And suspension. You need to be able to put it to the ground, and turn. Ebay JDM coil-overs FTL.

 

These?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Racin...item27ac4ae77f

I didn't know shock absorbers had needs... ;-(

Or maybe these?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/GODSP...item2ea7dd3d7f

I guess that's all you need to be the ultimate phenominal racer...

 

Quick update:

Went to the Blytheville Tri-State NT this past weekend, ended up trophying at second in class behind an S2000 driven by an Evo instructor (Andy Hohl--nice guy, very good driver). His car is fairly well-prepped, with headers, HFCs, an AP1 ECU on an AP2 for the extra revs, etc, but he was driving it alone on the first day, so he didn't have very warm tires.

I was about 1.4 seconds back each run on the timed portion, though he and his co-driver both got down to mid 62s on their bonus runs. Best I could muster was a 64.8, putting me 2.5-3 seconds per run behind them.

While I'm the first to admit I'm not as good a driver as Andy (yet, anyway) and my car wasn't max-prepped for the class, I feel pretty confident in saying there weren't 3 seconds per run left in the car. Looking at the data and comparing it to a fast CSP Miata, there's just no way this car goes that fast on 255 width tires.

So I'm looking at selling the car and jumping ship to the Honda camp.

Thought I should let you guys know before anyone goes investing in the car.

Some of the reasons for the shift: too much weight on too little tire, not enough speed in second gear to keep pace with the S2Ks. I think the NC Miata is a second-place car for the gearing reason too. An AP2 with raised rev limiter can run mid-high 60s in second. That's about 10mph more than my car on 255/40/17s.

 

Those two (Andy and his Codriver) are ******! Just kidding, they are actually both former codriver's of mine. Andy when I ran the 350Z and Nick for a while in my Z06.

I don't know the details on your car, what are you looking to get for it?

 

Andy actually mentioned you, and I told him your blog was one of my biggest sources for setup advice when I was running in B stock. Belated thanks!

As for my car, it's an 03 Enthusiast in Brickyard. Very clean except for the front bumper (cone strikes!).

Mod list:
Koni TrueChoice DAs with 650lb Hypercoils front
Koni yellows with unknown 500lb rears on adjustable perches
SPL v2 front upper A-arms
SSR Type C RS 17x8.5 wheels
custom cat-back exhaust (very light, not loud)

That's about $3,500 worth of parts at retail.

Very, very easy to drive, controllable on the limit and pretty well setup--would probably take some of the rear camber out though. About 60-70% of the way to a full STR build. Just need seats, intake/headers/HFCs and a good diff plus an ECU tune.

I have all the stock parts and could put it back to OEM.

It NADAs at $15,625 (46,500mi or so) and BlueBooks at $16,010 retail/$12,800-13,600 as between good and excellent condition private party (it really is). The performance parts would be on top of that.

But I'm not sure on the sale yet, in part because I'm not sure what I'd be going to.

 

I wouldn't give up just yet.

I'm planning on buying/building in the spring. Hoping to get my old car back, but we'll see if my buddy will sell it or not. If not I'll likely get a base model and start from there.

 

Hey whaddya know? I have a log-in here too!

I wouldn't give up just yet - now that I see your build list - you have a long way to go. Whats the motion ratios on the car? The first thing that hits me is that your spring rates seem super low.

The advantage your car has is power - until you get the right tires and a diff on there - I don't think you'll know the true potential of the car. I'd be all over the Hankooks or Dunlops if I were you.



BTW - Andy ran a 61.7 on his second Challenge run. We were on 130run/2500+ mile tires. The car was crud for the most part - Andy is really good at driving around car problems, I on the other hand - am not good at that. Full potential of the car was well into the mid to low 60's on that course.


If I could only get someone to buy my 240z/302 project I'd feel a lot better about the Penske's I'm about to buy this week...



Nick Jackson (s2000)

 

That's right, Andy did get into the 61s...forgot about that (selective memory?)

So what your saying though is that my car has 5 seconds left in it between build and driver? I don't know if there's any point chasing that dragon. I certainly don't feel like I'm enough of a talent to wring that much out of a diff and some lighter exhaust pieces.

What I really don't know how to make up is the 10mph in second gear that I'm giving up. That's one of the main advantages the RX8s had over the Z in B Stock, and the data says that's worth a lot of time. Shifting to 3rd and back isn't quite the same.

The motion ratios for the car (haven't measured, this is second hand) are: .79 front and .36 rear.

The spring rates I'm running are actually a good bit higher than the 500f/425r recommended by most of the people "in the know" for the 350Z. I like a high-frequency car for my style though. The car definitely doesn't feel soft anywhere, or roll very much even at stock ride height.

It even pulled and held a consistent curve of 1.2-1.35gs through the end of the sweeper on Sunday, which is pretty hooked up for street tires.

Speaking of tires, I was on 100+ run, 6000mi XSs. So I guess I wasn't really too far ahead of the game there either.

Still, as driveable as the car is right now and as on-line as the data says we were, I just don't see 5 seconds on that course. 2 seconds, maybe, with 100lbs out of the car and a diff.

But even then I'd still be 300-400lbs heavier than a fully-prepped S2K and about 700lbs heavier than an NC Miata.

Just seems like a losing battle, and I've had enough of that in B Stock.

edit to add: build list above wasn't complete: have a 35mm Cobb front anti-roll bar installed on the second notch. Full stiff was too stiff with the new springs.

 

guitarist: Nice to see your honestly about the whole thing. I have felt the Z is a lost cause for STR. Sure if built well, you might trophy, but I never see one winning.

Just like this year at Nat's in a very well prepped BS 350z, I was off the leaders pace. I don't see a 350Z with the current crop of drivers running in BS winning. Trophy sure, I was a cone away. I think the talent has risin in BS the last couple years. STR is going to be the same way.

 

I hope you stay in BS the new CS and run the Nismo there.

 

+1000000!

I honestly think that a well-driven Nismo would be able to keep up with a 370Z, and that both could outperform a RX-8, Miata MS-R, or a Solstice ZOK.

 

On the right course, maybe, but those courses aren't "nationals style" courses. The advantages of gearing, weight and balance are all more in favor of the RX-8 and Z0K/MS-R than the Z. And I think the results bear that out. The fact that the top drivers aren't choosing the Z (of any flavor, really), even after driving it, says a lot. Manufacturer contingency isn't worth that much.

Running a Nismo in stock also means spending Corvette type money on race rubber and not going near as fast, which doesn't make a lot of sense either, especially with the C5s now in the new AS costing about half/two-thirds as much as a new(ish) Nismo Z.

But this is the STR thread--and I think most of the same points apply here. Not that an STR 350Z isn't a ton of fun to drive--my car is a blast. It's just not quite as fast on the same amount of tire as a 2600-2700lb S2K on a transition-heavy, momentum-maintenance course, like they run at most national events.

 

So guitarist are you still planning on running STR?

A fellow Z autox'er (Ross Maguire) and I are thinking of co-driving my car for STR next year.

Biggest problem I see right now is finding the right tire size. With a 18" wheel setup, best tire size that matches oem is 255/40/18 which only the Falken 615's come in. Then if I were to run 17's, I'd want to run 255/45/17 but nobody makes that. So next up is 255/40/17 which puts me about 3% smaller, and with the DE motor I already have a lower rpm limit and the smaller dia would make it worse. So I'd be mad shifting the entire time.

So it doesn't look very promising for us to run STR even though we're both considering it (and he's a very fast driver so it would definitely look good for the Z's)

 

Yes, I'm still planning on running STR. I'll just be driving an S2000.

As for tire size, I wouldn't bother trying to match OEM diameter. I, too, ran up against this problem--redline/fuel cut at 57.4 mph, observed by my data acq unit--but it's the price you pay for having competitive, affordable tires. I was running 255/40/17. This is just one of the Z's many shortcomings in autocross, especially the earlier models--which are the lightest.

You could still take a Z, build it really well, drive it really well, and do well at nationals or national tours, but I am saying that an equivalent amount of building and driving would pay off better in an S2000 or Miata. I don't think it's going to be a winner, but maybe a bottom-half-of-trophies car.

That said, if it's what you've got and you don't want to change, do it. My STR Z is one of the most balanced, fun-to-drive cars I've autocrossed.

 

Ditto, x100!

 

I thought about doing exactly that, going around and being first non-S2000/Miata loser everywhere I could, and writing in to get into STU.

But STU is a formula class, so the exception is pretty unlikely. And I really don't want to have to play against 300+hp turbo cars that really gain from the exhaust and tuning allowances, especially when they get AWD to boot.

Once someone really figures out the setup on the EvoX/new STI, I think the Z would be proper "effed" there, too, even on 285s.

 

I had a good friend email me yesterday for advice on a new race car for next year. The S2K is at the top of his list. And of course he will need help and advice on set-up, and a co-driver to help with development, sooooooooo.....

He he he....

 

so depressing to read all this.....makes it look like we all bought the wrong car.......even though it feels so good to drive.

 

Nah, we didn't buy the wrong car, it just isn't really classed where it should have been (FS) or those of us who are capable aren't stepping up to the plate with a properly prepared (and in repair...) car.

However, the limit of 255 street tires on the 350Z is ridiculous. However, at least it's a place to play.

 

STU-2 is what the SCCA should have done. It was working great in Florida.