UR Pulleys don't increase HP, just throttle response... (Big difference) Possibly at the cost of your bearings down the road. A hi flow intake accomplishes the same thing and doesn't harm the car's longevity.

 

WRONG! 90% of pulley failures we see as warranty claims occur from improper bolt torque. eventually the bolt loosens up at the pulley starts smacking the key from side to side until the key in the pulley breaks or wears away to the point that the pulley just spins completely around on the crank.

I guess the laws of physics don't apply here. The lighter weight leads to quicker engine acceleration which leads to quicker movement through the gears which leads to faster times.

As for the dyno numbers we have seen new cars not show gains during the break in period because the computer is being very restrictive.

You seem to be the only anomally disproving the laws of physics.

Shawn Baumgartner
President
Unorthodox Racing

 

The factory ECU has no idea when a car is in 'break in" or not. It adapts to driving conditions the same either way and is usually fully adjusted within 200 - 300 miles of being reset.

Maybe you should let the market decide if the UR Pulley is worth it, and stop trying to ***** it out like it's God's gift... We're smart people here... Well most of us...

 

[QUOTE=Dave B]You think I'm making this stuff up? Early version of the UR UDP.





http://g35driver.com/forums/showthre...n+engine+crankQUOTE]


That pulley failed from improper bolt torque, which is installer error. I'd like to see the full diameter of that pulley, front and rear, it does not look like one of ours because I don't ever remember having the small holes in the back. It's possible we did during one of the early runs as a test to reduce more weight. Oh and if it was our fault why weren't we contacted or did we reject you because of improper installation and you are not fessing up.

Shawn Baumgartner
President
Unorthodox Racing

 

Interesting - FWIW I have about as early of a pulley as you can get on my car - purchased Fall of 2003, and it looks nothing like the one in that picture

 

The shear weight of the crank pulley completely negates it potential effect as a damper. Dual mass flywheels are not engine damper either, they are designed to quiet transmission noise because many manual transmissions are moving to ATF fluid which has almost not quieting capability compared to 70W-90. The clutch has no engine damping effect whatsoever, especially since many newer cars are using solid hub discs.

Shawn Baumgartner
President
Unorthodox Racing

 

Feelings are the same, Shawn. I have no respect for you nor your company. My points about undampened pullies have been stated as is my supporting information and experience. Your company is misleading and taking advantage of those that understand little about automotive engineering principles. We'll let the masses decide what's best for their car, especially those that know better than to believe vendor claims.

FYI, the UR UDP pulley installed on my VQ30 Maxima didn't make an ounce of power on the Dynojet nor netted ANY improvement in 1/4 mile ET/MPH over numerous runs on the same track and with all time corrected to density altitude. 60 foots were always in the upper 2.1s/low 2.2s.

 

Have you worked with Dealers? how about directly with a manufacturer? Probably not. We know as a matter of fact most cars from the late 90's to now had some sort of break in program. The cars run richer to make sure the rings seat and bed properly in the cylinders. It can run from a few thousand to progressive changes all the way to 10-12K.

By the way you are under no obligation to buy it, all I'm doing is perveying the truth and dispelling the myths that perpertuate because of people like you.

Shawn Baumgartner
President
Unorthodox Racing

 

Glad you asked 'Shawn'... Yes I am intimately familiar with the ECU and have run many many Consult II & Cipher logs against it. I also have a dyno-tuned UTEC piggy back ECU, and have been road tuning it myself... I can assure you, there is no 'break in' program on the factory 350Z ECU.

So as you stated above, the UR Pulley does not yield any addition HP gains.

It does yield quicker throttle response at the possible accelerated wear of the bearings. A Hi Flow intake accomplishes the same thing without harming the longevity of the car.

 

This has nothing to do with feelings, its all business, just business. I have a few friends that still believe like you but it does not hurt my friendship with them. You are free to buy what you want and live the way you want. You are not free to perpetuate lies and myths that hurt the livelyhood of others. If you feel so strongly try and sue us with your facts and a judge would laugh at you right to your face. We have all the facts and 10 years of unrefutable proof our facts are correct not to mention corroberating evidence from employees at the OE's.

Within a fair range of HP 60 foot times are a function of driver and nothing else. There could have been something wrong with your car during the testing. Did you do the test right at the time install? It can take up to 7 days for the computer the learn the product.

What year was your Maxima?

Shawn Baumgartner
President
Unorthodox Racing

 

I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you about something I know is true, I saw and herd with my own eyes and is backed up by Nissan and the techs we've worked with.

Do you work for a newspaper or TV show? You make up your own conclusion for the things I said. HP is created and measureable on an acceleration based dyno. So the pulley does make HP in that sense. In the end all I care about as an enthusiast is that my car is quicker and it is the case in every car we makes pulleys for.

Shawn Baumgartner
President
Unorthodox Racing

 

Ever hear of a thing called moment of inertia or torque multiplication? Both are factors in determining the acceleration potential of a car, especially from a rest. Reducing rotational mass from the engine results in quicker throttle response, especially when out of gear, but from a rest, the reduced inertia can make for motor that is far more prone to bogging off the line and generally much harder to launch. Drag racers wouldn't be caught dead putting lightened flywheels in their cars because it will make the car far more inconsistent on a launch and slower in the 60 foot. Like I said before, the advantages for lightened rotational mass (specifically flywheels) is to make for easier rev-matching on a road course where dead stop acceleration is not s cruical.

Taking away mass from the crank, flywheel, or pulley make it feel like you've removed weight from car; however, upon each upshift, the gains become less and less and by the time a 1:1 ratio is reached, the gain is basically nill. Yes, the largest gain will be in 1st gear; however VERY little time is spent accelerating in this gear during a race. Same goes for 2nd gear. Doing the calculations, typically a 20% lightened flywheel often results in a theoretical removal of about 200-250lbs from the car. 2nd gear is generally 60% of that number, 3rd about 20%, and 4th about 5%. This is dependant on the overall gear ratio of each gear. When you factor the weight of the car (3000-3200lbs) and the loss of moment of inertia on the launch, you get a car that's no quicker in the 1/4 mile. I could post the equation, but it would be over most everyone's heads.

 

Dave B= PWND in a very big way!

 

1996 Maxima 5MT
Track: Kansas City International Raceway
Total runs: 255
Runs before UDP: 120 (20 different track days over 2 years)
Runs with UDP: 43 (5 different track days over 1 year)
Runs with UDP removed, no other changes to the car: 92 (12 different track days over 2 years)

Dyno Shop: MC Racing, Merriam, KS
Dyno prior to UDP: 205whp/195wtq
Dyno with UDP: 204whp/193wtq

 

By Shawn?

 

Honestly what I know of cars from tuning and building.

No offense, but I did not know the ECU has a way to adjust for a lighter pulley. I cant fathom that one. Doesnt change air/fuel mixture, shouldnt change timing or anything of the such.

The ECU itself I have never heard of a break in program. Cars do not need to run rich to break in , nor for the rings to seat. Running rich when trying to seat rings can cause washing out of the rings. I dont buy that one either.

Dont get me wrong, computers are smart, but I do not see a manufacturer programming logic into it to tell the car to do something different after soo many miles.
I could be wrong as I am no professional, but i have tinkered with my fair share of cars with high HP and low HP... . All of which had stock pulleys lol

Another thing I learned from an oldshool hot rod guy. Stick with a stock flywheel in a low displacement car. The extra inertia from the heavier flywheel helps keep the revs up. I had this confirmed when selling my Type R. The guy sold a 10sec civic to buy my R. He said my R even set to low boost, about 450whp or so was more responsive then his civic ever was due to the stock flywheel.

 

Just my 2 cents, but when faced with these kinds of questions I find that Occam's Razor usually applies. It appears as though we have 2 possabilites:

1. This "elastomer ring" is a super clever device that against all notions of common sense acts to balance a large spinning mass.

2. This "elastomer ring" is just a little piece of rubber put there to reduce drivetrain noise.

 

it helps keep torque from falling off in the upper rpms - to a point

a VQ is not a small displacement motor as far as 6 cylinders go

 

What?

The torque curve (ie power curve or powerband) is dictated by power characteristics of the motor, specifically displacement and the flow characteristics of the heads, intake manifold, and exhaust. A lightened flywheel will nothing to keep the torque up in the upper rpms.

 

Maybe the explanation might sound odd, but he is on the right track. I cannot explain it fully how it was explained to me, but it makes a ton of sense and trying from stock to lightweight in some other cars, it proved to be true.
As for the Z, it wasnt really related, but kind of similar topic while on lightweight pullies. Sorry I got OT a bit.