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Thinking of a fully built motor w/o FI

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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 05:57 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by lukesnyder
This will give you a idea what the cam gain is going to be. 8HP. http://www.zchickz.com/modbug1.htm
Those are the Nismo R-tuned cams. The Nismo S1 cams(276/256) give around 30 rwhp with tuning. The problem with a fully built NA car is that it becomes less streetable the more you push for power. I have found with very radical cams the car will die sometimes under slow driving conditions. A good computer tune can help out but it still may have problems. Also if you go with high compression you may need to put higher octane fuel. So in my opinion it really isn't worth it for a daily driven car because of the inconvience. For track use I think it definitely is worth it.

Last edited by rednezz; Jul 11, 2005 at 06:05 AM.
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by rednezz
Those are the Nismo R-tuned cams. The Nismo S1 cams(276/256) give around 30 rwhp with tuning. The problem with a fully built NA car is that it becomes less streetable the more you push for power. I have found with very radical cams the car will die sometimes under slow driving conditions. A good computer tune can help out but it still may have problems. Also if you go with high compression you may need to put higher octane fuel. So in my opinion it really isn't worth it for a daily driven car because of the inconvience. For track use I think it definitely is worth it.
Cams and compression play a integral part in how the motor is going to run and react. Heres some technical info on what to be carefull of. 10:1- Used and built as the 9.5:1 engine with more than 220° @ .050 lift cam. So a s1 cam may not be what I am going to get. Probably might have to have one custom with custom grind for this motor.

Thats the reason I want some questions answered before I go ahead and start building this motor. I am going to be running 91. I have to be carefull with compression ratio b/c with a 12 to 1 I need at least 38% nitromethane per volume I would need to run a minimum of 105. motor octane. I would be sure that it wasn't going above 11:1 because that would be cutting it really close even running on 93 as a daily driver. So I am doing my research on what the Squish/CC of the motor will be after head gasket, head work, stoker kit ect ect.

Hopefully Tommy K will email me back today and hopfully already have all this reseached so my lazy *** doesnt have to pull out the calculator tonight

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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 08:31 AM
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I wish I knew the calculations to decide exactly what the perfect cam is for my application (93 oct), I'm basically just judging based on other board members experiences at this point. I have a nice book discussing boost, Maximum Boost by Corky Bell, but haven't found one to answer my NA concerns. What book would you guys recommend to gain some knowledge on NA fundamentals and maybe some engine build-up basics?
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 01:29 PM
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http://www.users.interport.net/s/r/srweiss/winscren.htm
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 02:51 PM
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I guess these are the programmers.
Attached Thumbnails Thinking of a fully built motor w/o FI-big_ears.jpg  
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 05:13 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by ALong
400 at the crank is do-able but expensive, 400rwhp is probably do-able also, but I cant see how it would be cheaper than an off the shelf turbo kit. Dont get me wrong, I prefer the NA route but dont kid yourself that it is going to be cheaper than a turbo kit. The JGTC GT300 350Z's put out around 450hp at the crank and we are talking a $40k-50k motor + $15k in electronics...

The GrandAm Cup racecars put out around 380hp+ at the crank and the motors cost at least $10k to build and use $10-15k in Motec electronics.

You can get a turbo kit installed for what, $8-9k?

Dont want to rain on your parade but you do need to be realistic, there is no way you are going to get the numbers that you want, in the cost range you are looking at unfortunately.
Also keep in mind that those GAC motors require frequent rebuilds.

Oh -- that the JGTC Z does not have a VQ. It's a twin-turboed 300ZX 3.0L.
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Skrill
Also keep in mind that those GAC motors require frequent rebuilds.

Oh -- that the JGTC Z does not have a VQ. It's a twin-turboed 300ZX 3.0L.
yes, it's a VQ

VQ30DETT to be precise

300zx has VG engine, and it never run JGTC that I am aware
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Nano
no, it's a VQ30

VG engine has never run JGTC that I am aware
Right. And that's the JGTC 500 350Z. The JGTC 300 uses a VQ35DE.
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by ReavTek
power numbers with a set of NISMO Spec 1 Cams VQ35DE (276/256) on a Z with a standalone, ITBs, and all the bolt ons?
=fawking beast \
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 06:37 PM
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I am using Nismo S1 cams + nismo VTC units + nismo valve springs + motec + headers + cats + nismo exhaust + pulley and no problem with the street driving problem at all.... pulling out 217rwKW = 295rwHP on the loaded dyno dynamic dyno machine... so I guess 300rwHP is not that far anymore after I finish my intake mod (doing it now)...

cheers,

richie
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Old Jul 11, 2005 | 08:02 PM
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Wow that seems like the same path I want to take. However I can't afford to go all in right now. If you could recommend one mod I could do which owuldn't require additional mods to work (ECU, Valvetrain etc etc) which would it be? I'm thinking of having a set of long tube headers custom made. I want to spend about $2k or so on a mod by the end of the summer.
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Old Jul 12, 2005 | 04:10 AM
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Originally Posted by ReavTek
Wow that seems like the same path I want to take. However I can't afford to go all in right now. If you could recommend one mod I could do which owuldn't require additional mods to work (ECU, Valvetrain etc etc) which would it be? I'm thinking of having a set of long tube headers custom made. I want to spend about $2k or so on a mod by the end of the summer.
Instead of custom making headers ... why not just go with XERD long tube headers. 16whp gain.
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Old Jul 12, 2005 | 06:35 AM
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Someone needs to come up with a LS1 swap kit. The LS1 RX7's out there are amazing and I've seen swaps into Miata's, so it would have to fit under our hood.

-Mark
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Old Jul 12, 2005 | 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Z350Lover
I am using Nismo S1 cams + nismo VTC units + nismo valve springs + motec + headers + cats + nismo exhaust + pulley and no problem with the street driving problem at all.... pulling out 217rwKW = 295rwHP on the loaded dyno dynamic dyno machine... so I guess 300rwHP is not that far anymore after I finish my intake mod (doing it now)...

cheers,

richie
Anybody else think this # is sort of low?? A memeber on this thread from Puerto Rico(forgot his name) reached the 300+ mark with less aggressive camshafts and no standalone.
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Old Jul 12, 2005 | 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Zexy
Anybody else think this # is sort of low?? A memeber on this thread from Puerto Rico(forgot his name) reached the 300+ mark with less aggressive camshafts and no standalone.
He has not reached 300rwhp yet. He was at 295 as well.
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Old Jul 12, 2005 | 04:36 PM
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and I think we cannot compare the dyno number actually... because those tests were done on different dyno machines with different dyno run conditions... just like mine was done on the load dyno instead of the inertia type dyno and as I know... the inertia type dyno's output is around 10% more than the load dyno output (I might be wrong)..

BTW... what is LS1 really? I don't really get it though....

cheers,

richie
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Old Jul 12, 2005 | 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Z350Lover
and I think we cannot compare the dyno number actually... because those tests were done on different dyno machines with different dyno run conditions... just like mine was done on the load dyno instead of the inertia type dyno and as I know... the inertia type dyno's output is around 10% more than the load dyno output (I might be wrong)..

BTW... what is LS1 really? I don't really get it though....

cheers,

richie
LS1 came in Chevrolet Camaros and Pontiac Firebirds. Do a search on Yahoo. 350 c.i., very easy to make power on them.
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Old Jul 12, 2005 | 05:30 PM
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THanks mate!!!

cheers,

richie
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Old Jul 13, 2005 | 05:26 AM
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Alright..... Air intake myth BUSTED officially.... done my intake... and no effect what so ever.... the power stays the same.... and now what.... hahahahha.....

This is what we have done to the intake:

1. 84mm bore diameter intake pipe per Nismo (integrated MAF sensor)
2. Larger bell mouth in the standard intake (go down to 84mm at the end)
3. Modify air box
4. Dyno tune..

Same power... (lost 1 rwKW... at the top and a few at the middle range).. since different dyno outputs on different days cannot really be compared... but those are considered as the same power (only 1rwKW diff at the top end, might due to the colder weather)... no gain or loss...

Pics are here... enjoy them!

cheers,

richie
Attached Thumbnails Thinking of a fully built motor w/o FI-1.jpg   Thinking of a fully built motor w/o FI-2.jpg   Thinking of a fully built motor w/o FI-3.jpg  

Last edited by Z350Lover; Jul 13, 2005 at 05:28 AM.
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Old Jul 13, 2005 | 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Z350Lover
Alright..... Air intake myth BUSTED officially.... done my intake... and no effect what so ever.... the power stays the same.... and now what.... hahahahha.....

This is what we have done to the intake:

1. 84mm bore diameter intake pipe per Nismo (integrated MAF sensor)
2. Larger bell mouth in the standard intake (go down to 84mm at the end)
3. Modify air box
4. Dyno tune..

Same power... (lost 1 rwKW... at the top and a few at the middle range).. since different dyno outputs on different days cannot really be compared... but those are considered as the same power (only 1rwKW diff at the top end, might due to the colder weather)... no gain or loss...

Pics are here... enjoy them!

cheers,

richie
Did you have a bored throttle body also?
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