mhoward1

www.timetrials.net

MIAPLAYA

iTrader: (3)

Yeah i'm well aware of the cause, effect, and remedy for body roll. I was referring to the suspension system as a whole when I mentioned VRTs cars. I still maintain I am not a fan of twin tube struts on a track car.

Sharif@Forged

iTrader: (92)

I am running a Koyo radiator, and we are using the rear cylinder cooling modications. Seems to work very well so far. Things may change, during the summer months and higher ambient temps.

Panoz is expensive, but you do gets loads of track time, which I liked. 4-5 30min sessions.

The only time a consider a track day "bad"...is when the event is overbooked.

Alberto

iTrader: (14)

Have any more pics? One day when I save some loot for road race tires I'll take my weaksauce set-up out to Summit Point. Nice job Sharif...

mhoward1

Yea, we offer 3 to 4 30 minute sessions too. NASA runs a good show, but they run so many events and classes during a day that sometimes track time is limited.

Sharif@Forged

iTrader: (92)

I would agree with that..no doubt. We've spent so much money on this shop car...testing...trying, things, that we have to draw the line somewhere...LOL.

I would certainly enjoy testing out some different suspensions, and I dont claim that Tein's are the best. Simply...they did a very good job for me and Jose's setups.

MoodDude

I am running a Koyo radiator and a Setrab oil cooler. Yet, with R-compounds and getting on full throttle all the time, once summer comes - you will be suprised.

And if you are looking for more track time for less money than Panoz - try CHIN Motorsports.

Tri-angleZ club is also a good alternative to NASA. Yet, both of them are about HPDE and Racing. Where as Panoz and Chin are all about HPDE. And with Panoz, their instruction is kind of a joke, and 5 - 30 min sessions are nothing compared to Chin's 5 hours of OPEN track time and Chin is less money.

Only problem is that Panoz keeps just about every HPDE group out of his Road Atlanta track since the other track he owns (Sebring) as soon as he let Chin run there he had to shut down his Panoz HPDE program there since no one wanted to pay more money for less track time with amost no instruction.

Scott Webb

Hey there Sharif - Great to read that you're having so much fun with your Z on the track! I only got to drive mine at Buttonwillow that one time, but it was a great experience. You'll have to bring that beast back to the West Coast one of these days.

Thought of you when I changed planes in Charlotte during the holidays, but I see now that you list GA as home.

Sharif@Forged

iTrader: (92)

You are correct. Chin looks really nice. I was supposed to drive at Sebring, but I signed up too late, and there was no room. Chin looks like a great value.

Are you running a stock block? Do you have the rear cylinder bypass modification? It has been a huge improvement. Is your heater working ok? If not, you might be seeing the first signs of head lift.

Tuning also has a lot to do, with the types of engine operating temps you will experience on the track. There are things we can do, to make these cars run cooler, aside from the usual suspects, such as oil coolers, and upgraded rads.

Sharif@Forged

iTrader: (92)

Hey Scott...long time no speak! I keep getting your email updates, and it sounds like you are racking up some impressive racing wins! I still remember the good ol days, of circling around Angeles Crest Hwy at totally illegal speeds, and watching you pull away from me at ever turn....until I could see you no more.

Yup, we are in Marietta GA...ATL area. Check our our new website, and if you are ever in ATL, give us a call! We have some really fun toys you can drive. www.forgedperformance.com/store

ILLBZNU

iTrader: (4)

That sounds like alot of fun. Hopefully I'll be running up at VIR in April assuming my planned GTK conversion goes well. I can't wait to beat up on my friend with his Z06. Anyway, thanks agian for all the advice, and I am planning on swapping my level 5's in next week.

MoodDude

Yes - I am running a stock block and I am not seeing any signs of head lift. I run a really low boost on my motor - 9psi.

I don't really buy into your cylinder bypass modification since by the conservation of energy, the heat created in the engine will need to be expelled in the radiator weather it is the oil or water. So by having the water flow more freely around a certain area of the engine still does nothing to expell the heat from the radiator. You need to either increase the water flow rate in the engine, improve the heat transfer of the liquid media to the radiator metal, improve the heat transfer of the air to the radiator metal.

The only thing I can see the bypass modification doing is preventing a hot spot to be created in that particular spot. Yet, I have been know to be wrong about a lot of things - so if you can explain the thermodynamics of how your modification improves cooling I may try it.

I have tuned the engine to run cooler with fuel and timing.

I didn't have any problem until I changed to 275 front and 305 rear R-compounds. I am able to push the car a lot harder now than when I was running 265 front and 295 rear R-compounds since I had to break ealier and wasn't able to get on the power as soon which gave the engine a chance to cool. Yet, with these new tires - I almost never give the engine a chance to rest.

MoodDude

What - you are painting her blue, and I guess you are going to re-name her too?

Scott Webb

I've been keeping as busy as possible behind the wheel, and I recently updated my site to include 2006 (as well as a much-needed update to the resume section). I'll be driving for Sampson Racing for the 2007 NASA enduro season, and I'm working on a few other racing projects as well. Maybe one or two will bring me to Road Atlanta.

The site is impressive! So much for chocolate and tea, eh? If you guys ever decide to enter some endurance races, please keep me in mind!

Sharif@Forged

iTrader: (92)

Your comments are correct, in terms of heat transfer. But there is one missing piece. If we have coolant circulating through the block....front to back...it has to exit somewhere..correct? The stock coolant bypass, which travels from the driver's side head, to the passenger side is the OEM route. Still with me?

OK, with the OEM coolant routing, coolant travels up through the block, up through the heads. By introducing the bypass, we can now directly ventilate the rear cylinders directly to the bypass, rather than having the coolant restricted by the heads, and the smaller passages. The coolant is hottest towards the rear, so anything we can do to improve flow out of the block, will help with heat transfer. We have tested this on the dyno, and the results are solid. Other shops have reported the same results. Static coolant temps under load about 10 degrees cooler than OEM. But more importantly, the bypass eliminates the fast rise in temps under load...so we end up with more stable coolant temps as well.

It's a pretty inexpensive mod as well.

MoodDude

Sorry - but I am still not convinced, you are still only removing the heat generated in the engine, you are not improving the removal of the heat from the coolant or the oil. I only see this as helping if there is a hot spot created in the engine and on the VQ35 with its large coolant passages, I don't see this as a risk. I tryed water wetter with coolant and it worked, yet not claiming success since the weather was 10 degrees cooler from one event to the next at Sebring. If I still have problems I will then try water wetter and water.
And I didn't see any temperature problems at Road Atlanta when I was there. The full coarse at Sebring really tests your brakes and your engine. I found that Road Atlanta test your B*lls from the braking zone at turn 10 all the way through turn 12!
We should hook up at a Sebring Chin event as I want to see if you have problems there. Also, at Chin events you get to see how well your car performs against race cars especially the GT3 cup cars and 355 challange cars as that is the class of cars our modified cars would compete against in a race.
Also, your suspension set up seems a little off for a road coarse, did you take tire temps?
Actually- I have to appologies for this coming out wrong, but certain things get me mad on these forums:
-talking about the cars you passed without stating your lap times
-Talking about the hp your car makes on the AutoX/Road forum
-Telling people about your set up without asking a question. So you are asking us to copy your set up without hard data from a test/tune on track.

Sorry

Sharif@Forged

iTrader: (92)

Unlike some, I go out there to have fun, and have never professed to be a track guru. In fact, if you revisit my post, I am admittedly a complete amateur. Jose, with his normally aspirated setup and 275whp (half the power I have), was much much faster than me in the corners....I had no chance of keeping up. He is a very humble man, and I find that the guys that talk the least, are usually the fastest on the track. So I would ask that you take a deep breath and relax.

I know a lot more about building and tuning cars...rather than driving them on race tracks. I will leave that to the other experts. And you and I both know, the the driver is probably 80% related to how well a car performs on the track. Videos of my car passing supercars, doesnt really prove a whole lot...but it sure is fun to watch!

I am also sorry of I violated your person forum rules...I am just here to have fun and learn on the track.

I was trying to share some of our tested and proven strategies that MAY help in controlling this heat issue you seem to be having. Having an open mind, and evolving, is the only way to succeed. Very few guys take their super high powered cars out to the track, so I just thought it would be fun to share the experience.

In regards to cooling, you explained it yourself. There is a bottleneck of hot coolant, that needs to leave the block quickly....the bypass does this. I figured the Nissan engineers know a thing or two about buildling engines, as this exact same coolant bypass is standard on the VQ35 pathfinders, since they assumed that those people would be towing, and putting additional load on the engine.

And for the record, I hate water wetter type products. I have seen zero improvement on the dyno, and the manufacturer's claim are severely overstated. They also caused my Darton cast iron sleeves to rust. I will never use that stuff.

When are you tracking in this area again? Maybe you could show me some lines...since you have more experience on these tracks.

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

Sharif, great post and thanks for sharing the fun you have with your car at Road Atlanta. I would so love to drive that track some day.
I am going up to Laguna Seca tomorrow and will be running with Doug Gale and his Track-masters Racing group, sandwiched in with some NASA folks. Forcast is for bright sunny skies and temps in the low sixties. Happy conditions for FI motors!
After my last run at Buttonwillow I had to take some time out for repairs. Had a few problems to correct, which is going to happen when you run hard. I just love Laguna Seca, and will do almost anything to get up there whenever they have a track day opening.
Get some video for us on the next outing! And keep these great posts coming. For most of the folks, running on the track is not something they are going to do often, if ever. But one of the great things about it is that it can give you a tremendous understanding as a car builder for what the car is doing at the limits, and helps you be an even better car builder...besides just being plain fun. What it does for the customers is help assure them that they are getting a car that doesn't just look good on paper....it is a proven platform under the most demanding of conditions. And that is a huge distinguishing element from most tuner operations. I applaud all that you are doing for the enthusiast community. You are clearly one of the most knowledgeable builders in this marque that is out there, and it shows through time after time.
Cheers,
Ed

Sharif@Forged

iTrader: (92)

Hi Ed, great to see your posts again! I hear you loud and clear. When you push these cars hard...things will break from time to time, as evidenced by racing teams with massive budgets that STILL break things. You are 100% correct....in the back of mind...I sorta hope that something breaks on our shop car, so that it doesnt happen to a customer's car. As long as that "something" doesnt cause me to completely loose control of the vehicle!

You are one of the fastest guys out there with a VQ35 street car....keep up the good work. I miss my West Coast tracks immensly, but I am sure our paths with cross again. Same invitation is out to you, as with Scott: If you are ever near the Atlanta area, please stop by.

Ed, do you have any plans to race your car in any sanctioned racing events? Maybe you have done this already?

Eagle1

iTrader: (2)

If you are going to squeak about what it costs to repair the wear and tear when you track it....one must then go pursue another hobby. Safety first, so it just is not an option but to open the wallet and pay up. And yikes, rotors and pads, shocks, tires, oil and filters, bushings....stuff just gets chewed up in a year that would normally last 5 or even 10 years. That is the way it is. Big time costs.

I am not racing because the commitments to family and job have to come first, and I just do not have the "bug". It no longer is "fun" if I am going to do competitive racing so I have resisted it. This may be a flash bulletin, but there is plenty of competition in the daily job! Taking precious free time and seeking more is not of interest. And the time commitment to a racing program would be huge. If it was my passion, if there was ego involved, if there were ambitions for some type of recognition or remuneration, fine. But there is not. Instead it is the comraderie, the learning, and working on the skills to hone and sharpen them. Probably will hang it up in a year or so and go after other endeavors. In a universe of personal ignorance, I have lots of directions still open to me to explore!!!

Going to a trainer 4 days a week now; former NFL cornerback and bodybuilder whose routines have transformed two of my sons into amazing specimens. Too late for me to do that, but at least I can claw back into some semblance of physical shape. (Even dads like to have a ripple six pack). Every day I get back from that 6AM workout I think I am going to expire from a program that is a cardio, balance, reflex speed, weights interval session that goes non stop for 60 to 75 minutes. Total diet change, drinking a gallon of water every day (130 ounces), amino acid supplements, the whole drill.........But there is good news. Changing wheels and tires is like moving checkers. The great thing is that when I get out of the car on track days, I just lay on my back and bench press my wheel chair two hundred times while the car cools down and I wait for my next session on the track.