FYI-New 350Z's at $3k to $4K Off MSRP
02-21-2003, 08:40 AM
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FYI-New 350Z's at $3k to $4K Off MSRP
FYI:
Today, I was browsing AutoTrader.com and noticed that Exton Nissan, Exton, PA 19341, is advertising 9 or 10 new 350Z's at $3,000. to $4,000. off msrp.
I don't know anything about the dealership. I'm just tired of the accepted dogma, on this forum, that we have to pay around msrp. I didn't nor did many others.
Today, I was browsing AutoTrader.com and noticed that Exton Nissan, Exton, PA 19341, is advertising 9 or 10 new 350Z's at $3,000. to $4,000. off msrp.
I don't know anything about the dealership. I'm just tired of the accepted dogma, on this forum, that we have to pay around msrp. I didn't nor did many others.
02-21-2003, 09:37 AM
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True; but not under dealer cost, when you factor in the 3% holdback.
The dealership is near Philadelphia, which just had a major snowfall. Maybe, it wants to move cars that are sitting on the lot, costing the dealership $/ floorplan.
In any event, our discussion is academic; unless we were currently in the market to buy a 350Z. However, I think the information will be helpful to those who are buying now.
The dealership is near Philadelphia, which just had a major snowfall. Maybe, it wants to move cars that are sitting on the lot, costing the dealership $/ floorplan.
In any event, our discussion is academic; unless we were currently in the market to buy a 350Z. However, I think the information will be helpful to those who are buying now.
02-21-2003, 12:00 PM
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Go to www.autotrader.com and search under new cars/nissan/350z w/in 200 miles of your zip code and you will see the advertised prices to which I referred.
You can find the dealer's website at nissanusa.com; but, the selling prices aren't listed.
Good luck!
You can find the dealer's website at nissanusa.com; but, the selling prices aren't listed.
Good luck!
02-21-2003, 12:23 PM
#6
Originally posted by walc
True; but not under dealer cost, when you factor in the 3% holdback.
The dealership is near Philadelphia, which just had a major snowfall. Maybe, it wants to move cars that are sitting on the lot, costing the dealership $/ floorplan.
In any event, our discussion is academic; unless we were currently in the market to buy a 350Z. However, I think the information will be helpful to those who are buying now.
True; but not under dealer cost, when you factor in the 3% holdback.
The dealership is near Philadelphia, which just had a major snowfall. Maybe, it wants to move cars that are sitting on the lot, costing the dealership $/ floorplan.
In any event, our discussion is academic; unless we were currently in the market to buy a 350Z. However, I think the information will be helpful to those who are buying now.
I know b/c every car I buy from our dealer (my family owns some dealers) I get the holdback as well as the invoice price, BUT on the Z there is NONE.
02-21-2003, 12:30 PM
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This is complete crap. I just got off the phone with the dealer. He said they did have one for 5k below msrp but it was used and it is already sold.
Last edited by WebToker; 02-21-2003 at 12:33 PM.
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02-21-2003, 12:33 PM
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Did you speak w/the guy listed on Autotrader and refer to the prices listed there?
Here's a link to my reference:
http://www.autotrader.com/findacar/n...earch_type=new
I'm referring to listings by Exton ( PA ) Nissan.
Here's a link to my reference:
http://www.autotrader.com/findacar/n...earch_type=new
I'm referring to listings by Exton ( PA ) Nissan.
Last edited by walc; 02-21-2003 at 12:44 PM.
02-21-2003, 12:36 PM
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Originally posted by rodH
there is NO dealer holdback on this car, they (Nissan) doesn't need to do that on this car and they DON'T.
I know b/c every car I buy from our dealer (my family owns some dealers) I get the holdback as well as the invoice price, BUT on the Z there is NONE.
there is NO dealer holdback on this car, they (Nissan) doesn't need to do that on this car and they DON'T.
I know b/c every car I buy from our dealer (my family owns some dealers) I get the holdback as well as the invoice price, BUT on the Z there is NONE.
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/incent...ack/index.html
plus the fact that myself, and others, have bought below invoice and the dealer certainly isn't going to sell for less then cost ( invoice-holdback ).
02-21-2003, 01:59 PM
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Originally posted by walc
I refer to:
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/incent...ack/index.html
plus the fact that myself, and others, have bought below invoice and the dealer certainly isn't going to sell for less then cost ( invoice-holdback ).
I refer to:
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/incent...ack/index.html
plus the fact that myself, and others, have bought below invoice and the dealer certainly isn't going to sell for less then cost ( invoice-holdback ).
02-21-2003, 02:21 PM
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Originally posted by breakerboy
..There is no dealer holdback on the 350z
..There is no dealer holdback on the 350z
Anything we hear from SoCal, about pricing, is questionable. However, it would benefit everyone, who is in the market, to resolve the issue.
BTW, here are 2 more references re 3% on Nissan:
http://www.car-prices-costs.com/2003-Nissan-350Z.html
which gives the exact $ amount on the 350z
and
http://www.safecarguide.com/gui/neg/holdback.htm
Last edited by walc; 02-21-2003 at 02:42 PM.
02-21-2003, 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by zeroday
I live down the street from this dealership. It's not true at all. Spoke to a bunch of people there.
I live down the street from this dealership. It's not true at all. Spoke to a bunch of people there.
I should have known. As I said, at the outset, I have no knowledge of Exton Nissan. Thanks, zeroday, for resolving that issue.
In any event, I bought from Kimberly Spencer, at Hertrich Nissan, Dover, DE, ( 302-678-4553 ), at an excellent price-$4k under msrp on the gm's demo w/2200 miles on it. They also give very good deals on brand-new 350z's.
Last edited by walc; 02-21-2003 at 03:03 PM.
02-21-2003, 03:39 PM
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It's funny that you type with such a condescending attitude bragging about how you are
but you fail to mention that you bought the DEALER DEMO! Of course you got well under MSRP, you just bought the most dogged out car at the dealership....oh wait, they are going to take the best of care of their "demo."
In all reality, there are very few places around the nation that are going to give you any significant discount on the car, and for invoice? I think not.
just tired of the accepted dogma, on this forum, that we have to pay around msrp. I didn't nor did many others.
In all reality, there are very few places around the nation that are going to give you any significant discount on the car, and for invoice? I think not.
02-21-2003, 03:50 PM
#15
Originally posted by walc
Seriously, do you have any authority for that proposition? I mean, other, than what you have been told by a SoCal Nissan salesperson.
Anything we hear from SoCal, about pricing, is questionable. However, it would benefit everyone, who is in the market, to resolve the issue.
BTW, here are 2 more references re 3% on Nissan:
http://www.car-prices-costs.com/2003-Nissan-350Z.html
which gives the exact $ amount on the 350z
and
http://www.safecarguide.com/gui/neg/holdback.htm
Seriously, do you have any authority for that proposition? I mean, other, than what you have been told by a SoCal Nissan salesperson.
Anything we hear from SoCal, about pricing, is questionable. However, it would benefit everyone, who is in the market, to resolve the issue.
BTW, here are 2 more references re 3% on Nissan:
http://www.car-prices-costs.com/2003-Nissan-350Z.html
which gives the exact $ amount on the 350z
and
http://www.safecarguide.com/gui/neg/holdback.htm
btw, I did get a HOldback for my wifes Jetta that we bought, so they know exactly what it is and how to deal with it, with family members (if there is one there)
02-21-2003, 03:53 PM
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if someone's charging you holdback on a 350z, you're getting ripped.. manufacturer pays the interest on the cash that was used to build a certain car which is sitting at the dealers. However, after 3 months, manufacturer will not pay, then it's the dealers turn, cos it's the dealer that couldn't sell the car.
So, if a car hasn't been sitting at the dealers for at least 3 months, there's no holdback!
So, if a car hasn't been sitting at the dealers for at least 3 months, there's no holdback!
02-21-2003, 03:54 PM
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Originally posted by superman78
It's funny that you type with such a condescending attitude bragging about how you are
but you fail to mention that you bought the DEALER DEMO! Of course you got well under MSRP, you just bought the most dogged out car at the dealership....oh wait, they are going to take the best of care of their "demo."
In all reality, there are very few places around the nation that are going to give you any significant discount on the car, and for invoice? I think not.
It's funny that you type with such a condescending attitude bragging about how you are
but you fail to mention that you bought the DEALER DEMO! Of course you got well under MSRP, you just bought the most dogged out car at the dealership....oh wait, they are going to take the best of care of their "demo."
In all reality, there are very few places around the nation that are going to give you any significant discount on the car, and for invoice? I think not.
02-21-2003, 03:56 PM
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from edmunds.com
Many consumers don't understand what the dealer holdback is, what it is used for and what the holdback's role is in the deal-making process. Let's try to clear up some of the confusion.
Dealer holdback is a percentage of either the MSRP or invoice price of a new vehicle that is paid to the dealer by the manufacturer to assist with the dealership's financing of the vehicle. The holdback itself can't really be used as a negotiating chip. However, knowing about it might help you get a better deal on a new car. How? Well, first, here's a little background:
The total invoice cost of the car is payable by the dealership to the manufacturer when the vehicle is ordered, not when it is sold. Since car dealerships must have an inventory on hand through which the consumer can browse and ultimately select a vehicle, the dealership must borrow money to pay for that inventory. The manufacturer pays for financing and maintenance for the first 90 days the vehicle is on the lot in the form of a quarterly check called a holdback. After 90 days, the dealership has to dip into its own pocket, and into its own profit, to finance the car. Fortunately for dealers, most cars don't stay on the lot for three full months.
This holdback amount is "invisible" to the consumer because it does not appear as an itemized fee on the window sticker. If the car sells within 90 days of arrival on the dealer's lot, the dealer is guaranteed a profit even if the vehicle is sold to you at cost. Because of the holdback, the dealer can advertise a car at $1 over invoice and still make hundreds of dollars on the sale.
For example, let's say you're interested in a Ford with a Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) of $20,500, including optional equipment and destination charge. Dealer invoice on this hypothetical Ford is $18,000. The cost of the car includes a dealer holdback that, in the case of all Ford vehicles, amounts to 3 percent of the total MSRP. (The $500 destination charge should not be included when figuring the holdback.) So, on this particular Ford, the true dealer cost is actually $17,400. Even if the dealer sells you the car for the invoice price, which is unlikely, he would still be making as much as $600 on the deal when his quarterly check arrives. That is profit to the dealer only; the sales staff doesn't make a commission on that amount.
So, if you offered the dealership a nominal profit (3 percent over invoice, in this example) for this Ford, or $18,540 plus the destination charge, the dealer is making as much as $1,140 and you're still getting a good deal by paying $1,460 less than the MSRP. (Remember that this price doesn't include destination or additional fees, tax or license plates.)
However, the true "profit" of holdback money depends on how long the car has been on the lot. If our hypothetical Ford had been sitting there for 45 days before you bought it, the dealer's holdback profit is only half of what it could have been, or only $300, cutting total profit on the deal to $840. At the 90-day mark, holdback profit has disappeared. So, if you buy a car that has just arrived on the lot, the dealership will keep all the holdback. But it's difficult to find out exactly when the car arrived. This is one of the problems of including the holdback into your negotiations. However, if you order a car, the holdback is pure dealer profit — and knowing this should guide you to make a lower offer.
Dealer holdback allows dealers to advertise big sales. Often, ads promise that your new car will cost you just "$1 over/under invoice!" Additionally, the dealer stands to reap further benefits if there is dealer cash offered on the car you are considering. Generally, sale prices stipulate that all rebates and incentives go to the dealer.
Almost all dealerships consider holdback money "sacred" and are unwilling to share any portion of it with the consumer. Don't push the issue. Your best strategy is to avoid mentioning the holdback during negotiations. Mention holdback only if the dealer gives you some song-and-dance about not making any money when you know that isn't true.
So how can you benefit from holdback information? Well, if you are ordering a vehicle, you could tactfully remind the dealer that you know he will be keeping the entire holdback and your offer is lower as a result. For example, if the dealership doesn't have that pretty green color you're interested in, and they can't find it at another dealership in the area, they have to order it directly from the manufacturer. If that's the case, make sure they know that you know about the holdback. If a vehicle is special-ordered, holdback money is pure profit, and you will need to factor this into price negotiations.
Another issue regarding holdback is Ford Motor Company's attempt to boost customer service ratings by offering qualifying dealers a "rebate" on the invoice price. The "rebate" is 1.25 percent of the total invoice, and only Ford dealers who've earned Blue Oval status from the automaker qualify. The company estimates that only 70 percent of Ford retailers will gain Blue Oval certification, so when buying a Ford, take note of where you shop — a better deal might be available at a Blue Oval store. A similar program will be instituted for Lincoln products and dealers, but those that obtain certification will receive 2.5 percent of the total invoice back in the form of a check.
Dealer holdback is a percentage of either the MSRP or invoice price of a new vehicle that is paid to the dealer by the manufacturer to assist with the dealership's financing of the vehicle. The holdback itself can't really be used as a negotiating chip. However, knowing about it might help you get a better deal on a new car. How? Well, first, here's a little background:
The total invoice cost of the car is payable by the dealership to the manufacturer when the vehicle is ordered, not when it is sold. Since car dealerships must have an inventory on hand through which the consumer can browse and ultimately select a vehicle, the dealership must borrow money to pay for that inventory. The manufacturer pays for financing and maintenance for the first 90 days the vehicle is on the lot in the form of a quarterly check called a holdback. After 90 days, the dealership has to dip into its own pocket, and into its own profit, to finance the car. Fortunately for dealers, most cars don't stay on the lot for three full months.
This holdback amount is "invisible" to the consumer because it does not appear as an itemized fee on the window sticker. If the car sells within 90 days of arrival on the dealer's lot, the dealer is guaranteed a profit even if the vehicle is sold to you at cost. Because of the holdback, the dealer can advertise a car at $1 over invoice and still make hundreds of dollars on the sale.
For example, let's say you're interested in a Ford with a Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) of $20,500, including optional equipment and destination charge. Dealer invoice on this hypothetical Ford is $18,000. The cost of the car includes a dealer holdback that, in the case of all Ford vehicles, amounts to 3 percent of the total MSRP. (The $500 destination charge should not be included when figuring the holdback.) So, on this particular Ford, the true dealer cost is actually $17,400. Even if the dealer sells you the car for the invoice price, which is unlikely, he would still be making as much as $600 on the deal when his quarterly check arrives. That is profit to the dealer only; the sales staff doesn't make a commission on that amount.
So, if you offered the dealership a nominal profit (3 percent over invoice, in this example) for this Ford, or $18,540 plus the destination charge, the dealer is making as much as $1,140 and you're still getting a good deal by paying $1,460 less than the MSRP. (Remember that this price doesn't include destination or additional fees, tax or license plates.)
However, the true "profit" of holdback money depends on how long the car has been on the lot. If our hypothetical Ford had been sitting there for 45 days before you bought it, the dealer's holdback profit is only half of what it could have been, or only $300, cutting total profit on the deal to $840. At the 90-day mark, holdback profit has disappeared. So, if you buy a car that has just arrived on the lot, the dealership will keep all the holdback. But it's difficult to find out exactly when the car arrived. This is one of the problems of including the holdback into your negotiations. However, if you order a car, the holdback is pure dealer profit — and knowing this should guide you to make a lower offer.
Dealer holdback allows dealers to advertise big sales. Often, ads promise that your new car will cost you just "$1 over/under invoice!" Additionally, the dealer stands to reap further benefits if there is dealer cash offered on the car you are considering. Generally, sale prices stipulate that all rebates and incentives go to the dealer.
Almost all dealerships consider holdback money "sacred" and are unwilling to share any portion of it with the consumer. Don't push the issue. Your best strategy is to avoid mentioning the holdback during negotiations. Mention holdback only if the dealer gives you some song-and-dance about not making any money when you know that isn't true.
So how can you benefit from holdback information? Well, if you are ordering a vehicle, you could tactfully remind the dealer that you know he will be keeping the entire holdback and your offer is lower as a result. For example, if the dealership doesn't have that pretty green color you're interested in, and they can't find it at another dealership in the area, they have to order it directly from the manufacturer. If that's the case, make sure they know that you know about the holdback. If a vehicle is special-ordered, holdback money is pure profit, and you will need to factor this into price negotiations.
Another issue regarding holdback is Ford Motor Company's attempt to boost customer service ratings by offering qualifying dealers a "rebate" on the invoice price. The "rebate" is 1.25 percent of the total invoice, and only Ford dealers who've earned Blue Oval status from the automaker qualify. The company estimates that only 70 percent of Ford retailers will gain Blue Oval certification, so when buying a Ford, take note of where you shop — a better deal might be available at a Blue Oval store. A similar program will be instituted for Lincoln products and dealers, but those that obtain certification will receive 2.5 percent of the total invoice back in the form of a check.
02-21-2003, 03:57 PM
#19
btw, that caresafe site is wrong on another account. I got a 3% holdback on my wifes jetts, yet they list it as 2%, do you really think the dealer my family owns is NOT ONLY going to FIND me and TRADE another dealer for a car, BUT also PAY me an extra 1% to take it off thier hands?? I didn't think so.
some of these sites are nice to get educated, BUT they are NOT 100% correct 100% of the time for ALL the vehicles.
some of these sites are nice to get educated, BUT they are NOT 100% correct 100% of the time for ALL the vehicles.
02-21-2003, 03:59 PM
#20
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Originally posted by superman78
It's funny that you type with such a condescending attitude bragging about how you are
but you fail to mention that you bought the DEALER DEMO! Of course you got well under MSRP, you just bought the most dogged out car at the dealership....oh wait, they are going to take the best of care of their "demo."
In all reality, there are very few places around the nation that are going to give you any significant discount on the car, and for invoice? I think not.
It's funny that you type with such a condescending attitude bragging about how you are
but you fail to mention that you bought the DEALER DEMO! Of course you got well under MSRP, you just bought the most dogged out car at the dealership....oh wait, they are going to take the best of care of their "demo."
In all reality, there are very few places around the nation that are going to give you any significant discount on the car, and for invoice? I think not.
Many people have bought for close to invoice, as reported on this forum, and they didn't buy demos. Around 10% of 124 reporting ( https://my350z.com/forum/showthread....threadid=19241 )
BTW, do you even have a 350Z or do you just sell them?