I survived my first track day! The Z did GREAT!
11-07-2006, 02:09 PM
#82
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Originally Posted by qu8ttro
LUCKY! That car is so nice...sounds good too! I looked up this weekend's event at Thill...said its only open to PDC. What's that?
Hey Z car garage is in my area...i've never been there tho...its on first street right?
Hey Z car garage is in my area...i've never been there tho...its on first street right?
Originally Posted by qu8ttro
Hey Z car garage is in my area...i've never been there tho...its on first street right?
11-07-2006, 02:24 PM
#83
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Originally Posted by Sk8fe
In-car cam setups rock; especially, if you don't get back to that track in a while. I always review my in-car footage of the previous times I was at that track the night before to remind myself of the things I did well (and not so well). 
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...66825156327462
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...86804370758275
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...19321707251997
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...66825156327462
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...86804370758275
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...19321707251997
haha thanks for the vids! This is getting really expensive!
11-07-2006, 03:08 PM
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Congrats on your first track day. They are fun fun fun. My next is at Infineon on 11/24 and I can't wait.
I gotta ask though....How the hell did you get on that line over the corkscrew? Did you go too far and slide out the backend a bit? Just curious.
Marc Mc
I gotta ask though....How the hell did you get on that line over the corkscrew? Did you go too far and slide out the backend a bit? Just curious.
Marc Mc
11-07-2006, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Marc Mc
Congrats on your first track day. They are fun fun fun. My next is at Infineon on 11/24 and I can't wait.
I gotta ask though....How the hell did you get on that line over the corkscrew? Did you go too far and slide out the backend a bit? Just curious.
Marc Mc
I gotta ask though....How the hell did you get on that line over the corkscrew? Did you go too far and slide out the backend a bit? Just curious.
Marc Mc
11-07-2006, 07:34 PM
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Corkscrew = my favorite turn. Even though you aren't travelling that fast, more of a roller coaster.
Originally Posted by qu8ttro
No...I noticed when i was going down the corkscrew i wasn't turn to the right enough at turn 8b. So the next time around I got too excited and starting turning the car before i finished turn 8a. Pretty much didn't line up correctly. I'm kinda glad i did cause i knew where not to be afterthat..hehe
11-07-2006, 08:38 PM
#87
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Originally Posted by daveh
...
My pad knockback got so bad my brake pedal went to the floor after the corkscrew and I almost bit it coming down into T2 because of this. New hub assembiles are going on this week at Z Car Garage.
None of you tracksters get this??
My pad knockback got so bad my brake pedal went to the floor after the corkscrew and I almost bit it coming down into T2 because of this. New hub assembiles are going on this week at Z Car Garage.
None of you tracksters get this??
11-07-2006, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by GaryM05
Are you getting stock hub assemblies put in, or some type of upgraded ones? You and I (and very few others) seem to be the unlucky few to experience knockback on the Z. I'm curious to hear if you've got a source for an upgraded hub.
I'm hopeful the new hubs will work. I'll know this weekend.
11-08-2006, 02:46 AM
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Originally Posted by GaryM05
Originally Posted by daveh
My pad knockback got so bad my brake pedal went to the floor after the corkscrew and I almost bit it coming down into T2 because of this. New hub assembiles are going on this week at Z Car Garage.
None of you tracksters get this??
None of you tracksters get this??
11-08-2006, 05:35 AM
#90
I think most have answered but I will add a few things.
The Stock OEM and HPS brakes do tend to glaze with extended heat applied (IE Riding the brakes, or insufficient cooling). They also transfer a lot of heat to the caliper, thus the fluid as well. Either will cause decreased braking in a session. If it is a fluid issue then the brakes will return after a cooling down or a bleed if needed. If the brakes still feel weaker, but still have a strong petal feel, it could be a glazed pad and only new pads will fix it. Stack gave a good description to tell the difference. The OEM and standard street pads seem to wear badly on the rear, more than the front in hard use so make sure you check all the wheels.
Brakes actually like short hard burst vs. long softer applications. As you are learning the line and track, choose a braking point that is conservative and will get you speed down to what you want with a hard brake. As you get faster move the brake point back a bit each time but still apply a hard but not necessarily full, maybe 90%. Long braking points with say 60% will keep the pads and calipers on the hot rotor transferring more heat and wearing the pad more.
The Stock OEM and HPS brakes do tend to glaze with extended heat applied (IE Riding the brakes, or insufficient cooling). They also transfer a lot of heat to the caliper, thus the fluid as well. Either will cause decreased braking in a session. If it is a fluid issue then the brakes will return after a cooling down or a bleed if needed. If the brakes still feel weaker, but still have a strong petal feel, it could be a glazed pad and only new pads will fix it. Stack gave a good description to tell the difference. The OEM and standard street pads seem to wear badly on the rear, more than the front in hard use so make sure you check all the wheels.
Brakes actually like short hard burst vs. long softer applications. As you are learning the line and track, choose a braking point that is conservative and will get you speed down to what you want with a hard brake. As you get faster move the brake point back a bit each time but still apply a hard but not necessarily full, maybe 90%. Long braking points with say 60% will keep the pads and calipers on the hot rotor transferring more heat and wearing the pad more.
11-08-2006, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by mhoward1
I think most have answered but I will add a few things.
The Stock OEM and HPS brakes do tend to glaze with extended heat applied (IE Riding the brakes, or insufficient cooling). They also transfer a lot of heat to the caliper, thus the fluid as well. Either will cause decreased braking in a session. If it is a fluid issue then the brakes will return after a cooling down or a bleed if needed. If the brakes still feel weaker, but still have a strong petal feel, it could be a glazed pad and only new pads will fix it. Stack gave a good description to tell the difference. The OEM and standard street pads seem to wear badly on the rear, more than the front in hard use so make sure you check all the wheels.
Brakes actually like short hard burst vs. long softer applications. As you are learning the line and track, choose a braking point that is conservative and will get you speed down to what you want with a hard brake. As you get faster move the brake point back a bit each time but still apply a hard but not necessarily full, maybe 90%. Long braking points with say 60% will keep the pads and calipers on the hot rotor transferring more heat and wearing the pad more.
The Stock OEM and HPS brakes do tend to glaze with extended heat applied (IE Riding the brakes, or insufficient cooling). They also transfer a lot of heat to the caliper, thus the fluid as well. Either will cause decreased braking in a session. If it is a fluid issue then the brakes will return after a cooling down or a bleed if needed. If the brakes still feel weaker, but still have a strong petal feel, it could be a glazed pad and only new pads will fix it. Stack gave a good description to tell the difference. The OEM and standard street pads seem to wear badly on the rear, more than the front in hard use so make sure you check all the wheels.
Brakes actually like short hard burst vs. long softer applications. As you are learning the line and track, choose a braking point that is conservative and will get you speed down to what you want with a hard brake. As you get faster move the brake point back a bit each time but still apply a hard but not necessarily full, maybe 90%. Long braking points with say 60% will keep the pads and calipers on the hot rotor transferring more heat and wearing the pad more.
11-08-2006, 09:47 AM
#92
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Originally Posted by Sk8fe
Can you or daveh describe "knockback" in more detail? Is this condition noticable at any speeds or only under braking from high speeds? Thx.
I would like to know more about "knockback" also.
11-08-2006, 11:07 AM
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Knockback - http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_knockback.shtml
I've experienced this too many times with my oem Brembos. I too will be replacing my front hubs. Hope that helps.
I've experienced this too many times with my oem Brembos. I too will be replacing my front hubs. Hope that helps.
11-08-2006, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by arizzee
Knockback - http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_knockback.shtml
I've experienced this too many times with my oem Brembos. I too will be replacing my front hubs. Hope that helps.
I've experienced this too many times with my oem Brembos. I too will be replacing my front hubs. Hope that helps.
Definitely something I don't want to experience. Good to know what watch out for. Thanks for the info.
11-08-2006, 01:15 PM
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+1 Thanks for the knockback link!
Now I understand why a race car driver will tap the brake with their left foot on the straight away before entering a heavy braking zone. I always thought that it was them checking to make sure they still had brakes (that the pedal didn't go to the floor). I'm sure it is both, but doing so corrects their knockback situation.
I love watching Rolex Grand Am series, World Speed GT or ALMS on Speed when they have foot-cams setup. It is just awesome to watch their footwork.
Now I understand why a race car driver will tap the brake with their left foot on the straight away before entering a heavy braking zone. I always thought that it was them checking to make sure they still had brakes (that the pedal didn't go to the floor). I'm sure it is both, but doing so corrects their knockback situation.
I love watching Rolex Grand Am series, World Speed GT or ALMS on Speed when they have foot-cams setup.
It is just awesome to watch their footwork.
11-08-2006, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Sk8fe
+1 Thanks for the knockback link!
Now I understand why a race car driver will tap the brake with their left foot on the straight away before entering a heavy braking zone. I always thought that it was them checking to make sure they still had brakes (that the pedal didn't go to the floor). I'm sure it is both, but doing so corrects their knockback situation.
I love watching Rolex Grand Am series, World Speed GT or ALMS on Speed when they have foot-cams setup. It is just awesome to watch their footwork.
Now I understand why a race car driver will tap the brake with their left foot on the straight away before entering a heavy braking zone. I always thought that it was them checking to make sure they still had brakes (that the pedal didn't go to the floor). I'm sure it is both, but doing so corrects their knockback situation.
I love watching Rolex Grand Am series, World Speed GT or ALMS on Speed when they have foot-cams setup.
It is just awesome to watch their footwork.If you really wanna see footwork...go checkout some best motoring videos. They're corny as hell but they are fun to watch.
11-09-2006, 03:43 AM
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Originally Posted by arizzee
Knockback - http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_knockback.shtml
I've experienced this too many times with my oem Brembos. I too will be replacing my front hubs. Hope that helps.
I've experienced this too many times with my oem Brembos. I too will be replacing my front hubs. Hope that helps.
Everyone I have talked to said 615's are great for the first handful of laps but get greasey half way or two-thirds into a 20 minute stint out on the track.
11-09-2006, 04:23 AM
#98
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Originally Posted by Sk8fe
How does replacing your front hubs fix this? Wont you still get knockback even with the new front hubs? I would expect knockback to be more prevalent when running R-Compound tires, but Falken 615's too!??? Everyone I have talked to said 615's are great for the first handful of laps but get greasey half way or two-thirds into a 20 minute stint out on the track.
Everyone I have talked to said 615's are great for the first handful of laps but get greasey half way or two-thirds into a 20 minute stint out on the track.As for tires, I agree that r-comps would likely increase the effect, but I've had knockback even on the street after some particularly spirited transitions (traffic circles, etc).
11-09-2006, 04:24 AM
#99
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Originally Posted by daveh
Just getting stock hub assemblies. Upgraded hubs are big bucks. If that doesn't work, than I might consider some springs inside my stoptechs to keep the pistons in place.
I'm hopeful the new hubs will work. I'll know this weekend.
I'm hopeful the new hubs will work. I'll know this weekend.
Keep us posted!
11-09-2006, 04:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Sk8fe
How does replacing your front hubs fix this? Wont you still get knockback even with the new front hubs? I would expect knockback to be more prevalent when running R-Compound tires, but Falken 615's too!??? Everyone I have talked to said 615's are great for the first handful of laps but get greasey half way or two-thirds into a 20 minute stint out on the track.
Everyone I have talked to said 615's are great for the first handful of laps but get greasey half way or two-thirds into a 20 minute stint out on the track.As far as the Falken RT-615s go, I don't drive that fast
But in all seriousness, I believe most people overinflate these. When they first came out, on Falken's website, they had an application chart showing their recommended camber and inflation values. I've followed those recommendations with good results. FTR, 275/35/18 front 1.5 neg deg @32 psi, rear 2.0 neg deg @30psi.
Last edited by arizzee; 11-09-2006 at 04:27 AM.