Weight lost as follows:-

Ray's wheels and tyres over standard 17" 16kg
Exhaust 12 (est)
Cats 6
Spare and jack/tools 18
Plenum 2
Popcharger 1
Pulley 2

That comes to a bit more than 50kg. The Hi Tech exhaust may have been been better than my 12kg estimate.

KY350 - I actually have lost 15kg over the last 6 months by running around the block but that doesn't really count in the weight loss.

I bought Z350Lover's old Ray's wheels cause I liked them, but the weight loss was a bonus.

I will replace the battery when it gets nearer its use-by date with one of the lightweight types. That should be worth at least another 10kg.

With regard to the ECU, a local company (I will find out next week who they are) have purchased a programmer and will be using Technosquare's maps and expertise, so it should be OK.

I really believe that we will see a significant performance improvement with the US map set for 92 octane fuel. Ours are set for standard premium which is about 88 octane. After the upgrade I will have to use 98 Ron fuel.

The other bonus with the ECU upgrade is moving the rev limiter. It is so easy for me to hit now.

The UR pulley was a significant improvement accross the full rev range.

The standard Z was only about .8 seconds slower than the STI as per the Wheels magazine test for 0 - 100k's. I will be very surprised if I haven't picked up that amount already. With the ECU upgrade, should put me in the very low 5's for 0 - 100 which isn't bad for about $4000 worth of mods.

The Z just looks so good, and now to have the performance to match the looks is really great.

I would love FI, but am apprehensive about reliability and the need for regular tuning. I want a daily driver that doesn't need a lot of upkeep.

The mods I have done, all seem well proven by now and are not really rocket science.

 

Malcolm - I too like the Rays wheels. They are very similar to the design of the 17" wheels which I like, but even better looking. Weight loss is a huge bonus.

If your Z is running low 5's, that a huge improvement over standard, especially since the total outlay is only $4,000 (did that include the Rays?). I'm very impressed.

Perhaps you could give us a short write up if you run against an STi. Appart from a standstill start, you should race from a rolling 1st gear start to negate the STi's 4wd launch as this would be a better assessment of each cars accelerative capabilities.

 

I really believe that we will see a significant performance improvement with the US map set for 92 octane fuel. Ours are set for standard premium which is about 88 octane. After the upgrade I will have to use 98 Ron fuel.

As far as I know, the 350Z here is tuned for 98RON fuel ... that is what my owners manual says (ie. Aus spec 350Z = 98RON).

Also, a lot of 'smarter' engines adopt to different fuel ratings. A car that may be tuned for 98RON could run on 92RON as it's CPU retards the timing when it detects early 'knocking'. Likewise, it will advance the timing with better fuel and hence gain power.

I am not 100% sure that the 350Z has an engine like this, but I do know that even the Gen3 V8 in the HSVs is smart enough as HSV claims different power rating with 95RON and with 98RON. From what I can remember, they claim good 6kW difference betwen 95 and 98RON. Besides that, as I mentioned before, the 350Z seems already tuned for the 98RON fuel. Also if I'm not mistaken, the Amuse ECU offers 'only' about 7kW extra ... and that is with the extra rev-range.

Ray's wheels and tyres over standard 17" 16kg

How heavy are the 17" wheels? The 18" OE wheels are 'only' 12kg lighter than the 18" RAYS. Also, I'm not sure about your tyres, but the OEM RE040 for the 18" wheels weight 12kg each ... how heavy are yours? I weighted my OEM 18" wheels with tyres and they weight 24kg per corner.

Exhaust 12 (est)

If the Amuse 350Z special in the latest 'Best Motorring' is correct, then it could be closer to 20kg saving as they claim ~40kg for the OME exhaust.

Spare and jack/tools 18

Again, I would have thought that this is more. Have you weighted it? Reason I ask is that the 18" allow wth tyre weights 24kg. The tools would weight good 5kg I pressume, and I would have not thought that the spare wheel/tyre would be much lighter than the alloy/wheel. I would have guessed that it'd be more like 25kg ... but then I'm just speculating as I have not put then on to the scales. Have you?

With the ECU upgrade, should put me in the very low 5's for 0 - 100 which isn't bad for about $4000 worth of mods.

I hate to be the sceptic/realist here, bit I doubt that your (or anyone elses) Zed would get anywhere close to low 5s. High 5s is possible (maybe even 5.7), but not low 5s. Keep in mind that with all those mods you still need a 2nd gear-change to reach 100kph .... this always drops good 0.3 - 0.4sec from your 0-100kph time. Also a stock 350Z does flat 6 to 100kph on a good day.

To put it into perspective, a 911 (996) will do low 5s to 100kph ... I am pretty sure that a 350Z with mild mods will not be able to match a 911. 911 does 0-160kph in about 11.5sec ... that is good 3 sec quicker than a stock 350Z and I can't see that kind of improvement unless you have gained extra 60 - 70kW.

Also, if you have a car that can do low 5s to 100kph, that would mean that you can do flat 13s over 400m ... maybe even high 12s. Take it to the 400m track and see how you go. The 400m time (and trap speed) will tell you roughly where you stand in terms of 0-100kph compared to a stock 350Z.

Perhaps you could give us a short write up if you run against an STi. Appart from a standstill start, you should race from a rolling 1st gear start to negate the STi's 4wd launch as this would be a better assessment of each cars accelerative capabilities.

Good idea ... if you have the means then you should do that and then compare it to my runs with an '02 STi. My 350Z (with Hi-tech exhaust) is just about line-ball with an '02 STi from 80 to 160kph or so. Maybe a fraction quicker as the speeds increase. According to the comparo that they had in Wheels, a stock 350Z is slightly slower than an STi even on the roll.

 

KY350 - No the $4,000 did not include the Rays, only performance improvements. Breakdown as follows:-

Hi-Tech - $1500
Cats and Plenum - $1000
Pop Charger and Pulley - $400
Fitting exhaust and cats - $150
ECU (still to do) - $900

I have recently returned from the USA and brought the cats/plenum/pop charger/pulley back with me so I saved some freight, duty and GST, maybe $400.

The Rays are more cosmetic and won't add to the performance much.

I would love to get the opportunity to run against an STI, just out of interest.

DavidM

The 350Z can only be tuned to run on 88 octane standard premium. 98RON is not available everywhere. I'm not sure if it will automatically adapt to 98RON but I suspect not.

In the USA, Z's have always been achieving mid 5's for 0 - 60mph which is about 96kph. This equates to maybe 5.7 for 0 - 100k's which is about .5sec slower than us. USA cars have been tuned for 92 Octane which is standard premium.

If we tune our cars for 93 Octane as standard we should see an improvement. The ECU remapping will prove this point.

The 18" OEM's will not be lighter than the 18" Rays. I still have my 17" OEM's and have just weighed them compared to the Rays.

The 17" OEM's are 23.8kg, and the 18" Rays are 19.8kg, so my 4kg saving per wheel is correct.

40kg for the OEM exhaust is correct. I cannot remember the weight of my Hi-Tech but I think it was about 27kg. It may be less.

The spare wheel on my car is one of the "skinny emergency" type and weighs 16kg. The jack and tools maybe 2 - 4kg, I haven't weighed them but they aren't that heavy.

When I compare my car from stock at 6.3, 0 - 100 as per Wheels tests, and how it is running now, there is no way I have only improved .5 sec. By moving the rev limiter one can achieve 0 - 100 in 2nd gear. My car absolutely flies now compared to what it was like in standard form. I will try to be more objective and get a confirmed 0 -100 time as soon as I have the ECU upgrade.

A 911 can do in the 4's 0 -100. An STI can do around 5.3, and that's where I believe I will be at, but as I say, I will get it confirmed.

 

Where did you get your HiTech for $1500?

 

okay.... as what David said above and we all know about the fact that we need to change into the 3rd to make it to 100km/h.... WHAT HAPPENS IF.... we raise the rev/fuel cut up to between 7000 and 7200rpm? How is it gonna fit into the acceleration time? I know the gearing will not allow the car to go up to any higher speed... but with extra few hundred of rev, will it really make/help to improve the acceleration time? (assuming that we get max. power at somewhere around 7000 to 7200 rpm)....

AND... what's the point of raising the rev/fuel cut?

cheers,

richie

 

You only need the extra 200 rpm to make it to 100km/h in second. Not that it matters in real life or 1/4 mile (for those who drag).

 

The 350Z can only be tuned to run on 88 octane standard premium. 98RON is not available everywhere.

The owners manual says that the Aus and Japanese 350Z need 98RON fuel and that the rest of the world uses the lower rating. If that is correct, then there are 2 different mappings for the OEM ECU, and we got the better/higher one.

I'm not sure if it will automatically adapt to 98RON but I suspect not.

I don't know that either, but as I said before the HSVs do as did the S2000. Actually, even the WRX does as the WRX-club in NWS tested this on the dyno and got pretty good/positive results.

In the USA, Z's have always been achieving mid 5's for 0 - 60mph which is about 96kph. This equates to maybe 5.7 for 0 - 100k's

Not quiete. 5.5sec 0-60mph would equate to around 5.8sec 0-100kph if there was no extra shift needed. The 2nd-to-3rd gear-change is not the quickest so there's good 0.3 - 0.4sec sec needed (or lost) just in there. That brings the time to 6.1 - 6.2sec ... which is not far off what they achieved even in local mags. Though, the quickest 0-60mph time for the 350Z has been clocked at 5.3sec ... which would bring it down to 6.0sec flat if you could reproduce these perfect conditions. That's been bettered with 5.8sec as in Germany ... that probably shows perfect conditions and perfect shifts ... no one else has been able to repeat that (not even them). Still, I'd hardly call 5.8sec the norm for a 350Z ... no more than 5.8sec 0-100kph for the WRX or 5.3sec for the STi.

A 911 can do in the 4's 0 -100. An STI can do around 5.3, and that's where I believe I will be at, but as I say, I will get it confirmed.

I have a feeling that we have different references. I think you are going by one off times which probably cannot be repeated, while I'm going by times that could be repeated (give good skill and conditions). See, if you say mid 5sec car to me, I picture an M3 or an STi. If you mention flat to low 6sec can I picture a 350Z or an S2000. Low 5s 911, high 4s Ferrari 355. So to me, when you say low 5s, that implies quicker than M3 and on par with a 911. Still, I don't think that an M3 is within the reach.

A much better reference time for acceleration is 0-160kph instead of 0-100kph as 0-100kph is very traction dependant, while 0-160kph is a lot more power dependant. A stock 350Z can do 0-160kph in high 13s on a good day/conditions. On the other hand an M3 will do in in 12 - 12.5sec. 911 in 11.5 - 12.0sec. This shows the 'gap' a lot better than 0-100kph times and I don't think that you can get anywhere close to the 911 (or even the M3) with just the 'basic' mods that you listed. As I mentioned before, the 350Z would need around 250kW (at the crank) to be able to match the M3 in terms of acceleration and then the M3 still has the the traction off the line advantage. From the dynos so far, the Hi-Tech exhaust alone seems to put the 350Z at around 220kW at the crank, and I would guess that would get us into the low 13s for the 0-160kph on a good day/conditions. We are still another 30kW short, and I am guessing that the other mods listed will not give us that.

Why don't you do some rolling start comparisions with a stock 350Z (or one wth Hi-tech only) and see what the gains are? I did a similar thing with Lionking even though he has an auto and the exhaust seemed to give me 'only' about 3 - 4 car-lengths on him to 160kph or so. That eqates to about 0.3 - 0.4sec over 400m.

The spare wheel on my car is one of the "skinny emergency" type and weighs 16kg. The jack and tools maybe 2 - 4kg, I haven't weighed them but they aren't that heavy.

You know, I have that as well (as do the rest of us I'm sure) ... have you weighted the 'emergency' spare, or are you just guessing at the 16kg?

as what David said above and we all know about the fact that we need to change into the 3rd to make it to 100km/h.... WHAT HAPPENS IF.... we raise the rev/fuel cut up to between 7000 and 7200rpm? How is it gonna fit into the acceleration time?

That will mean that you can do 0-100kph without shifting to 3rd gear and hence save yourself 0.3 - 0.4 sec in the 0-100kph time. Still, you will need to make that shift later so you will need to drop that 0.3 - 0.4sec soner or later.

what's the point of raising the rev/fuel cut?

The benefits are:
a) you get to stay in each gear longer
b) and hence drop higher up in the rev-range (ie. power band) when you up-change to the next gear.

These 2 things mean that:
a) for the fraction of the time that you stay in the lower gear, you will be accelerating faster that in you up-changed.
b) the area under the power curve is fater as you stay in the higher (and hence fatter) region of the power.

Simple way to picture this is imagine how quick the 350Z (or any car) would be if you could stretch the 1st gear to 10,000rpm (that is without the power dropping off but instead just staying reasonably flat). You would have the acceleretion of the 1st gear at the way to 90kph instead of 60kph. So as you probably gathered, raising the rev-limiter only serves purpose if you have reasonable power at and beyond the current cut-out.

 

thanks david.... I would say that's the way to go then..... raising the rev/fuel cut to around 7 grand, we can easily achieve 0-100 in 2 gears....

cheers,

richie

 

David - I have previously weighed the T spare and mine is 14kg. The tools I estimate no more than 2kgs collectively.

You state that the Z with HiTech exhaust would produce 220kW at the crank. No way - that is too low considering that the Z has 206kW to start with and the exhaust adds approx 15rwkW. That equates to about 20kW additional at the crank. So with just the exhaust, Malcolms Z should be at 226kW.

Now add to that about another 15kW at the crank (not unrealistsic) for the other mechanical mods and Malcolm is now looking at approx 240kW at the crank.

Finally Malcolms car is also 50kgs lighter than stock and some of the weight has been taken off rotating sections (wheels / tyres) of the car (effect is more power, but I cannot even begin to guess how much / little, so I won't count that.

Conclusion - Malcolms Z = 240kW at the crank and only 1400kg. Comapre that to an M3 which is approx 1500kg and 252kW at the crank and the result is that Malcolm's Z should be able to keep close company with an M3.

Malcolm - you could always dyno your Z to see what the diff is in power from stock. Alternatively, go to the racetrack and get a timeslip for 1/4 mile runs. Although the latter is very dependant on the driver, if you can launch well, then your Z should see around 13.5s for the 1/4, which is approx 0.5 - 0.8s better than stock.

One other point, when driving on the street, the kW number your car is capable of, the 0-100km/h and 1/4 mile times are unimportant. kW aside, if you want your car to go better while your on the move, you want a fatter torque curve. The additional kW is realy only usefull for top end acceleration (ie 6000+). But ultimately, you bum dyno is giving you a much better reading than stock while driving on the street and that is what counts most.

 

KY350:

I think what David is trying to say is that no matter how much mods we put on to our zeds, we will still need to shift into the 3rd gear to go up to 100 km/hr... and in that extra shifting process, we are actually losing 0.3 to 0.4 seconds already compare to the M3 and other performance sports car.... (as my previous m3 can do 109 km/hr at the end of the 2nd, so that actually saved me extra 0.3 seconds to go up to 100 km/hr).

That's also why M3 and all Porsches can be able to out perform the zed in 0-100 km/hr time because they only need 2 gears to finish the trip and we need the 3rd one to finish.... and i would say.... the zed will need to have a lot more than 240kw (without raising the rev) to go against M3's 0-100km performance because shaving 0.3 to 0.4 second is actually quite hard on the N/A mods...

Just my opinion on my own experiences...

cheers,

richie

 

David - I have previously weighed the T spare and mine is 14kg.

Thanks, I'm glad someone has weighted it. It is ligher than I expected as the full-size RE040 tyre (without the wheel) weights 12kg. So the 14kg for the whole wheel is very light IMHO.

You state that the Z with HiTech exhaust would produce 220kW at the crank.

I'm only guessing ... your guess of 226kW could be just as correct if not more. I'm only quessing that it's somewhere around there.

Now add to that about another 15kW at the crank (not unrealistsic) for the other mechanical mods and Malcolm is now looking at approx 240kW at the crank.

See, that's roughly what Nathan's GTP 350Z has and that has not only a more 'agressive' exhaust (which is not road legal), but also more agressive cams and CPU. Would you say that Malcolm's mods will produce as much power as the GTP 350Z?

I am only speculating as I do not know Malcolm's car at all, but I would guess that it would need to be less than that ... afterall, the cams and CPU should be worth good 15kW ... no? Maybe Nathan/Peter can shed some light on this?

Conclusion - Malcolms Z = 240kW at the crank and only 1400kg. Comapre that to an M3 which is approx 1500kg and 252kW at the crank and the result is that Malcolm's Z should be able to keep close company with an M3.

Just to demonstate what it means to be anywhere close to the M3, I looked up the best 0-100kph and 0-160kph times from a German mag 'Sports Auto'. They run with one person on board, publish the best time and are probably the most reputable mag out there. So here's a list of 5sec (and low 5sec) cars for the 0-100kph ... notice the 0-160kph times and the weight-to-power figures:

M3:
- power = 343ps (ie. 252kW)
- weight-to-power = 4.5kg/ps
- 0-100kph = 5.2sec
- 0-160kph = 11.6sec

M Roadster:
- power = 325ps (ie. 243kW)
- weight-to-power = 4.4kg/ps
- 0-100kph = 5.2sec
- 0-160kph = 11.5sec

M5:
- power = 400ps (ie. 298kW)
- weight-to-power = 4.5kg/ps
- 0-100kph = 5.1sec
- 0-160kph = 11.2sec

Maserati Spyder:
- power = 390ps (ie. 293kW)
- weight-to-power = 4.4kg/ps
- 0-100kph = 5.0sec
- 0-160kph = 11.3sec

Mercedes E55 AMG:
- power = 354ps (ie. 265kW)
- weight-to-power = 4.5kg/ps
- 0-100kph = 5.3sec
- 0-160kph = 11.8sec

Mercedes SLK32 AMG:
- power = 354ps (ie. 265kW)
- weight-to-power = 4.2kg/ps
- 0-100kph = 5.0sec
- 0-160kph = 11.0sec

Compare it to their time for the 350Z (which is the best in the world so far):

350Z:
- power = 280ps (ie. 210kW)
- weight-to-power = 5.5kg/ps
- 0-100kph = 5.9sec
- 0-160kph = 13.7sec

That 2sec+ difference to 160kph is a significant difference ... I would like to think that we can chase M3s with the 'mild' mods but I find it very unlikely. The exhaust alone will certainly make you quicker than stock, but I'll be happy if it gets me to flat/low 13s for 0-160kph.

Also, the M3 does not only have the power (or weight-to-power) in it's favour, but also the super short gearing which it can thank to its 8,000rpm redline for. Because the 350Z has the redline at 6,600rpm, it needs probably just as much (if not more) power as the M3 despite it's weight advantage in order to match it in terms of acceleration. I'm only speculating, but my guess is that you need 260kW at the crank to match an M3 in terms of acceleration.

I do not know anyone closely with an M3 so I can't speak from experience, but I would love to fid out. Do you, or anyone else know somepne with an M3, who is willing to put these to the test? If someone knows one in Melbourne than I'm more than happy to meet up.

Alternatively, go to the racetrack and get a timeslip for 1/4 mile runs. Although the latter is very dependant on the driver, if you can launch well, then your Z should see around 13.5s for the 1/4, which is approx 0.5 - 0.8s better than stock.

The trap-speed will tell us a lot more than the actual time ... as you mentioned, the time is very driver/skill dependant. On the other hand, a stock 350Z will trap at around 160kph no matter what the time, while an M3 will trap at around 170kph ... ie. 10kph quicker than stock 350Z (that is as long as you shift at redline and make an effort). So, if you want any hope of keeping up with an M3, then you need to trap at around 170kph in a 1/4.

One other point, when driving on the street, the kW number your car is capable of, the 0-100km/h and 1/4 mile times are unimportant. ... ultimately, you bum dyno is giving you a much better reading than stock while driving on the street and that is what counts most

I could not agree more. Unless you're taking the car to the track gthen the feel is probably more relevant to you than the actual numbers.

ps. Yes Richie ... you are correct as that is what I was saying in terms of 0-100kph times. Untill the rev-limiter is raised, you will alsoway loose that 0.3 - 0.4sec in the 0-100kph just does tothat extra shift. Also, another point not mentioned in this thread is that you will need much wider rear tyres (ie. 265s) as even a stock Zed cannot get well off the line and has too much power for the rear tyres. I'll be hard to improve the 0-60kph time without having much tyres at the rear .... look at the size of tyres that 911, Boxser S or M3 wear at the back and you will not find anything thinner than 265s.

 

Well at least the 350Z has done a greatjob on the track against M3, Which they have a similar Lap time on Topgear TestDrive (by STIG) Also the RX8 as well.

But I think, we can't refer the Straight line capabilities of 350Z against M3. It's a hard to win, especially BMW areknown to be Very good on Perfecting the Gear Ratio with it's Engine Capabilities.

 

Richie - I also don't think that a well modified NA Z will beat the M3's 0-100km/h time and this is due mostly to the extra 0.3s for the shift to 3rd.

David - I think the M3 is an awesome car. The 0-160km/h times are damn fast. Agreed that the Z will need serious NA mods to keep up.

Malcolm - you need to hunt down some M3's for a race to see just how quick you are.

 

I'd like to know eho got the 0-100 times of the Z.

Sounds pretty optimistic to me!

Motor only got 6.32.

Thats a whole big difference!

FROZTY

 

I'd like to know eho got the 0-100 times of the Z.

lol, can you translate this? ;-)

Malcolm - you need to hunt down some M3's for a race to see just how quick you are.

Absulutelly ... I'd lovbe to do it as well, but I don't know anyone 'closely' who has one in Melbourne.

 

I will complete the ECU upgrade and then do the 0 - 100 times. Hopefully all will then be revealed. I will be surprised if I haven'y gained around 1 second. In my opinion any car that does 0 - 100 in less than 5.5 is fast. To get below 5 seconds is seriously fast.

I will watch the APS upgrade with great interest. If they can perform a reliable, robust, TT install for around $12k and do 4.5 seconds, I will be definately interested. I can't think of any other car that could achieve those numbers and look so good for around $75k.

 

even though Im not so keen on the idea of an aftermarket TT system, I will hv to agree on your comment there
wish I could find more traction on the zed with that much power under your right foot

 

get the Tilton 8lb flywheel and TS ECU to up the rev limiter, plus the usual intake/exhaust mod, I dont think we'll be far off

 

I think if you want to Get the Benefit of increasing the Rev limiter to 7000 or 7200 rpm. You need to Get aftermarket Camshaft. I read it that Nismo Camshaft doesn't increase power or Torque much on Low and mid end. But a Lot on Higher end of RPM. So you guess that's where is the removed Rev limiter and Camshaft play the role.