$4000 for Suspension, Whats Next
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$4000 for Suspension, Whats Next
I have 4gs for suspension but I do not want a rough ride. I want a comfortable ride but without the noise. If I decide to take it to the track I want to be able to feel comfortable with it. I read about all the suspensions on this forum, but what can I get for this price. Cambers, coilovers, springs, shocks, and combiination will do.
wilric
wilric
which ever you pick, try to get one with front camber adjustments, usually found on coilover setups. You'll save money by killing two birds with one stone since there is not stock adjustments for front camber.
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Originally Posted by plastiketa
which ever you pick, try to get one with front camber adjustments, usually found on coilover setups. You'll save money by killing two birds with one stone since there is not stock adjustments for front camber.
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First - you have to decided what you are willing to give up. If you want a good ride with no noise - stay with stock!
If you are willing to sacrafice some noise then add some A-Arms, Camber arms/traction bars, and some sways. Also, Urathane bushings and/or metal bearings will be noisier than stock.
Now if you are willing to sacrafice a little bit more on the noise, add coilovers.
First choose your camber kit (a double wishbone suspension doesn't allow camber adjustement with the coilover). I have only heard bad things about the Stillen. I think that new SPC looks like it could be the sh*t-yet it isn't out yet, or go with the tried and true 350evo.
As for rear camber arms/traction bars - they are all pretty similar here, so go with a good name that is inexpensive - like Kinetix.
As for sways, most people have had great success with Hotchkis and 350evo. I went with Hotchkis since it is lighter.
As for coilovers, there are a lot to choose from here. But, from your write up, go with the Tein Flex with EDFC. This one will give you on board dampening adjustment so you can find your perfect ride comfort while you are driving.
Just be warned that once you start adding this stuff, you got to play with it to get it tuned perfect for your driving style. I find this is fun, yet others think it is a pain in the a@@.
But, don't take my word for it - there are plenty of posts on this forum for you to read from, with good information from good people.
If you are willing to sacrafice some noise then add some A-Arms, Camber arms/traction bars, and some sways. Also, Urathane bushings and/or metal bearings will be noisier than stock.
Now if you are willing to sacrafice a little bit more on the noise, add coilovers.
First choose your camber kit (a double wishbone suspension doesn't allow camber adjustement with the coilover). I have only heard bad things about the Stillen. I think that new SPC looks like it could be the sh*t-yet it isn't out yet, or go with the tried and true 350evo.
As for rear camber arms/traction bars - they are all pretty similar here, so go with a good name that is inexpensive - like Kinetix.
As for sways, most people have had great success with Hotchkis and 350evo. I went with Hotchkis since it is lighter.
As for coilovers, there are a lot to choose from here. But, from your write up, go with the Tein Flex with EDFC. This one will give you on board dampening adjustment so you can find your perfect ride comfort while you are driving.
Just be warned that once you start adding this stuff, you got to play with it to get it tuned perfect for your driving style. I find this is fun, yet others think it is a pain in the a@@.
But, don't take my word for it - there are plenty of posts on this forum for you to read from, with good information from good people.
I know we can split hairs and say, well ok define what a rough ride quality is?
But and it's a big BUT, when someone ask's that or even brings it up, their are two rules we should universaly employ. Make no recommendation that increases oem spring rates more then 100% and no recommendation that has known owner review's about harshness. The Flex setup strikes out on both counts (so does the Jic Flta-2) And even when looking at system's that have 10Kg spring rates or lower, it's a good idea to look into what type of upper mount system is being used, no isolation between spring and body makes for impact harshness and excess noise especially over tar strips or seams in concrete (though to be honest I have discovered a simple mod to surpress it, someone else may still hate what's left over).
Tein Flex (twin tube construction, adjustable dampners
Full-length adjustment and height adjustment for separate setting of the height and spring preload
Spring rates 672/672
Stiffer then oem by F+114% R+98
Side Note: Extremely high spring rates mean even when the adjustable damping is set as low as possible, you may not find ride quality happiness, several reports of this setups harshness exist Yet a few owner comment’s of a “like stock ride quality” also exist. However given the fact that they use a spring stiffness that’s over 100% stiffer then oem, if ride quality is of concern, either hitch a ride in a car equipped with them or make a different choice. In addition, several review’s have been done by people actually having the original more softly sprung Tein Flex coilovers do not take their comments to mean the same as the one using the current product, the original product specs are listed below under Tein Flex JDM.
Tein Flex JDM specs (can be special ordered est 10-12 weeks delivery)
Full-length adjustment and height adjustment for separate setting of the height and spring preload
Spring rates 560/560
Stiffer then oem by F+78% R+64%
Side Note: This is the original specs first offered in the U.S. with the Flex, shortly after it’s introduction the specs changed to those listed further above (672/672)
But and it's a big BUT, when someone ask's that or even brings it up, their are two rules we should universaly employ. Make no recommendation that increases oem spring rates more then 100% and no recommendation that has known owner review's about harshness. The Flex setup strikes out on both counts (so does the Jic Flta-2) And even when looking at system's that have 10Kg spring rates or lower, it's a good idea to look into what type of upper mount system is being used, no isolation between spring and body makes for impact harshness and excess noise especially over tar strips or seams in concrete (though to be honest I have discovered a simple mod to surpress it, someone else may still hate what's left over).
Tein Flex (twin tube construction, adjustable dampners
Full-length adjustment and height adjustment for separate setting of the height and spring preload
Spring rates 672/672
Stiffer then oem by F+114% R+98
Side Note: Extremely high spring rates mean even when the adjustable damping is set as low as possible, you may not find ride quality happiness, several reports of this setups harshness exist Yet a few owner comment’s of a “like stock ride quality” also exist. However given the fact that they use a spring stiffness that’s over 100% stiffer then oem, if ride quality is of concern, either hitch a ride in a car equipped with them or make a different choice. In addition, several review’s have been done by people actually having the original more softly sprung Tein Flex coilovers do not take their comments to mean the same as the one using the current product, the original product specs are listed below under Tein Flex JDM.
Tein Flex JDM specs (can be special ordered est 10-12 weeks delivery)
Full-length adjustment and height adjustment for separate setting of the height and spring preload
Spring rates 560/560
Stiffer then oem by F+78% R+64%
Side Note: This is the original specs first offered in the U.S. with the Flex, shortly after it’s introduction the specs changed to those listed further above (672/672)
Originally Posted by wilric44
I have 4gs for suspension but I do not want a rough ride. I want a comfortable ride but without the noise. If I decide to take it to the track I want to be able to feel comfortable with it. I read about all the suspensions on this forum, but what can I get for this price. Cambers, coilovers, springs, shocks, and combiination will do.
wilric
wilric
It's tempting given your healthy dollar limit to go wild and recommend something rare or exotic. First thing that come's to my mind it to see if Racecomp finished the R&D on the Moton Club Sport shocks. http://www.350zmotoring.com/forums/s...ighlight=moton.
However, you should be able to find what your looking for without spending all of your budgeted $4k, though the Zeal coilover's ain't cheap.
HKS RS coilover
or
Zeal
http://endlessusa.com/products/produ...255&cid=3&pg=1
EVO350 front camber arms (supply,...supply,...supply the ole can you actually get them question)
SPC rear camber arms and elongated toe cam bolts.
I'd look into the the SPL arm's before I'd opt for the Stillen front arms.
http://www.splparts.com/Parts/Z33/Su...nk/default.asp
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you're not gonna like the ride of the HKS and others. Those are race coilovers. Don't be fooled.
This is what I'll suggest:
Nismo coilovers
SPC rear camber arms and toe bolts
Cusco front A arms
Nismo sway bars
This setup won't break your budget, and tuned properly can put you EASILY over a g on the skidpad. Not only that, the nismo DOES ride better than stock. Honestly, how much do you know about suspension and if you had adjustable suspension, how often would you really screw with the height and dampening? probably not much.
Another thing. With the nismo suspension, you really don't have to drive the car like it's lowered. With pretty much all the others, unless you ride at max height, you do.
This is what I'll suggest:
Nismo coilovers
SPC rear camber arms and toe bolts
Cusco front A arms
Nismo sway bars
This setup won't break your budget, and tuned properly can put you EASILY over a g on the skidpad. Not only that, the nismo DOES ride better than stock. Honestly, how much do you know about suspension and if you had adjustable suspension, how often would you really screw with the height and dampening? probably not much.
Another thing. With the nismo suspension, you really don't have to drive the car like it's lowered. With pretty much all the others, unless you ride at max height, you do.
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This is some good information. I have bouth the stillen sway bar thus far. I almost bought the complete stillen cambers front and rear. Will the JICs work well without cambers. Nismo is a choice of mine but I do want to lower the car a bit. I guess I will have to wait to final decision. Staying wiith stock is not an option. Besides with a supercharger High FLow CATS and exhaust I do think I will hear to much spring noise now that I think about it.
This is my order of choices, none decsions on cambers
1. Blistein DSS 9
2. Tein Flex
3. Jic FLA2
4. Nismo
5. HKS
This is my order of choices, none decsions on cambers
1. Blistein DSS 9
2. Tein Flex
3. Jic FLA2
4. Nismo
5. HKS
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From: TX
also save some money after you get it installed and have the car aligned and cornor balanced by a shop that has a good reputation. It seems that alot of the performance shops that work with slightly higher end cars, porsche, ect. do this service and know how to correctly setup a cars suspension... When you do this how ever, let them know your primary goals, if this is going to be a street car, the suspension settings will be different than if you're setting it up for road racing ect. If you do lots of racing you'll eventually learn how to adjust the suspension to best fit the track, and tire choice from event to event...
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Originally Posted by chimmike
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say you're not gonna like the ride of the HKS and others. Those are race coilovers. Don't be fooled.
This is what I'll suggest:
Nismo coilovers
SPC rear camber arms and toe bolts
Cusco front A arms
Nismo sway bars
This setup won't break your budget, and tuned properly can put you EASILY over a g on the skidpad. Not only that, the nismo DOES ride better than stock. Honestly, how much do you know about suspension and if you had adjustable suspension, how often would you really screw with the height and dampening? probably not much.
Another thing. With the nismo suspension, you really don't have to drive the car like it's lowered. With pretty much all the others, unless you ride at max height, you do.
This is what I'll suggest:
Nismo coilovers
SPC rear camber arms and toe bolts
Cusco front A arms
Nismo sway bars
This setup won't break your budget, and tuned properly can put you EASILY over a g on the skidpad. Not only that, the nismo DOES ride better than stock. Honestly, how much do you know about suspension and if you had adjustable suspension, how often would you really screw with the height and dampening? probably not much.
Another thing. With the nismo suspension, you really don't have to drive the car like it's lowered. With pretty much all the others, unless you ride at max height, you do.
What should be the first installment, Rims or suspension? Trying to make a decision which to install first.
In the 3 1/2 years I had my Z, I drove probably 7-8 different suspension setups on various Z's on the street, autoX, and track. If I were to buy another Z tomorrow and wanted to spend a $4000 budget, I would go with the following. This setup will be a good all-around performer on the street and track, give good ride quality, won't need to be constantly tinkered with, and will be easy to drive and control:
1. Nismo S-Tune suspension- Not super high spring rates...so great ride quality, soaks up bumps on track, properly valved shocks to match the springs it comes with. Ride height will remain reasonable for the street. $1200
2. 350evo swaybars- $600 (set them middle / middle to begin with)
3. Adjustable upper control arms- $750 (I like the Unitech kind if you can find them) Set the front camber to -2.7 or -2.8, and the rear to -2.1 or -2.2...leave that setting for the street and track.
4. 17x9 inch Enkei RPO2J or RPF1 wheels (front and rear, so you can run a range of 245-275 tires, depending on whether you want understeer or oversteer), with Toyo RA1 tires (255 front, 275 rear to start with) $1400 Wheels and tires are the connection to the road/track, and should not be overlooked in the equation. Light, strong wheels...sticky tires that last a long time, and you can get away with driving them to and from events, and on the streets if you like.
Total: $3950
I think you would be VERY hard pressed to come up with a superior setup for the money. The car will be immensely driveable, fast, fun, and low maintanence. Good luck.
ps Don't worry about the Nismo tire width issue...it's just Nissan trying to cover their butts. They don't want people putting equal size tires front and rear, because you can get the car to oversteer...which means customers looping cars and blaming Nissan.
You do however have to make sure the rolling diameters of the tires are very close to stock if you want to use traction control or DSC. http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
1. Nismo S-Tune suspension- Not super high spring rates...so great ride quality, soaks up bumps on track, properly valved shocks to match the springs it comes with. Ride height will remain reasonable for the street. $1200
2. 350evo swaybars- $600 (set them middle / middle to begin with)
3. Adjustable upper control arms- $750 (I like the Unitech kind if you can find them) Set the front camber to -2.7 or -2.8, and the rear to -2.1 or -2.2...leave that setting for the street and track.
4. 17x9 inch Enkei RPO2J or RPF1 wheels (front and rear, so you can run a range of 245-275 tires, depending on whether you want understeer or oversteer), with Toyo RA1 tires (255 front, 275 rear to start with) $1400 Wheels and tires are the connection to the road/track, and should not be overlooked in the equation. Light, strong wheels...sticky tires that last a long time, and you can get away with driving them to and from events, and on the streets if you like.
Total: $3950
I think you would be VERY hard pressed to come up with a superior setup for the money. The car will be immensely driveable, fast, fun, and low maintanence. Good luck.
ps Don't worry about the Nismo tire width issue...it's just Nissan trying to cover their butts. They don't want people putting equal size tires front and rear, because you can get the car to oversteer...which means customers looping cars and blaming Nissan.
You do however have to make sure the rolling diameters of the tires are very close to stock if you want to use traction control or DSC. http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
Last edited by J Ritt; May 19, 2006 at 08:23 AM.
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Originally Posted by J Ritt
4. 17x9 inch Enkei RPO2J or RPF1 wheels (front and rear, so you can run a range of 245-275 tires, depending on whether you want understeer or oversteer), with Toyo RA1 tires (255 front, 275 rear to start with) $1400 Wheels and tires are the connection to the road/track, and should not be overlooked in the equation. Light, strong wheels...sticky tires that last a long time, and you can get away with driving them to and from events, and on the streets if you like.
RA1 are DOT approved R-compound tires, yes they last a long time for R-Compound tires and are great for a road track. Yet, they will not last but 6,000 miles on the street (quote from Toyo). Plus, you have to get them hot to make them stick, not really great for the steet. And want to see you run them in the rain.
Okay...they won't get a ton of miles on the street...fair enough, they don't wear like iron. 
They are great to drive to and from the track though. I've driven in the rain on them...it's not the best, but it's doable if you're careful.
As for sticking cold...even cold they have more grip than the average street tire. We used to run autoX on RA1's, and times were faster on the first 45 second run than they were on street tires. When I say cold, I'm talking summer...not talking freezing temps. I would hope nobody's silly enough to run these tires on the street in winter. I guess I'm stuck in the SoCal mindset.
If you want a true street/track tire, get the Falken Azenis 615. They are a fantastic bang for the buck.
They are great to drive to and from the track though. I've driven in the rain on them...it's not the best, but it's doable if you're careful.As for sticking cold...even cold they have more grip than the average street tire. We used to run autoX on RA1's, and times were faster on the first 45 second run than they were on street tires. When I say cold, I'm talking summer...not talking freezing temps. I would hope nobody's silly enough to run these tires on the street in winter. I guess I'm stuck in the SoCal mindset.
If you want a true street/track tire, get the Falken Azenis 615. They are a fantastic bang for the buck.
Great thread. Learning a lot. As far as the Nismo Suspension how far can it be lowered. I'm shooting for at least the equivalent of s0tech springs when i get my susp.
Sorry if I'm semi-jacking the thread
Sorry if I'm semi-jacking the thread
