355 mm Brembo vs 355 mm Stoptech vs Brembo Stock
09-23-2005 | 10:53 AM
#21
Originally Posted by AznIceRckt
my humble opinion on stoptech...
is that they are significantly overpriced for what you get. it is a great product... see them at shows, forums, and at the track. they work great.
stoptech was founded in 1999... brembo has been around for over 60 years... brembo is named after the brembo river... , stoptech means (i think)... stopping-technology? creative, not for me though. (at the price).
i came really close to springing for a nice 14" 4/4 piston stoptech. then i went to a few shows that month, and saw over 10 cars sponsored by stoptech... among them stupid vehicles with scissor doors, neon... things like that. if you pay stoptech's price... your money goes to the sponsorship of the cars. i hate that. it is called business. it is promotion of your product. everyone does it, some more obviously then others. newer companies need to advertise to make their name. now there is this incredible saturation in the market of new companies making things that aren't reliable. take kinetix racing.. I recall lots of people having problems with their plenums.. at minimum they were trying to target a lower price point.
lots of forumites will stand up for their stoptechs because they shelled out a few grand... when they could have an ap racing for the same cost... or a brembo for slightly more. it is called-- being biased.
Now... brembo and ap racing wouldn't sponsor you if you begged them... they are too busy winning f1 nascar wrc and other races. When was the last time you saw a brembo sponsored car that WASN'T built by a large company/tuner.
To me, it is a process of valuation. It I pay 4k for a stoptech kit, I sure as hell better not see some extravagent show car who got the same brakes for free, and sees no track time. I'd surely rather pay more for a brembo kit... and crack a large smile every time a race car goes by (that has brembos)..
is that they are significantly overpriced for what you get. it is a great product... see them at shows, forums, and at the track. they work great.
stoptech was founded in 1999... brembo has been around for over 60 years... brembo is named after the brembo river... , stoptech means (i think)... stopping-technology? creative, not for me though. (at the price).
i came really close to springing for a nice 14" 4/4 piston stoptech. then i went to a few shows that month, and saw over 10 cars sponsored by stoptech... among them stupid vehicles with scissor doors, neon... things like that. if you pay stoptech's price... your money goes to the sponsorship of the cars. i hate that. it is called business. it is promotion of your product. everyone does it, some more obviously then others. newer companies need to advertise to make their name. now there is this incredible saturation in the market of new companies making things that aren't reliable. take kinetix racing.. I recall lots of people having problems with their plenums.. at minimum they were trying to target a lower price point.
lots of forumites will stand up for their stoptechs because they shelled out a few grand... when they could have an ap racing for the same cost... or a brembo for slightly more. it is called-- being biased.
Now... brembo and ap racing wouldn't sponsor you if you begged them... they are too busy winning f1 nascar wrc and other races. When was the last time you saw a brembo sponsored car that WASN'T built by a large company/tuner.
To me, it is a process of valuation. It I pay 4k for a stoptech kit, I sure as hell better not see some extravagent show car who got the same brakes for free, and sees no track time. I'd surely rather pay more for a brembo kit... and crack a large smile every time a race car goes by (that has brembos)..
09-23-2005 | 11:39 AM
#22
IMO I think stoptech is a little better than the stock brembo kit, though if you set up your stock brembos with stoptech rotors, some SS brake lines, some good pads, good brake fluid, you should be good for your typical 20 min track session. But yeah I think the stoptech kit will hold up slightly better even on a 20 min session
I think it's when you start getting into 3 hour races like what 350EVO or Perf. Nissan do that you can start getting some definite fade on the brembos as opposed to the stoptechs
You can take your brakes a step further and get some air ducts or the new brake pad heatsinks that were written about in the new SportZ issue that only fit the brembo sized pads so far I think. Those two things might be enough to push the brembos to be equal to the stoptechs or possibly better, who knows.
From what I remember, the brembo kit with stoptech rotors weigh about 6 lbs less than the full stoptech kit
I think it's when you start getting into 3 hour races like what 350EVO or Perf. Nissan do that you can start getting some definite fade on the brembos as opposed to the stoptechs
You can take your brakes a step further and get some air ducts or the new brake pad heatsinks that were written about in the new SportZ issue that only fit the brembo sized pads so far I think. Those two things might be enough to push the brembos to be equal to the stoptechs or possibly better, who knows.
From what I remember, the brembo kit with stoptech rotors weigh about 6 lbs less than the full stoptech kit
09-23-2005 | 12:17 PM
#23
At the same time I crack a big smile walking through the VIR pits and seeing Stoptech BBKs on many cars that are either prepping for a track session, or have just finished, knowing that the same BBK is available for my Z. On the other hand I can watch NBC/Fox and see AP calipers during pit stops, and recognize the name, but also that no single component is anything like what they make available for our Zs.
I doubt Stoptech is giving many BBKs away, even for show cars (I don't think they're big enough/making enough profit to do it). At the same time, I agree, I'd rather not see them on a car with vert doors, etc.
I guess what I'm saying is this: Yes, Brembo is a better name, makes better racing products for higher level programs. But no, they don't use the same components on our cars as they do on the cars we admire, and I'm willing to bet that they're BBK sales are run off the name, unlike Stoptech, where the race brake, and BBKs for our cars are one and the same.
I doubt Stoptech is giving many BBKs away, even for show cars (I don't think they're big enough/making enough profit to do it). At the same time, I agree, I'd rather not see them on a car with vert doors, etc.
I guess what I'm saying is this: Yes, Brembo is a better name, makes better racing products for higher level programs. But no, they don't use the same components on our cars as they do on the cars we admire, and I'm willing to bet that they're BBK sales are run off the name, unlike Stoptech, where the race brake, and BBKs for our cars are one and the same.
09-23-2005 | 12:28 PM
#24
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Originally Posted by Landbarger
At the same time I crack a big smile walking through the VIR pits and seeing Stoptech BBKs on many cars that are either prepping for a track session, or have just finished, knowing that the same BBK is available for my Z. On the other hand I can watch NBC/Fox and see AP calipers during pit stops, and recognize the name, but also that no single component is anything like what they make available for our Zs.
I doubt Stoptech is giving many BBKs away, even for show cars (I don't think they're big enough/making enough profit to do it). At the same time, I agree, I'd rather not see them on a car with vert doors, etc.
I guess what I'm saying is this: Yes, Brembo is a better name, makes better racing products for higher level programs. But no, they don't use the same components on our cars as they do on the cars we admire, and I'm willing to bet that they're BBK sales are run off the name, unlike Stoptech, where the race brake, and BBKs for our cars are one and the same.
I doubt Stoptech is giving many BBKs away, even for show cars (I don't think they're big enough/making enough profit to do it). At the same time, I agree, I'd rather not see them on a car with vert doors, etc.
I guess what I'm saying is this: Yes, Brembo is a better name, makes better racing products for higher level programs. But no, they don't use the same components on our cars as they do on the cars we admire, and I'm willing to bet that they're BBK sales are run off the name, unlike Stoptech, where the race brake, and BBKs for our cars are one and the same.
09-23-2005 | 12:54 PM
#25
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Originally Posted by King Tut
Thats about the response I would expect from a G35 Sedan automatic owner. Go ahead and get your more expensive Brembos and dream about owning a sports car when you see the race cars with Brembos.
I'd gladly post about my other... (non-auto) cars... i think you would get really pissy then. It is actually fun having an auto track car, considering everything else I own is stick or sequential. And... I never said I had brembos... or stoptechs. I have 2/1 piston altima brakes. Nothing wrong with that... it is a stipped G35 sedan toy car... lol.
And Vara events? Okay... well I'll be at buttonwillow or willow this weekend for both VARA events. I'll count how many stoptech's I see. There is also no stoptech presence overseas... where the tuning market originated. I think on my next bi-annual nordschliefe trip I'll wear a stoptech shirt, and see if anyone knows what it is. Brembo is only more expensive to people who buy it with our exchange rates (euro vs dollar)... go to europe.
09-23-2005 | 12:58 PM
#26
from what i understand, brembo does not actually make the stock track brakes for the Z. Some other company does and Brembo buys them and puts their name on it.
Also the track brakes are the same exact brake used on EVO's, STI's and many other cars too but are given different part numbers so that brembo can keep control over the price of the "EVO brembos" vs "Z brembos" etc depending on how the market moves. If one type of car is like a $50k car with the same brakes as the other $30k car, they can adjust the price to charge the $50k car owners more for those brake parts even though they're the same thing. It's cheaper for them.
Anyone remember how Intel would mass produce Pentium Pro chips and it was cheaper for them to cut 2 pins to make it slower and sell them as regular Pentiums instead of manufacturing the chip completely from scratch?
Also the track brakes are the same exact brake used on EVO's, STI's and many other cars too but are given different part numbers so that brembo can keep control over the price of the "EVO brembos" vs "Z brembos" etc depending on how the market moves. If one type of car is like a $50k car with the same brakes as the other $30k car, they can adjust the price to charge the $50k car owners more for those brake parts even though they're the same thing. It's cheaper for them.
Anyone remember how Intel would mass produce Pentium Pro chips and it was cheaper for them to cut 2 pins to make it slower and sell them as regular Pentiums instead of manufacturing the chip completely from scratch?
Last edited by sentry65; 09-23-2005 at 01:01 PM.
09-23-2005 | 01:05 PM
#27
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Also 'KingTut-' I'm just simply voicing my opinion on a company... it happens all the time... grow up.
Oh... and getting slack from someone who has low-grade wannabe carbon-fiber composites on his/her car?
Now... let me ask you.. do you know what dry carbon is? Or even how carbon fibers works? How they weave together... diff materials? I'm sure your carbon fiber engine/battery cover and lip is just snazzy. The materials are 100% BELOW T300 grade... I don't know if you would know what that is though. Nothing below T700/T800 even has the strength or modulus over aluminum. What a waste of money.
And yes... when you say... race cars I "dream" of... you are right. I do dream of cars. I'm actually on my way to becoming an aero designer.. talk ish all you want... I think you might just be mad trying to make rent or your car payment or whatnot.
Oh... and getting slack from someone who has low-grade wannabe carbon-fiber composites on his/her car?
Now... let me ask you.. do you know what dry carbon is? Or even how carbon fibers works? How they weave together... diff materials? I'm sure your carbon fiber engine/battery cover and lip is just snazzy. The materials are 100% BELOW T300 grade... I don't know if you would know what that is though. Nothing below T700/T800 even has the strength or modulus over aluminum. What a waste of money.
And yes... when you say... race cars I "dream" of... you are right. I do dream of cars. I'm actually on my way to becoming an aero designer.. talk ish all you want... I think you might just be mad trying to make rent or your car payment or whatnot.
09-23-2005 | 01:08 PM
#28
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From: Golden, CO
Originally Posted by love_350z
You vote dont count.... you are biased...you own a pair of 13.1 inch Stoptech....LOL....by the way people, if you go for big brake kit...please go for 355 mm(14 inch) ones, not 338 mm (13 inch) which is .24 inch bigger than Stock Brembo Stock (12.76). What's the point? Mind as well get the stock brembo for cheaper price.
As for 13 vs. 14 inch...you are aware that even the 13" StopTech rotor is wider than the stock Brembo, which means that it has more airflow and higher heat capacity, right? Not to mention that the 13 is lighter than the 14 and can fit under a smaller wheel (smaller rotor = smaller rotating diameter = faster, while smaller wheel = cheaper tires.)
09-23-2005 | 01:54 PM
#29
Originally Posted by AznIceRckt
Oh... and getting slack from someone who has low-grade wannabe carbon-fiber composites on his/her car?
Now... let me ask you.. do you know what dry carbon is? Or even how carbon fibers works? How they weave together... diff materials? I'm sure your carbon fiber engine/battery cover and lip is just snazzy. The materials are 100% BELOW T300 grade... I don't know if you would know what that is though. Nothing below T700/T800 even has the strength or modulus over aluminum. What a waste of money.
I think you might just be mad trying to make rent or your car payment or whatnot.
Now... let me ask you.. do you know what dry carbon is? Or even how carbon fibers works? How they weave together... diff materials? I'm sure your carbon fiber engine/battery cover and lip is just snazzy. The materials are 100% BELOW T300 grade... I don't know if you would know what that is though. Nothing below T700/T800 even has the strength or modulus over aluminum. What a waste of money.
I think you might just be mad trying to make rent or your car payment or whatnot.
Last edited by King Tut; 09-23-2005 at 01:56 PM.
09-23-2005 | 03:30 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by GaryM05
Well of course I'm biased...I went through this exact research process, and determined which one met my need. The answer ws StopTech, not Track model or after-market Brembo. I don't see how you can contend that my vote doesn't count, when I've actually voted with my hard-earned money.
As for 13 vs. 14 inch...you are aware that even the 13" StopTech rotor is wider than the stock Brembo, which means that it has more airflow and higher heat capacity, right? Not to mention that the 13 is lighter than the 14 and can fit under a smaller wheel (smaller rotor = smaller rotating diameter = faster, while smaller wheel = cheaper tires.)
As for 13 vs. 14 inch...you are aware that even the 13" StopTech rotor is wider than the stock Brembo, which means that it has more airflow and higher heat capacity, right? Not to mention that the 13 is lighter than the 14 and can fit under a smaller wheel (smaller rotor = smaller rotating diameter = faster, while smaller wheel = cheaper tires.)
My advice for you, if you can't afford meat, stick with fat. Dont go for becan. LOL
09-23-2005 | 05:56 PM
#31
Originally Posted by sentry65
from what i understand, brembo does not actually make the stock track brakes for the Z. Some other company does and Brembo buys them and puts their name on it.
Also, the Grandam cup cars run 3 hour races on stock brembo brakes. (rules do not allow for aftermarket brakes). I think the stock brembo are plenty for anyone with the right setup. A) brake ducts B) pads C) rotors D) fluids.
Find it silly anyone modifies a brembo equipped Z with stoptech or whoever's brakes. Total waste of money... HYPE.
09-23-2005 | 07:16 PM
#32
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From: Golden, CO
Originally Posted by love_350z
If you do something, you gotta do it right. Dont do half-assx thing. 14inch is for better performance and look. You dont want guys look at your brake and say "Humm, that aftermarket brake size just look exactly like stock brembo, what's the point for upgrading? This guy is dumb or what?".
My advice for you, if you can't afford meat, stick with fat. Dont go for becan. LOL
My advice for you, if you can't afford meat, stick with fat. Dont go for becan. LOL
FYI - I upgraded to StopTech from the OEM non-Brembos...that's not exactly a half-assed upgrade, IMO. But then what do I know? I'm clearly a total moron about brakes and performance driving in general, even after 2 dozen track days in the Z.
09-23-2005 | 07:37 PM
#33
Man the stuff is really hitting the fan in here boys. All the kits are great and the OEM Brembos are great as well. Just pick the one that fits your budget and accomplishes your needs.
09-23-2005 | 08:21 PM
#34
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From: Los Angeles
Originally Posted by King Tut
Man the stuff is really hitting the fan in here boys. All the kits are great and the OEM Brembos are great as well. Just pick the one that fits your budget and accomplishes your needs.
and I apologize for talking trash on your car... immature on my part.
I actually track my g35 auto primarily to work on 2-foot driving.
As far as everyone talking about diameter... width is just as important. NASCARs run tiny brakes (diameter wise) to fit under 15" wheels. They are quite wide though.
Does anyone make a full- trailing caliper 4 wheel BBK? The stock calipers and most BBK's i've seen are leading-calipers.. I like trailing for cooling... I'm not about to put brake ducts all over the place.
09-23-2005 | 08:31 PM
#35
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[QUOTE=AznIceRckt]
As far as everyone talking about diameter... width is just as important. NASCARs run tiny brakes (diameter wise) to fit under 15" wheels. They are quite wide though.
QUOTE]
Nascars is the short cut for NASTY CARS. Why do they even race if all car looks the same.
By the way, if you love american cars so much, why are you driving a japanese car? To me, american cars are just nasty and poor craftmanship
As far as everyone talking about diameter... width is just as important. NASCARs run tiny brakes (diameter wise) to fit under 15" wheels. They are quite wide though.
QUOTE]
Nascars is the short cut for NASTY CARS. Why do they even race if all car looks the same.
By the way, if you love american cars so much, why are you driving a japanese car? To me, american cars are just nasty and poor craftmanship
09-24-2005 | 08:15 AM
#36
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From: Los Angeles
[QUOTE=love_350z]
hehe 'nasty cars'.. that is a good one. well, I used to be specifically interested in only european/japanese vehicles/racing... but eventually i "branched out" and now I try and appreciate every car for what it is worth (as long as it accomplishes its purpose well). I actually have 2 japanese cars, 1 japanese bike, and 1 german car.
I've actually read that NASCAR brakes are incredibly hard to design. 1st, 15" wheels are a huge constraint. 2nd, NASCARS weigh 3500+- pounds, are lightly sprung, and do not have a lot of downforce. Some Japanese competitors will be in NASCAR soon, but in their own 'new' league.
Originally Posted by AznIceRckt
As far as everyone talking about diameter... width is just as important. NASCARs run tiny brakes (diameter wise) to fit under 15" wheels. They are quite wide though.
QUOTE]
Nascars is the short cut for NASTY CARS. Why do they even race if all car looks the same.
By the way, if you love american cars so much, why are you driving a japanese car? To me, american cars are just nasty and poor craftmanship
QUOTE]
Nascars is the short cut for NASTY CARS. Why do they even race if all car looks the same.
By the way, if you love american cars so much, why are you driving a japanese car? To me, american cars are just nasty and poor craftmanship
I've actually read that NASCAR brakes are incredibly hard to design. 1st, 15" wheels are a huge constraint. 2nd, NASCARS weigh 3500+- pounds, are lightly sprung, and do not have a lot of downforce. Some Japanese competitors will be in NASCAR soon, but in their own 'new' league.
09-24-2005 | 01:22 PM
#37
Originally Posted by love_350z
Nascars is the short cut for NASTY CARS.
09-25-2005 | 04:14 PM
#38
Originally Posted by love_350z
Please go to WWW.BREMBO.COM to read about their Gran Turismo Big Brake Kit.
This braking system originates from the Racing components, consisting of a ventilated, integral or composite disc, available drilled or slotted, 4 and 8 piston aluminium calipers, a complete set of high performance brake pads, metal braid tubes and high quality small parts.
)
09-25-2005 | 06:08 PM
#39
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Originally Posted by Landbarger
I looked and found this:
Maybe I'm not finding what you're talking about, but what this tells me is that they incorporate some of the technology they use for their real competitive brake systems into ours. I don't see Brembo offering a BBK consisting of carbon rotors and calipers made from berylium or lithium alloys. Why? I don't know that Zs are going to need them, but my point remains, Brembo develops their BBKs and race brakes seperately, Stoptech develops one set/levelof brake, and we get to capitalize on the exact technology they use on the track. BTW, what new series is NASCAR going to make for imports (or are we going to see a Nextel Cup Hyundai Sonata? )
Maybe I'm not finding what you're talking about, but what this tells me is that they incorporate some of the technology they use for their real competitive brake systems into ours. I don't see Brembo offering a BBK consisting of carbon rotors and calipers made from berylium or lithium alloys. Why? I don't know that Zs are going to need them, but my point remains, Brembo develops their BBKs and race brakes seperately, Stoptech develops one set/levelof brake, and we get to capitalize on the exact technology they use on the track. BTW, what new series is NASCAR going to make for imports (or are we going to see a Nextel Cup Hyundai Sonata?
)You talk to an average car guy, he would know what brembo is but not Stoptech. I wonder why?
You have to be good in race track in order to be good on the street. They call it "track proven, street use".
Would you like to use Italian Made or Taiwanese made or even American Made?
09-25-2005 | 08:57 PM
#40
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From: san diego, ca- daytona beach,
I have stock brakes non brembos on my 03 touring z
I wanted to upgraded cause people make fun of me for not having brembos!
are the non brembos good? should i just change pads and rotors to make them look better? how much are the factory brembo calipers? im confused what should I do?
keep the stock ones or up grade to brembo stocks on rear in upgraded fronts!! im lost I just dont want to be made fun of by the way I dont want to spend more than 3k som eim just screwed!!!!!!!! help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I wanted to upgraded cause people make fun of me for not having brembos!
are the non brembos good? should i just change pads and rotors to make them look better? how much are the factory brembo calipers? im confused what should I do?
keep the stock ones or up grade to brembo stocks on rear in upgraded fronts!! im lost I just dont want to be made fun of by the way I dont want to spend more than 3k som eim just screwed!!!!!!!! help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!