it. That money doesn't get "thrown away" as you say. It's part of the depreciation of the car. NOW do you get it?

I don't really care what you did with your $7k that you didn't put down. Your posturing doesn't impress me, and I doubt it impresses anyone else here. I agree with you that the original poster made a bad move. But don't think you're so cool because you saved on a down payment - I paid $0 down for my lease.

Wow, your ignorance really amazes me. I already SAID leases were only for people who met some pretty strict criteria, and if there was any possibility I wasn't going to keep the car for the lease term, I wouldn't have done it. The difference is, I DON'T plan to put 100000 miles on the car because I have no need to, and I don't MIND keeping it for 3 years - and I anticipated this when I signed the lease.

As for you "selling your 350z and wont lose any money", you are completely full of it. If you think strapping on a bunch of third party crap on your car is going to make it increase in value, you're in for a real rude awakening. You still think your Z is an "investment" and not a depreciable asset? Here are your numbers, spelled out as simply as possible so even you can understand it:

Cost of Z ~$30000
Mods ~$7000

Let's see you get $37000 or more for your car in 2007. You are so full of it it's funny.

stevem

Leasing makes sense if you put little or no money down. For instance, say the out the door price of a Z is $34,000, with tax and title. Down payment is $0 (my case) and the 36 month lease payment is $535. Total payments are $19,260. Financing $34,000 for 48 months at 6% results in monthly payments of $798. Total payments to buy are $38,328. The big questions are residual value and how long are you going to keep the car. Given this example, leasing makes sense. IMO

del105

iTrader: (4)

I just don't understand. I just bought an enthusiast last month payed 29300 OTD my payments are less than 600 for 60 months. The thing about it is after about 15 to 20 months I won't be underwater anymore and can sell the car and maybe make a couple dollars. When I first graduated college I leased a prelude. That was the first and last time I'll lease a car. It is like flushing your money down the toilet.

Built2shredZ

Only smart ones are the guys who save up and pay cash....

I know that jsut about every one of my friends that lease lost some serious $$$$ when the lease ran up because of the extra mileage on it and a few dings here and there..... And usally the only way out of paying that is if you lease another car from them, but at a higher cost then if you were leasing for the first time.... To each there own, but I wouldnt recommend leasing because unless your in the ideal situation and best buddies with the dealership your going to eat it...

chrism1

****unless you get the car back of invoice, grab the dealer holdback, and get the lease at buyrate! I am a Fin Director at Nissan dealer. I only leased because of the deal and employee...buyrate , invoice less Dealer Holdback. Zero down 48 mo lease @ 299.00 per month plus tax! Works for me. I wont keep it, but being in the business i will get out if needed...For some people leasing is the way to go. My parents have been on the Ford Red Carpet lease for over 15 yrs, its a 2 yr lease program. New car every 2 yrs, works for my parents. My father always said he would die with car pmts.. But he will always have a new car every 2yrs with warranty etc... and always the new models etc... Everybody has diff opinions, based on there situations. Good Luck

TheLex

Leasing is situational. For someone like me who can write the car off as a business expense, leasing makes perfect sense. I get to essentially save 50% off the monthly payment given my tax bracket. Figuring in the tax savings, at the end of the lease, I've paid about equal to what I would had I financed the vehicle interest free. I did that on my Tahoe - I leased, and then at the end of the lease I bought the thing and then started a yearly depreciation. In the end, I got the financing for free!

But if you're in low tax bracket, or can't write it off, then leasing is NOT a good idea.

Unless you can get your hands on a limited production Ferrari, generally a car is not an investment.